Su-30, Su-33, Su-34 and Su-35 News thread, pictures and discussion
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The easiest was to look at the radome, where SM-2 supposedly has Irbis, and thus Su-35 radome without pitot tube. Other than that it's kinda hard to differentiate physically.
My understanding is that what is currently called SM2 does not have the Irbis (and not sure about the AL-41F1S engines, probably not yet either?), but has an upgraded Bars with a TWT boosted from 7 to 10 KW?
Radome on Su-30SM and SM2 is unchanged. Plus IIRC Su-30SM2 doesn't have Irbis, just upgraded BARS. The quickest way to spot a difference - length of radiotransparent section on leading edge. Su-30SM2 has longer, likely because new IFF.
F-2
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Is this what “Bars-R” refers too?
To be fair, I have read from several source saying SM2 will get irbis-e as well
Scorpion82
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High probability is that there must be N035 Irbis if they integrated that so called ''on-board multifunction digital interrogator with AESA known as 4283MP inside of the wingslasts as we can see. It is decimetric band IFF system.
Another detail ,about those kW's .When we talk about the TWT ,there is 'parameter' called average power of the TWT on the HPRF mode .E.g . average power of the main TWT on HPRF mode of the N035 Irbis is 5kW.So that 7-10kW can not be real.Other parameter is the max output pulse power on the HPRF mode e.g. N035 Irbis has that in the value of 20kW,for the comparison old radars like N001 Myech and N019 Rubin have that parameter in the value of about 8 kW ( average power of the TWT on the HPRF mode is about 1kW) . N011M Bars-M/R has one TWT where the average power on the HPRF mode is about 3kW and max output pulse power on the HPRF mode is about 15kW.
If Su-30SM2 has really N035 Irbis radar and AL-41F-1S engines, for me it is very interesting that they did not integrated self-defence system known as I-222 with IR MAWS and LWD ( SOAR/SOLO)
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N011M 'Bars-R' is only for the VKS/VMF Su-30SM ( and for the AF's of the Belarus, Kazahstan and Armenia because they are CSTO-countries ). N011M 'Bars-M' is for the exported Su-30MKA,MKI and MKM.
There must be differences between so called liter codes/working frequencies for the AAM's with SARH, IFF interogator working frequencies etc....
It exists for sure. E.g. N011M 'Bars-R' can be ''paired'' using liter codes/programes only with inertial+radar guided AAM's like R-27R/ER and R-77-1 but not with the R-27R1/ER1, and R-77-1EL ( only for export of course). Yes, it is domestic version of the N011M Bars-M for the domestic VKS/VMF Su-30SM only. I think you will understand now.
Su-30SM2 with the new very long range AAM's type R-37M. I didn't see any photo of the Su-30SM with these AAM's so far. If R-37M can be only 'paired' with the N007AM Zaslon-AM and N035 Irbis,there is N035 Irbis inside of the radome of this SM2.
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Life of Tyo
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I was also talking/writing about designation and it is not some ''journalist name'' like you wrote.
''В то время как на Су-30М2 установлена БРЛС Н001В, являющаяся модернизацией БРЛС, установленной на Су-27, в состав авионики Су-30СМ включена более мощная БРЛС Н011М "Барс-Р" с пассивной фазированной антенной решеткой (ФАР).''
Even Su-30SM have Indian-made radar and WCS comps ( RC1/RC2), radar itself have so many differences as I wrote earlier. N011M Bars-R in the VKS/VMF Su-30SM has different working frequencies in both search and lock-on modes,has differ working frequencies in CWI mode. IFF system ( interogator unit on the reflector of the antenna) also has differ working frequencies .This radar can only be paired with domestic R-27R/ER and R-77-1. Also RC ( radio-correction) channel has differ working frequencies.This version is also integrated in the Su-30SM's of the Belarus ,Kazah and Armenian AF's 'cause they are part of CSTO ( Collective Security Treaty Organization).
Процессоры индийского производства для российских Су-30СМ
Индийская государственная авиастроительная корпорация Hindustan Aircraft Limited (HAL) в распространявшемся на авиасалоне Aero India в Бангалоре в начале февраля 2013 года пресс-релизе сообщала, что ее подразделение авионики (Avionics Division) получила контракт от российского ОАО Корпорация…
bmpd.livejournal.com
As we know , designations like Su-30SM (SME) /SM2 ,MKA,MKI and MKM are not 'journalist's ' so designations of some radar versions are not either. Here we have some fine example.
MiG-29A or Izdeliye 9.12A was the export version of the MiG-29/9.12 for the ex-WP countries.They have exactly the same IFF system ( interrogator/transponder units) like MiG-29 in the former USSR VVS-FA. Besides all of that, MiG-29A has N019E ,so export version of the N019 Rubin radar in the MiG-29 9.12/9.13. Why ? Simply ,because MiG-29A was export version ,so it has export ( downgraded) version of it's radar with different working frequencies in search,lock-on and CWI modes (RC-channel too) and could be only 'paired' with exported R-27R1 ( not with R-27R).
So we have, N011M Bars-R in the VKS/VMF Su-30SM's and Su-30SM's of the Belarus,Kazah and Armenian AF's. Then ,N011M Bars-M in the Su-30MKA,MKI and MKM and very possible in the Su-30SME ( 6 pcs in the Myanmar AF).
Su-30SM2 with N035 Irbis ( not N035E Irbis-E 'cause it is export version integrated in the PLAAF and Algerian/Iranian AF Su-35's) has many technical/tactical advantages.One of them is total possible FoV of 240°.
Su-30SM2 can also carry combat proven R-37M / Izd. 610M .
Note: on Feb 2025 one Su-30SM2 from VMF shot down UkrAF fighter Su-27 with R-37M. Launch distance was about 130 km.Unfortunately ,young fighter-pilot Ivan Bolotov was KIA.
Russian Su-30SM2 Shoot Down Ukraine's Su-27 in 130km Using R-37M Long Range Air-to-Air Missile - Defence Security Asia
Russian sources has claimed that a Ukrainian Su-27 fighter jet was brought down down in the area of Pokrovsk, Donetsk Oblast by a Russian Su-30SM2 using a long-range R-37M air-to-air missile from a distance of 130 km.
defencesecurityasia.com
Su-35S can carry max 12 AAM's type R-77-1/Izd. 170-1. Six under the fuselage ( four between air intakes/engine nacelles and two under the air intakes ) and six under the wings.
Question is, how many AAM's type R-37M can (practically/possibly) carry as max.
Two under the fuselage ( between air intakes/engine nacelles).
Two under the air intakes .
Two under the inner wing pylons.
I suppose that R-37M's can be carried under the mid underwing pylons? Maybe Su-35S can carry(practically) max of eight R-37M's (the same applies for the Su-30SM2) ???
Question is, how many AAM's type R-37M can (practically/possibly) carry as max.
Two under the fuselage ( between air intakes/engine nacelles).
Two under the air intakes .
Two under the inner wing pylons.
I suppose that R-37M's can be carried under the mid underwing pylons? Maybe Su-35S can carry(practically) max of eight R-37M's (the same applies for the Su-30SM2) ???
Why would one even carry so many? That's a half a ton missile, plus a fairly heavy pylon. Plus let's say 2 r77 if someone slips close by and you need something more agile.
We're now approaching 5 tons of payload, with wingtip jammers. That's a pretty heavy load even for a flanker. Not really conducive to air combat missions.
We're now approaching 5 tons of payload, with wingtip jammers. That's a pretty heavy load even for a flanker. Not really conducive to air combat missions.
It was only a question and assumption.Of course ,something like that would depend on combat situation and needs.Keep in mind that old Su-27S/P flew very often with max six 350kg heavy R-27ER/ET. Su-30SM/SM2 can carry even eight of them.
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Well if such load are carried.. the intent would be to kill as many targets at longest possible range, say saturating AEW. But yeah, there probably no need to carry such amount for missile trucking load.
Always include "Duty Cycle" as Average power is related to it. Typical airborne pulse doppler radar can expect 5-30% duty cycle. While Russian fighters typically have 25% duty for the radar. Thus if a radar have Peak power of 20 KW.. The average power would be 20*0.25 = 5 KW.
Bars in other hand are provided with TWT of different ratings throughout its design. From 5-7 KW. With 25% Duty cycle the average power is about 1.25-1.75 KW.
Also not sure where you get the 15KW figure from. afaik 15KW tho was the figure for Su-34's radar. If the Bars do get such ratings, then the average power is 3.75 KW. Assuming 25% duty cycle.
I have heard such too (and yeah i forgot the L-band array for SM-2 as main differentiating feature, man feelsbad). Tho it's kinda hard to believe they just uprate the transmitter to 10 KW. As it's rather modicum upgrade.
Assuming 25% duty cycle the average power would be 2.5 KW, compared with baseline Bars with 1.25 KW it represent twice the average power, which add only about 18% more range (e.g from 250-300 km to 295-354 km)
It might be that the upgraded Bars uses 1x 10 KW TWT from Irbis, which aiui uses 2x 10 KW TWTs, which would be helpful commonality wise as well as adding a bit of extra performance to better support R-37 LRBVR capability among others.
That is wrong friend. N035 Irbis has two TWT's ,one, the main , has the average power in the HPRF mode of 5kW, second one has the average power of 2kW ( data from one interview with Y. Beliy from NIIP named after V.V. Tikhomirov ).
As 'stealthflanker' wrote ....
''Always include "Duty Cycle" as Average power is related to it. Typical airborne pulse doppler radar can expect 5-30% duty cycle. While Russian fighters typically have 25% duty for the radar. Thus if a radar have Peak power of 20 KW.. The average power would be 20*0.25 = 5 KW. ''
''РЛС Н035 «Ирбис» имеет мощный 5 кВт усилитель. Н035 «Ирбис», в отличие от предшественника – Н011M «Барс-M», имеет четыре, а не три дискретных канала. Максимальная мощность радара составляет 20 кВт.''
15kW as max output pulse power of the N011M Bars-M ( in the HPRF mode ).Data from the interview with Tamerlan Bekirbayev.
Thanks for the additional data. Now if I may ,I have some questions.
I've read from some sources that average TWT power ( or DC) and output pulse power can be different depending on which current is used by radar AC ( 115/200V) or DC ( 27V) ,is it right?
When you wrote about that ''Pd'' or the 'probability of detection' ( e.g. 90% or 50% etc), does it actually refer to the first scan cycle as I have been able to read in multiple sources. Tnx....
Bmpd's take on Belarus Su-30SM2 delivery.
bmpd.livejournal.com
Белоруссия получила два истребителя Су-30СМ2
Как сообщило министерство обороны Белоруссии, 27 мая 2025 года на 61-ю истребительную авиационную базу ВВС и войск ПВО Белоруссии в Барановичах прибыла первая пара полученных белорусской стороной новых многофункциональных истребителей Су-30СМ2 постройки Иркутского авиационного завода (ИАЗ, в…
bmpd.livejournal.com
Very interesting detail on the Su-33 number 88 red .
russianplanes.net
It is aircraft from the 9th serie and only two were built with a ladder,both have named after famous Russian Naval Aviation fighter-pilot Maj.Gen. Timur Apakidze.First is active,operational in 279th KIAP and second one ( Bort number 70 red) stands as a monument besides the KnAAZ factory.
Source: http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic_t_88000.html
Walkaround of the aircraft number 80 red .
scalemodels.ru
In total ,11 prototypes of T-10K/Su-27K were built and 27 serial aircraft were built from which 24 were operational from 1994 in two aviation sqn ( 1st known as 'Eagles' and 2nd known as 'Tigers' ) of the 279th KIAP.
Source: http://forums.airforce.ru/matchast/4131-reestr-su-33-a/
Фотография самолёта · Сухой · Су-33 (Су-27К/Т-10К) · 88 "Тимур Апакидзе" · Россия (СССР) - ВМФ ✈ russianplanes.net ✈ наша авиация
Фотография самолёта. Разработчик: Сухой, модификация: Су-33 (Су-27К/Т-10К), бортовой номер: 88, личное имя: "Тимур Апакидзе", оператор: Россия (СССР) - ВМФ, место съёмки: Североморск-3, фотограф: Владимир Назаров (c)
russianplanes.net
It is aircraft from the 9th serie and only two were built with a ladder,both have named after famous Russian Naval Aviation fighter-pilot Maj.Gen. Timur Apakidze.First is active,operational in 279th KIAP and second one ( Bort number 70 red) stands as a monument besides the KnAAZ factory.
Source: http://scalemodels.ru/modules/forum/viewtopic_t_88000.html
Walkaround of the aircraft number 80 red .
Ôîòîãàëåðåÿ : Ñáîðíûå ìàñøòàáíûå ìîäåëè - ScaleModels.ru
Ñáîðíûå ìàñøòàáíûå ìîäåëè - ScaleModels.ru. Ñàìûå ñâåæèå ìîäåëüíûå íîâîñòè!
scalemodels.ru
In total ,11 prototypes of T-10K/Su-27K were built and 27 serial aircraft were built from which 24 were operational from 1994 in two aviation sqn ( 1st known as 'Eagles' and 2nd known as 'Tigers' ) of the 279th KIAP.
Source: http://forums.airforce.ru/matchast/4131-reestr-su-33-a/
Su-35S was shot down in the Kursk region-RF.Many Russian and Belarus sources wrote that it was FF ,Ukr sources of course wrote that it was shot down by Ukr. AD. If I counted correctly, this is the eighth Su-35S that was shot down during Russ-Ukr war.
avia.pro
Истребитель Су-35С потерян в Курской области
Истребитель Су-35С потерян в Курской области: летчик спасен, обстоятельства выясняются
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Galaxy
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Fighter Bomber never said anything about any F-16. I just checked all his posts. Seems like Suchominus used a fake source which isn’t surprising since he is pro Ukrainian and often doesn’t bother verifying anything.
Edit, the post is 100% fake. Telegram post have view counters and they are always located to the right, the supposed screenshot of Fighter Bomber showed the post counter to the left and the views also showed 2k when most Fighter Bombers posts get 200K to 300K views. Something downed the SU-35 but there is no evidence or acknowledgment of what.
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Life of Tyo
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If is true , where HUD Record F-16 Successful Shot down Su-35S , I Few Months Ago F-16 UA was shot down Su-34 but official Never say and no have HUD record for Fact
Ainen
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Ukraine didn't, at least not yet. Just claimed that "air force", which inlcudes both fighters and AD units. In Ukrainian case, bloggers=/=state.
Russian claim is patriot ambush.
Which may be not as eye-catching, but arguably is more operationally significant. Ukrainian AD in Sumy/Kursk region was absolutely atrocious for half a year (there's a long stream of Orion/Forpost attacks from there from August till few days ago).
This may have changed.
Ambush attacks is tried and true tactics for Ukrainian AD. I find it more likely than F-16 kill.
Galaxy
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Who cares what Ukraine says they they lie all the time ie Ghost of Kiev, claiming 100% missile interceptions when there are lots of videos of missile impacts, lies about downing 13 SU-34s in a matter of days, ect.
SU-35 definitely went down but there is no proof of what happened. Pro Ukrainians are now sharing fake screenshots in order to fit a narrative.
And I suppose Russia can also claim S-400 friendly fire since it’s a favorite tactic of Ukraine. According to Ukraine almost every Ukrainian aircraft shot down was due to friendly fire, accidents or ingesting drone debris.
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Galaxy
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Yes
zebra159357
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Both sides of the conflict tend to exaggerate/downplay for their own interests. Let's wait for more information to surface before drawing (potentially) premature conclusions.
Very possible,maybe something that early happened on May 13 2023.
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Okay, some milbloggers and youtubers have jumped into posting theories without confirmation, but please stop with "Ukrainian's lie" rhetoric. In times of war 'special military operations' there will be valid and invalid claims, propaganda, and mistakes. Ukrainians sure don't have a monopoly on this.
Blanket statements about countries are reductive, and generally wrong.
Blanket statements about countries are reductive, and generally wrong.
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