RAF Puma Replacement?

[TomS]

Do the stats on the graph make any sense?

Is the range with 9 troops really just 100km? I've seen a quoted UH-60M combat range of 590km...
And how can you fit 10 extra troops into a cabin only large enough for 11 troops? Even a 9 + 10 case wouldn't fit.

That's Hot-High (6000 feet @95F) where the basic Black Hawk is pretty much out of lift.

See about half way down the page here: https://www.geaviation.com/military/engines/t901-turboshaft-engine

The Black Hawk cabin has always had volume for more than 11 bods --14 is high density and 20 is barely possible (if they're friendly and not carrying packs). Puma certainly has more cabin volume than the S-70, but not as much more as you might think.

 

[RLBH]

I think those comparisons were done during the SKR work.
Of course it's quite odd because the Chinook was nearly acquired under ASR.358 for the ASW role in the mid-60s so presumably back then some naval bod must have been tasked with working out exactly how much hangar space was needed. So it can't have been a secret, probably lost in institutional memory fade...

This was quite a bit more recently than SKR - it was associated with LPH(R), so would presumably have been with one eye on the SABR requirement.

 

[Cordy]

Hood said

Do the stats on the graph make any sense?

Is the range with 9 troops really just 100km? I've seen a quoted UH-60M combat range of 590km...
And how can you fit 10 extra troops into a cabin only large enough for 11 troops? Even a 9 + 10 case wouldn't fit.

Assumptions the UH-60M combat range quote of 590km is with no payload and in higher air density than GE quote based on flying at 6,000 ft at 90 degrees F, would that account for the difference in range of the GE figures for the T700 UH-60M with 9 troops and range of only 100km whereas with T901 261km, you would have thought GE figures accurate as they build both engines, if GE figures correct shows how misleading figures can be compared with actuality.

Would you be able to cram 19 troops in cabin for a short range flight of 55km / 34 miles in extremis, expect figure purely for comparison purposes.

 

[yasotay]

Bell urges UK to wait for ‘next-generation' 525 for NMH

16 FEBRUARY 2022

by Gareth Jennings


A model of the 525 Relentless displayed at the IQPC International Military Helicopter conference in London. Bell is to pitch the platform for the UK's New Medium Helicopter requirement. (Janes/Gareth Jennings)

The UK Ministry of Defence (MoD) should wait for the Bell 525 Relentless so as to field “a next-generation rotorcraft capability” for its New Medium Helicopter (NMH) requirement, Joel Best, director of EUMECAA global military sales and strategy, told Janes on 16 February.

Speaking at the IQPC International Military Helicopter conference being held in London from 15–17 February, Best said that Bell absolutely intends to bid its 525 for the UK NMH requirement, and with its current certification process with the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) on track to conclude in the fourth quarter of 2022 (subject to all FAA submittals and approvals being returned in a ‘reasonable' timeframe), the MoD would not need to delay for long.
------
Nice idea, and yes, it is a very new helicopter. Little time, little data on performance with all the military kit added, little etc., little chance.

 

[Opportunistic Minnow]

Even if the MoD is inclined to wait, can the Pumas? Can someone enlighten me as to what is so next-gen about it? If it is lighter then is it rugged enough for squadies? If it has ooo-aaaah avionics, will they still work in a degraded environment? As @yasotay points out, a lot of unknowns. I'd be inclined to save the bleeding edge for someone else.

 

[timmymagic]

Whether it was a serious proposal, or if Boeing even knew anything about it, I don't know. One think I'm pretty confident of is that if it ever became a serious proposal, Sikorsky and the USMC would try very, very hard to kill it.

Looks like someone commissioned an engineering study fairly recently.

CH-47 Helicopter Blade Fold Gearbox - Ingenium Technologies

The Challenge Ingenium was commissioned to develop a design concept to modify existing CH-47 Chinook blade fold gearboxes. The design was required to add automatic

ingeniumtech.com

 

[zebedee]

Latest NMH contender breaks cover and touts ‘evolved and renewed’ Black Hawk bid

Ok... so not Draken... A new facility from AceHawk Aerospace... apparently the UK arm of Ace Aeronautics

Zeb

 

[Opportunistic Minnow]

The Fabulous Tale of Billy No-Name and his Clocked Geriatrics from the Back of Beyond. Yup, they'll probably win.

At least we knew where the Pumas had been.

 

[Hood]

Waiting for someone to take those Bell 214s from Brunei and Belize and tart them up with go faster stripes next...

 

[RavenOne]

The plot thickens with more revelation of H-60 proposal by a newly established company called AirHawk up in the north of the UK

Latest NMH contender breaks cover and touts ‘evolved and renewed’ Black Hawk bid

A surprise contender for the UK's New Medium Helicopter (NMH) requirement has broken cover, pitching pre-owned Sikorsky UH-60 Black Hawks that would be extensively upgraded at a new facility in the northeast of England.

www.flightglobal.com

About Us - Acehawk Aerospace

Reducing the Risk, Expense and Carbon Emissions of Battlefield Helicopter Procurement using UK ingenuity and knowhow.

acehawkaerospace.com

cheers

 

[Jackonicko]

Just curious, was additional Merlins ever a serious or sensible option?

Eminently sensible. Not serious.

 

[yasotay]

Just curious, was additional Merlins ever a serious or sensible option?

Eminently sensible. Not serious.

Likely for similar reasons that the CH-47 was denied to the USAF for a CSAR aircraft.