• Hi Guest! Forum rules have been updated. All users please read here.

Other Apollo Projects: What Should Have Been

Skybolt

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2006
Messages
2,297
Reaction score
33
Great find, thanx !
 

blackstar

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
1,684
Reaction score
13
That's a really nice compilation. I was going to complain about the lack of citations for all the data until I scrolled down to the bottom. It's very extensive.
 

OM

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Messages
753
Reaction score
0
Website
www.io.com
blackstar said:
That's a really nice compilation. I was going to complain about the lack of citations for all the data until I scrolled down to the bottom. It's very extensive.
...I posted the link to this several years ago to sci.space.history. It's essentially a support, research and inspiration page for those designing addons for Orbiter. The real surprises at the time was that they actually cited sources, and it wasn't just ripped off en masse from Mark Wade's site.
 

Triton

Donald McKelvy
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
9,723
Reaction score
215
Website
deeptowild.blogspot.com
Model of Grumman Lunar Excursion Module (LEM) by Precision found on eBay.

URL: http://cgi.ebay.com/Grumman-Aerospace-Lunar-Module-desk-model-Topping_W0QQitemZ170534053391QQcategoryZ86954QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp4340.m8QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DMW%26its%3DC%26itu%3DUCC%26otn%3D5%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D6003865150509665223


Description:
This is a Grumman Model Lunar Module by Precision. The base is made of Plexi and I believe this to be a pre-flight model as evidenced by the markings on the base. The base is about 10 inches across and the model sits about 7 inches high.
 

Attachments

Caravellarella

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
1,026
Reaction score
122
Dear Boys and Girls, here is an article in French about post-Mercury "projects", illustrated by an artist's impression of a Martin Apollo space vehicle with petal-type solar panels......

The article comes from the 3rd February 1961 issue of Les Ailes......

Terry (Caravellarella)
 

Attachments

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,273
Reaction score
103
flateric said:
anyone, any more info on that?
you got a source on that, eric ?

like the name on Picture say it a LEM
could be proposal from Boeing, Douglas, Northrop, Ling-Temco-Vought or Martin Marietta
 

flateric

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
8,803
Reaction score
256
Michel Van said:
you got a source on that, eric ?
Igor Afanasyev of Novosti Kosmonavtiki (www.novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru) sent me this image labeled 'Chance Vought LM 1962' asking if any further info available.
watermark at top left corner says 'Astronautics Division'
 

archipeppe

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Oct 18, 2007
Messages
1,562
Reaction score
75
flateric said:
Michel Van said:
you got a source on that, eric ?
Igor Afanasyev of Novosti Kosmonavtiki (www.novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru) sent me this image labeled 'Chance Vought LM 1962' asking if any further info available.
watermark at top left corner says 'Astronautics Division'
Mmmmm... really interesting!!
Never seen something like that before.... ::)
 

Igor B

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
27
Reaction score
5
"APOLLO RENDEZVOUS SIMULATOR STUDY" the name of that report from CHANCE VOUGHT CORPORATION to NASA in 1962. One more illustration from that report.
 

Attachments

blackstar

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
1,684
Reaction score
13
That's really interesting. It looks like they only used a single engine, with the descent stage essentially consisting of landing legs and fuel tanks that would be dropped on the surface and the same engine used for descent and ascent.
 

archipeppe

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Oct 18, 2007
Messages
1,562
Reaction score
75
blackstar said:
That's really interesting. It looks like they only used a single engine, with the descent stage essentially consisting of landing legs and fuel tanks that would be dropped on the surface and the same engine used for descent and ascent.
The same arrangement forseen for the Russian LK lander.
 

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,273
Reaction score
103
I love this Forum ;D

BIG THX to Igor B and Barrington Bond for the Picture

by the way, got some one pictures of LEM proposals of Boeing, Douglas, Northrop and Martin Marietta ?
 

Igor B

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
27
Reaction score
5
MARTIN MARIETTA.

I have one report prepared MARTIN MARIETTA for NASA in November 1962. There are two drawing: LOR configuration and DF configuration:
 

Attachments

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,273
Reaction score
103
THX again, Igor Bezyaev

DF stand for Direct Flight
lucky they not take decision to use that
imagine Niel Armstrong down-climbing this Martin design in cumbering A7L space suit...
 

Igor B

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
27
Reaction score
5
Today I try to imagine Niel Armstrong down-climbing this Martin design in cumbering A7L space suit ... and there is result of it. Not so exactly, but somehow like that :) :
 

Attachments

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,273
Reaction score
103
one moment, you are "that" Igor Bezyaev !
http://spaceart1.ning.com/profile/IgorBezyaev

 

Igor B

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
27
Reaction score
5
Yes, I am "that" Igor Bezyaev and some my illustrations accessible on the my page in International Space Art Network by the link:

http://spaceart1.ning.com/photo/photo/listForContributor?screenName=29mezxzv5np3a

Many thanks to Nick Stevens for that site!

Concerning concept of Boeing LEM I have only data from "The Lunar Exploration Scrapbook". Many thanks to Robert Godwin for that book and I hope he will not complain to me if I show one illustration from that book here. So the concept of Boeing LEM below. If somebody have the drawings or technical description of that concept, please, help me. I have plan to make space scene with that concept.
 

Attachments

blackstar

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
1,684
Reaction score
13
Igor Bezyaev said:
Today I try to imagine Niel Armstrong down-climbing this Martin design in cumbering A7L space suit ... and there is result of it.
I work with him. A week ago he was showing us a video of his landing.
 

Igor B

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
27
Reaction score
5
Do you work with Niel Armstrong? You are lucky man! When I was the schoolboy, I dreamt to be the cosmonaut as well as many boys at that time. I envy to Armstrong and all other astronauts who went on the Moon (white envy, not black!). I regret that I cannot to handshake with him.
 

blackstar

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
1,684
Reaction score
13
Yes, I do. But it's aviation-related, not space. He is very interested in aircraft engineering and refers to his time as an astronaut as "the dark side." So it was a treat to hear him talk about space.
 

Igor B

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
27
Reaction score
5
I understood one more of the reason why NASA rejected Direct Flight. Look at the situation presented on the illustration below. Who will be the first? Smile ;) !
 

Attachments

blackstar

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
1,684
Reaction score
13
Igor Bezyaev said:
I understood one more of the reason why NASA rejected Direct Flight. Look at the situation presented on the illustration below. Who will be the first?
Well, the Russians got a very late start to all of this. The timelines don't match. But I agree that a smaller spacecraft is easier to build than a big one.

But there is a well-known quote from one of the Apollo books where an Apollo official (I forget who) asked the question "Can you imagine trying to back an Atlas down onto the launch pad?" Try imagine steering something that tall as you bring it in for a landing. Probably impossible. The center of gravity would be very high, and it would be moving as the vehicle burned propellant.
 

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,273
Reaction score
103
Igor Bezyaev said:
I understood one more of the reason why NASA rejected Direct Flight. Look at the situation presented on the illustration below. Who will be the first? Smile ;) !

 

Igor B

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Oct 26, 2009
Messages
27
Reaction score
5
Mr. Michel Van! Thank you very much for your phrase “imagine Niel Armstrong down-climbing this Martin design in cumbering A7L space suit...”! It is help me to develop of series of illustrations. I cannot stop. It means the illustration above is not last! There is question: “Who will be first on the Moon?” Everybody! Please, consider about that question and prepare the answer. The day after tomorrow I will show the true answer and everybody can check it! ;)
 

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,273
Reaction score
103
Rule, Britannia! Britannia, rule the space,
Britons never will be the last, thanks to the BIS.

When Britain first at Heav’n’s command
Arose from out the azure main;
Arose, arose, arose from out the azure main;
This was the charter, the charter of the land,
And guardian angels sang this strain;

Rule, Britannia! Britannia, rule the space,
Britons never will be the last, thanks to the BIS...

sung by crew of BIS Lander "Francis Drake" as they put the Union Jack on moon ;D
 

OM

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Messages
753
Reaction score
0
Website
www.io.com
Igor Bezyaev said:
Today I try to imagine Niel Armstrong down-climbing this Martin design in cumbering A7L space suit ...
...Actually, the fun thing to imagine would be Pete Conrad trying to climb down from such a spacecraft. I'd pseudoquote him verbatim, but as Pete was a "master of the colorful metaphor", were I to do so Dwayne's head would explode :p :p :p :p
 
Top