Britain and the post 1991 Cold War

[uk 75]

The year 1991 is associated with the end of the Cold War but had things been different and Gorbachev replaced like Kruschev in the 60s with a hard line leadership the UK could not have reduced its armed forces.
The Royal Navy would have needed a replacement for its T42 destroyers sooner than in our time. The three Invincibles might have retained their Seadart or received Seawolf. Sea Harriers were due to get Amraam. Replacement ships were being examined.
The RAF would have needed to develop Tornado strike aircraft and the F2 would have got ASRAAM and Amraam. It might not have got C17 as the C130 was more useful in the NATO resupply role.
Challenger 2 would have entered service sooner and in greater numbers.

 

[CV12Hornet]

I'm not sure the RN can get the Type 45s in the water much sooner than they did. In terms of time Britain's Horizon diversion didn't cost them all that much - it would've taken 8-10 years to finish the design anyway (in the event it took ten years to the month) and Horizon did have the benefit of getting the PAAMS development done before the Brits left it. And they still need time to process the wreckage of the Cold War-era NFR90 project. Some of the delays for HMS Daring seem unavoidable.

Plus, the Vanguard subs eating the budget during the 1990s.

 

[zen]

The quest....or is it the saga of replacing Type 42 and Sea Dart. Goes back to the early 70's....if not to the late 60's.
The decision not fund SAM.72, GAST.1210 and to drop Sea Dart mkII and opt into NF-90 was disastrous and added another decade to this.

With that Type 43 and Type 44 (which reused Type 22 hull and machinery) were thrown out with the bathwater.

But arguments were being made for stretched or enlarged Type 23 with an AAW suite.

GWS.27 could have offered a longer ranged SAM complimentary to Sea Wolf.

At one point ALAS-1 a AMRAAM repackaged with a 10" diameter rocket motor was briefly a contender.
Then the Cold War ended and the USSR collapsed. Budgets rapidly got sacrificed for 'peace' (myriad local conflicts we couldn't ignore).

But European EEC collaboration was the obsession of the times and so FAMS and various letters projects led to Horizon....and ultimately the RN had to walk away and just build whatever they could. Which is why WR.21 and it's US designed intercooler and European diesel plant exist on Type 45.

So first contender has to be Sea Dart mkII and either Type 43 or Type 44. Which if Sea Dart was given VLS and gain a PESA or AESA Type radar system would dokce a lot.

Second SAM.72 and GAST.1210 combined. Agsin Type 44.

Third a big Brother to Active Sea Wolf GWS.27....with AESA on the ships And a bigger Type 23
Fourth ALAS-1.
Fifth is FAMS but just FAMS and no Horizon and WR.21.

 

[BlackBat242]

The quest....or is it the saga of replacing Type 42 and Sea Dart. Goes back to the early 70's....if not to the late 60's.
The decision not fund SAM.72, GAST.1210 and to drop Sea Dart mkII and opt into NF-90 was disastrous and added another decade to this.

With that Type 43 and Type 44 (which reused Type 22 hull and machinery) were thrown out with the bathwater.

But arguments were being made for stretched or enlarged Type 23 with an AAW suite.

GWS.27 could have offered a longer ranged SAM complimentary to Sea Wolf.

At one point ALAS-1 a AMRAAM repackaged with a 10" diameter rocket motor was briefly a contender.
Then the Cold War ended and the USSR collapsed. Budgets rapidly got sacrificed for 'peace' (myriad local conflicts we couldn't ignore).

But European EEC collaboration was the obsession of the times and so FAMS and various letters projects led to Horizon....and ultimately the RN had to walk away and just build whatever they could. Which is why WR.21 and it's US designed intercooler and European diesel plant exist on Type 45.

So first contender has to be Sea Dart mkII and either Type 43 or Type 44. Which if Sea Dart was given VLS and gain a PESA or AESA Type radar system would dokce a lot.

Second SAM.72 and GAST.1210 combined. Agsin Type 44.

Third a big Brother to Active Sea Wolf GWS.27....with AESA on the ships And a bigger Type 23
Fourth ALAS-1.
Fifth is FAMS but just FAMS and no Horizon and WR.21.

But anything that happened before 1991 is still going to happen - you can only change things starting in 1991.

 

[zen]

But anything that happened before 1991 is still going to happen - you can only change things starting in 1991

Yes but it helps to be aware of what had happened previously. The 'might have been' that would still linger in the minds of people.

Arguably stretched Type 23 would win out as it was already on the cards. '91 was when the first 4 were downgraded to just repeat Type 23.
So had the Cold War continued, this stretched Type 23 would have happened.

This would potentially compete with a 3 and 4 set powerplant concepts alongside NF-90/Horizon concepts.

And had some version of Type 23 won through, it's likely a choice between GWS.27 with a beefed up GAST.1210 SAM or ALAS-1 as it's effector.