What if India did not acquire the Gorshkov?

In the late '90 to mid '00 USN was actively trying to give a second life to their first generation supercarriers, among the proposals I remember: to take them back on service as training carriers; after Enduring Freedom to give them to some European navy to form the core of a unified EU or NATO naval aviation branch; above all to sell one to Brazil. In retrospect selling to the relatively large and experienced Indian navy seems a much more realistic proposition than giving them to the smaller and less ambitious Brazilian navy, not to mention the the purely academical idea of a common European power projection asset.
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All of those, you mean ? 8 supercarriers up for grab... ! Which ones were in poor shapes, and which ones were still "fresh" ?

CV-59 Forrestal
CV-60 Saratoga
CV-61 Ranger
CV-62 Independence
CV-63 Kitty Hawk
CV-64 Constellation
CV-66 America
CV-67 John F. Kennedy
 
Kitty Hawk was pushed until she was 48 years old, so she's out immediately. America and Ranger never received SLEPs, and thus would likely be in pretty poor condition. John F. Kennedy wasn't much better, not receiving an SLEP either and being done no favors by being converted into a conventional carrier from nuclear during construction.

That leaves Constellation, Independence, Forrestal, and Saratoga, who were 40, 39, 38, and 38 years old on decommissioning.
 
CV12Hornet said:
John F. Kennedy wasn't much better, not receiving an SLEP either and being done no favors by being converted into a conventional carrier from nuclear during construction.
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That bit is a load of BS someone sold you.

CVA-67 JFK was a modified version of CVA-66 America - which was the one that had originally been ordered as a follow-on CVN to the CVN-65 Enterprise design.

However, before early fabrication work had even started, CVN-66 America's contract was cancelled, and she was re-ordered as a repeat Kitty Hawk class CVA.

There HAD been a proposal for JFK to be nuclear-powered under a competing different design, but when both were presented to Congress as a "pick one", Congress chose the CVA design, and the CVN design was dropped*.


* CVN-65 had 8 reactors, CVN-67 was proposed for 4 reactors, Nimitz and later had 2 reactors.
 
Archibald said:
All of those, you mean ? 8 supercarriers up for grab... ! Which ones were in poor shapes, and which ones were still "fresh" ?

CV-59 Forrestal
CV-60 Saratoga
CV-61 Ranger
CV-62 Independence
CV-63 Kitty Hawk
CV-64 Constellation
CV-66 America
CV-67 John F. Kennedy
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CV-59 Forrestal............................ commissioned 1 Oct 55; SLEP 1/83-5/85; decommissioned 11 Sept 93 in the middle of a refit for permanent training carrier duties. Quickly stripped for parts for her sister ships and new construction* until her 16 June 99 offering for preservation as a museum, placed for disposal in Dec. 2003. Scrapped 2/14-12/15.

CV-60 Saratoga.......................... commissioned 14 Apr 56; SLEP 9/80-10/82; decommissioned 20 Aug 94 and extensively stripped until Aug 98**, when she was placed on donation hold. After several changes of status, placed for disposal Apr 2010. Scrapped 9/14-3/19.

CV-61 Ranger.............................. commissioned 10 Aug 57; decommissioned 10 Jul 93. Least-stripped of the class***, she was placed on donation hold in 2004, then placed for disposal Sept 2012. Scrapped 7/15 - 11/17.

CV-62 Independence................ commissioned 10 Jan 59; SLEP 2/85-6/88; decommissioned 30 Sept 98, and heavily stripped**** to support the active carrier fleet, especially the Kitty Hawk class aircraft carriers. Placed for disposal Mar 2004 and scrapped 5/17 - "early 2019".

CV-63 Kitty Hawk..................... commissioned 29 Apr 61; SLEP 1/88-8/90; decommissioned 12 May 2009 and placed in reserve for potential emergency reactivation. Placed for disposal 25 Oct 2017. Scrapped starting 5/22.

CV-64 Constellation................. commissioned 27 Oct 61; SLEP 6/90-3/93; decommissioned 6 Aug 2003 and immediately placed in unmaintained reserve, and placed for disposal Feb 2008. Scrapped 1/15 - 5/17

CV-66 America.......................... commissioned 23 Jan 65; decommissioned 9 Aug 96 (instead of entering SLEP) and transferred to the reserve fleet, but was considered in very bad condition. Sunk at sea as a target 14 Nay 2005.

CV-67 John F. Kennedy........... commissioned 7 Sept 68; extensive overhaul 94-96; decommissioned 23 Mar 2007. Having been redesignated as a Naval Reserve Force training carrier/emergency fleet carrier in 1995, she was poorly supported by Naval Reserve Force budgets and activities, despite continuing a nearly-normal deployment schedule. In 2001, during a pre-deployment trial, John F. Kennedy was found to be severely deficient in some respects, especially those relating to air group operations; most problematic, two of four aircraft catapults and three of four aircraft elevators were non-functional during inspection, and two of eight boilers would not light. As a result, her captain and two department heads were relieved for cause. She was returned to the active fleet after 11 Sept 2001. She was sold for scrap on 6 Oct 2021.



* 2 30t anchors transferred to CVN-74 Stennis (launched Nov 93), all four propellers (installed new during SLEP) transferred to CVN-75 Truman (launched Sept 96).

** Both anchors transferred to CVN-75 Truman (launched Sept 96).

*** Both anchors transferred to CVN-76 Reagan (launched Mar 2001).

**** Her port anchor and both anchor chains transferred to CVN-78 Bush (launched Oct 2006).
 
royabulgaf said:
IIRC during the 1990-2000 weren't the US and India on the outs?
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Then again bush jr. did offer India one of the conventional super cats during his presidency when it was looking like India was going to back out from the Gorshkov.
 
The Kinnock victory in 1992 returned a Labour Government after Mrs Thatcher's resignation.
One of the issues on the new Defence Secretary's desk was the future of the RN's carrier force and its Sea Harrier aircraft.
Keen to build up Britain's industry after years of neglect and create jobs quickly in marginal constituencies it is decided to modify the existing Invincible class ships and develop an improved version of the Sea Harrier using experience gained with the RAF Harrier GR5.
India indicates that it would be interested in buying one of the three Invincible to modify locally and build the Sea Harrier Mk5 locally. This would allow India to learn lessons to build its own ships.
The MOD were not keen on losing one ship but faced with Health and Education priorities and the end of the Cold War as well as renewed interest in the Commonwealth the deal was soon signed.
 

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