NHIndustries NH90

Sadly I think NH-90 will be used as the teaching point that a "Jack of all trades, master of none" is not the business model everyone thought it would be. Not that it is a bad aircraft, just that the varied sustainment variations are near impossible to keep up with. Perhaps some of the challenges will decrease as the number of users declines and the vendor(s) can focus on smaller production requirements for parts (?)
 
Damn. Yesterday I red that Belgium wants to get ride of the four NH-90s it presently has.

"Another one bites the dust..."

And French Minister of Defense Florence Parly has enough, of the French Navy NH-90 corrosion issues.

Seems that helicopter is presently having a 2007 Britney Spears descent into hell.
Or my year 2014, screw that one forever.
 
Belgium will replace its NH90 TTH and A109 helicopters with Airbus H145M 00


Belgian Defense Minister, Ludivine Dedonder, on January 28 her STAR plan (Security, Technology, Ambition, Resilience), which updates the 2016 Strategic Vision. Different sources indicate the purchase of fifteen H145M light helicopters of Airbus would be a file already well advanced, marking the end of the NH90 TTH of the Air Component.

In June 2020, Defense already reduced flight plan for NH-90 TTH helicopters, because of their expensive upgrades and flight hours, flawed industry support and staff shortages. In principle, they were to remain operational at least until 2024. As we reported in January 2022, the Air Component of the Belgian Armed Forces plans to buy new helicopters as a replacement for the NH90-TTH medium-sized, twin-engine, multi-role military helicopter and the Agusta A109 lightweight, twin-engine, multi-purpose helicopter.

With the H145M, flight hours will be much less expensive. According to a source close to the file still quoted by VRT NWS, we would go from 15,000 euros for one hour of flight to less than 3,000 euros.

The 3.8-tonne H145M is a proven light and versatile helicopter perfectly adapted to conducting reconnaissance and support missions, while still being capable of delivering troops and materials at a fast pace. The H145M is the military version of the tried-and-tested, lightweight and powerful twin-engine H145 civil helicopter, which has been deployed across the world in harsh conditions – and has proven its high performance. In mountainous areas and in hot conditions, the H145 has made its name as a rugged and reliable helicopter.

Equipped with the Airbus HForce weapons system, the H145M also can provide vital fire support. In 2013, the H145M was chosen by the German Armed Forces (Bundeswehr) as part of the Light Utility Helicopter (LUH) Special Operations Forces (SOF) project.

This helicopter will replace the NH90 TTH, but not the NH90 NFH. Because of its cooperation with the Dutch Navy, the Navy Component is obliged to continue to operate the aircraft for the missions of its frigates.

Belgium could replace its NH90 TTH and A109 helicopters with Airbus H145M

Belgian Defense Minister, Ludivine Dedonder, on January 28 her STAR plan (Security, Technology, Ambition, Resilience), which updates the 2016 Strategic Vision. Different sources indicate the purchase of fifteen H145M light helicopters of Airbus would be a file already well advanced, marking the...
airrecognition.com airrecognition.com

15,000 euros/hour, such crazy spending, enough for three UH-60M
 
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^ Im wondering what made the NH90 such a failure? over engineering? bad partnerships?
alone, Airbus and Leonardo make great helicopters.. not sure about Fokker.
 
Fokker Technologies is part of GKN, since 2015. GKN used to own part of Agusta Westland, now Leonardo.
 
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Pour la recherche, ce sont les lunettes à vision nocturnes qui sont souvent privilégiées, plutôt que le projecteur ou la caméra thermique dont est équipé l’hélicoptère. « On appréhende mieux les nuances. »

Puis retour à la base, dans ce hangar à structure métallo-textile que l’on retrouve aussi déployé sur les théâtres d’opérations extérieures. « L’avantage est que la température et l’hydrométrie sont contrôlées. L’électronique n’appréciait pas trop l’humidité dans l’ancien hangar. »
------------------**---------------------

For search, night vision goggles are often preferred, rather than the searchlight or the thermal camera with which the helicopter is equipped. “We can appreciate nuances better. »

Then (the helicopter) return(s) to the base, in this hangar with a metal-textile structure that is also found on deployment in external theaters of operations. “The advantage is that the temperature and hydrometry are controlled. The electronics didn't like the humidity too much in the old hangar. »
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*emphasis are not mines

actu.fr

EN IMAGES. À la découverte du Caïman, l'hélicoptère de la Marine nationale basé dans le Cotentin

Depuis la base aéronavale de Maupertus, le Caïman Marine est prêt à décoller en moins de vingt minutes. en 2021, il a effectué 138 opérations et secouru 25 personnes.
actu.fr actu.fr
 
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Archibald said:
Damn. Yesterday I red that Belgium wants to get ride of the four NH-90s it presently has.

"Another one bites the dust..."

And French Minister of Defense Florence Parly has enough, of the French Navy NH-90 corrosion issues.

Seems that helicopter is presently having a 2007 Britney Spears descent into hell.
Or my year 2014, screw that one forever.
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Looks like the NH-90 is another troubled helicopter like the Tiger, with Belgium getting rid of theirs as you said in your post Archibald along with Australia going for the Blackhawk to replace their NH-90s too, things are looking rather bleak in the long run for the NH-90.
 
I don't think the Tiger is as troubled as the NH90 is. The French seems to be satisfied with theirs.
I mean I didn't red horror stories about them...
 
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Specifically which spare parts are in short supply in Australia?
 
All 11 NATO Frigate Helicopter (NFH) and eight marinised Tactical Transport Helicopter (TTH) NH90s will go through the process that is designed to remove obsolescence issues from the platforms that were received from 2010, but which date back to the 1990s.

“All 19 NH90 maritime combat helicopters are getting a major makeover,” Dutch State Secretary for Defence Christophe van der Maat said. “This so-called mid-life update is necessary to keep the devices operationally relevant.”
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Dutch NH90s to receive mid-life upgrade

The Netherlands is to implement a mid-life upgrade (MLU) to its entire fleet of NHIndustries NH90 helicopters, the Ministry of Defence (MoD) announced on 15 April.
www.janes.com
 
Flight Global: Low NH90 availability pinned on contract failings, but programme chief sees causes for optimism

"Availability rates as low as 25% on the NH Industries NH90 were the result of too much focus on managing the acquisition and introduction of the helicopters and not enough on how to keep them flying, according to a senior Airbus Helicopters executive..."

https://www.flightglobal.com/helico...chief-sees-causes-for-optimism/148757.article

I hope it's not already too late!
 
What that means is that they did not build enough spare stock of the most expensive parts such as flight computers, gearboxes, engines and engine spares, rotors and rotor head spares so that the world fleet had to beg and borrow from each other. Given that Airbus have been operating pooled parts systems for decades with the Airbus airliners, this should not have happened. It's so basic, so important to get right from Day one.
 
It's really a shame that it came to this point at all.
 
Stovepipe said:
What that means is that they did not build enough spare stock of the most expensive parts such as flight computers, gearboxes, engines and engine spares, rotors and rotor head spares so that the world fleet had to beg and borrow from each other. Given that Airbus have been operating pooled parts systems for decades with the Airbus airliners, this should not have happened. It's so basic, so important to get right from Day one.
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I wonder why their spares inventory was so low. Just (false) economy or did they badly misestimate the demand for these spares somehow? Does NH90 require more of these high-value spares than other similar aircraft?
 
I'll give you an example; the airline I work for accepted an A320 from Toulouse. All signed off and fit for purpose. Two days after entry into service, on about it's fifth or sixth revenue flight, a major computer fails and won't reset. We have a spare and fit it and on she flies and the computer, probably a quarter of a million Euros new, goes back to the factory for repair and then goes into the pool. It was a common computer and plenty of them exist so it's not a deal breaker but if a car behaved like that, you'd throw it back to the motor dealer and demand a new one. Airlines tolerate it because the manufacturers have them over a barrel. But, it begs the question, why were Airbus so inefficient at keeping the Australian helicopters running when they can manage to keep fleets of Airbus airliners running at greater than 90 % reliability rates in the same country?
 
Airliners as young as 8 years old are being broken up to supply spare parts for their brothers and sisters.
Short production runs and too few spares being built are the problems.
Once a production line shuts down, the dollar value of rare spares can go through the roof!!!!!!
 
I would also observe that just because the airliners and the helicopters are in the same parent company, does not mean that they are all working and thinking alike in the corporate structure. Boeing is similar in that they make airliners and helicopters, but to the investors helicopters are a small part of the portfolio. I would be that LMCO has similar corporate challenges.
 
Don't forget that the electronic suite was underperforming from start and with some reliability problems.
 
We had the same shite with the Dauphin in Ireland. Chronic serviceability as we were the smallest fish in the operators pond and it cist a fortune to maintain.
 
Vol #22, 25. Just so.
Involvement of Airbus SE in NH90 Sustainment is recent. Special Purpose Vehicle NHI was the Prime Contractor (Seller)...and a new procurement entity was the Buyer: OCCAR*, set up by Convention, neither a NATO, nor EU Institution. Everything said by Vol then ensued, because there was no Corporate Memory, Affinity/Commitment Culture...nothing. A loose bunch of project-specific recruits on fixed term Services Agreements, in both OCCAR and the meeting point/post office that was the sole asset of NHI. (OCCAR also does Tiger).*

Until 1977 that applied equally to Airbus Industrie. Assemble the Air Vehicle; clear the invoice; forget. User needing parts/data/care tries to find life in Toulouse after 1600hr on Friday, or any time in August...zip. Did you say AOG - who he? A300B was selling to no-one with a choice. Until Frank Borman at Eastern created the airliner supply-and-sustain business that is the AI known and loved today. He banged heads together. AI assigned Product Support to DASA/Hamburg who made it into a respected career opportunity. People attended to flight spares packs, outport critical parts pooling...Product Support! Evidently...none of that on NH90. Because that was no-one's Task.

Some of the same Management Consultants that invented Lean moved into Sustainment. The first result I am aware of was GE defeating RR for BA 777-200, 1991: GE offered power-by-the-hour, acquisition+sustainment. Buyer bought Power, not metal. That has since been UK MoD's approach, non-combat. So UK's current Tender for Puma-replacement is just so: 5 years' lift at £X per flight hour. All the pain of parts in the right place at the right time...goes into that £X. No fly, no pay.

One reason for doing that was Vol's point about recruitment/retention of Product Support competence, even interest.

I do not put this forward as panacea - see vehement criticism of RAF A330/Voyager total programme cost, or of anything done by Ascent on UK Rotary Training. But anything that locks Original Equipment Manufacturers into accepting paternity for life-of-type must be good.

(* amended 11/6: my bad: not OCCAR, but NAHEMA/Aix-en-Provence (for Marignane): the points made are so: unlike all other NATO Project Agencies, staffing for this unique project could not dip into a deep pool of relevant National Project Management expertise.)
 
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Wow! Full refund. That will be in the courts for some time. I imagine that Sikorsky is doing "Keystone Cops" right now trying to get to Norway.
 
yasotay said:
Wow! Full refund. That will be in the courts for some time. I imagine that Sikorsky is doing "Keystone Cops" right now trying to get to Norway.
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On the plus side, at least these Airbus helicopters have managed to keep the rotor and airframe connected.

Flippancy aside, does Australia or Norway have an equivalent to the UK Public Accounts Committee and the formidable Margaret Hodge MP? If so, have they looked at the NH90 (and Tiger in Oz)?

Be interesting to see how this pans out. interestingly I can't find any books on the NH90, despite it being 27 years since it achieved an air gap under its wheels. Anyone know of one?

Chris
 
CJGibson said:
yasotay said:
Wow! Full refund. That will be in the courts for some time. I imagine that Sikorsky is doing "Keystone Cops" right now trying to get to Norway.
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On the plus side, at least these Airbus helicopters have managed to keep the rotor and airframe connected.

Chris
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Caustic humor is banned on any NH90 flight, per check flight rules (no farts either that can temper the regulated cabin hygronomic levels).
 
So Norway follows Australia in ditching the NH-90, I wonder who will be next to follow them.
 
Archibald said:
Damn. Yesterday I red that Belgium wants to get ride of the four NH-90s it presently has.
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thats only half true.

yes, we are getting rid of 4 NH90's, but these are the TTH versions. support from NAHEMA is terrible, per hour flying costs are much higher then anticipated and with only 4 helicopters, the numbers are insufficient to be kept operationally relevant (downtime due to maintainance, crew training,...) they, allong with the remaining Agusta A109BAi's, are to be replaced by a new type (the Airbus H145M has been touted as the prefered type, order for 15 are expected). however, there is a requirement for a new Heavy- or Medium-lift (inside BAF circles, the CH-47F Chinook has been mentioned multiple times).

www.vrt.be

Defensie wil 15 lichte Europese H145M helikopters kopen en zoekt koper voor de peperdure NH-90 heli’s

Ze moeten de vier NH-90s van de landmacht vervangen die veel te duur in gebruik zijn.
www.vrt.be www.vrt.be

the 4 NFH versions (that recently just passed the 5000hrs milestone) are to kept operational, in cooperation with the Dutch as the SAR role they provide is too important. however, accoring to the STAR-plan (previously know as Horizon 2030), the NH90-NFH is to recieve an ASW role and capability by 2025. it has already been noted that 4 NFH's are too few to do both Maretime ops, ASW and SAR ops, so the option either to buy additional NH90-NFH's (maybe from Norway, giving recent events) ora seperate new tpe SAR helicopter.
 
CJGibson said:
Be interesting to see how this pans out. interestingly I can't find any books on the NH90, despite it being 27 years since it achieved an air gap under its wheels. Anyone know of one?
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Most aircraft could achieve this, just using appropriate jacks, to raise wheels from the ground :cool:
Luckily, many aircraft do this without jacks - by lifting force, generated by air.
 
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TomcatViP said:
NH90 only uses Oxygen to generate lift. That's why it can fly only 20% of the time!
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Instead of again posting your usual and well-known more than sarcastic anti-anything-from-Europe-post, could you explain for a layman like me what are these "numerous flaws that even apparent to the naked eye"??
At least I am either blind or plain stupid, but I see not apparent design flaws?!!
 
NH.90 NFH. as proposed for Royal Navy use
 

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