• Hi Guest! Forum rules have been updated. All users please read here.

McDonnell Douglas little known airliners

Triton

Donald McKelvy
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
9,723
Reaction score
264
Website
deeptowild.blogspot.com
Artist impression of passenger version of YC-15 short-takeoff and landing (STOL) aircraft from The McDonnell Douglas Story by Douglas J. Ingells, Aero Publishers, Inc., 1979.

STOL airliners could bring air transportation to people, eliminating a need for the huge, expensive airports [that] service major cities.
 

Attachments

Triton

Donald McKelvy
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
9,723
Reaction score
264
Website
deeptowild.blogspot.com
Artist impression of civilian version of C-17 Globemaster formerly McDonnell Douglas MD-17. Following the merger with Boeing, the aircraft was to be offered as the Boeing BC-17X. Boeing asked for an exemption from the civil airworthiness certification process from the FAA. On September 23, 2008 the FAA denied the request killing the project. According to Flight International, the civil airworthiness certification process was "a time-consuming, costly process that effectively made it impossible to convert the military airlifter into a outsize cargo carrier for the commercial market."

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2007/05/23/214156/boeing-close-to-launching-bc-17.html

http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/the-dewline/2008/11/bc17-idea-dead-already-dies-ag.html
 

Attachments

J

joncarrfarrelly

Guest
verner said:
What's the scoop on this one and does anyone have a 3-view? (Mcdonald 220)
The McDonnell (not McDonnell-Douglas) Model 119 was an unsuccessful competitor
for the UCX project to find a replacement for the Beech C-45 (the venerable Twin Beech).
Lockheed won with the Jetstar (C-140) so McDonnell redesignated the aircraft as the Model 220
and marketed it as an executive aircraft. A tentative deal with Pan Am fell through due to cost.

There is a 3-view at this link:
http://www.aviastar.org/air/usa/mcdonnell_119-220.php
 

Stargazer2006

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2009
Messages
13,242
Reaction score
191
That's McDONNELL, not McDonald, and what do you mean by "the scoop"? It's a well-known prototype that started life as the Model 119. It has been preserved to this day, refurbished, and is exhibited somewhere, though I don't have the info with me right now.
 

Caravellarella

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
1,032
Reaction score
151
Reminds me a little of the new Japanese maritime patrol aircraft, the Kawasaki XP-1......

Terry (Caravellarella)
 

verner

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Dec 5, 2009
Messages
42
Reaction score
1
Sorry stargazer. The "scoop" means info. Should have known better as scoops a abundant in aircraft. Right, old Mcdonald was the guy with the farm. Cheers.
 

The Artist

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2009
Messages
563
Reaction score
83
McDonnell Airliner Concept 1961 - T-85A?

This model is in the collection of the Greater St. Louis Air & Space Museum. Not much information with it - only what you see on the tag and the number on the engine.
 

Attachments

Triton

Donald McKelvy
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
9,723
Reaction score
264
Website
deeptowild.blogspot.com
McDonnell Douglas MD-XX



Type: Advanced technology medium-range airliner.

Program: Preliminary studies begun May 1991. Discussed with Finnair, SAS, and other airlines. Possible launch 1997 or later; first deliveries before 2002.

Current versions: Single-aircraft program to replace existing narrow body aircraft through 6 percent lower seat-mile costs, twin-aisle comfort and lower deck container capability features, and to replace early small wide-body aircraft through 10 percent lower trip costs and wider aisles. Initial version to seat 222 passengers (equivalent to Boeing 757) and 204 passengers (equivalent to Boeing 767).

Design features: Transcontinental, 200- to 220-passenger transport; later stretch up to 295 seats exceeds Boeing 767 capacity by at least 10 percent; advanced aerofoil and high-aspect ratio wing technologies reduce drag by 14 percent from current airliners. Mach 0.8 cruise; range 3,000 n miles (5,556 km; 3,452 miles); extended-range options up to 5,500 n miles (10,186 km; 6,329 miles); fuselage cross-section twin aisle oval 5.18 m (17 ft 0 in) wide, 5.41 m (17 ft 9 in) high, two LD2 containers side-by-side in underfloor cargo compartments. Carbon composite wing box; main objective cost reduction; fly-by-wire signaling for control, sensor, and data distribution.

Power plant: Two wing-mounted advanced high-bypass engines such as Pratt & Whitney Advanced Ducted Propeller (ADP).

Dimensions, external (provisional)

Wing span: 44.98 m (147 ft 7 in)
Wing aspect ratio: 11.14
Length, fuselage: 43.79 m (143 ft 8 in)
Length, overall: 44.96 m (147 ft 6 in)
Height overall: 14.76 m (48 ft 5 in)
Tailplane span: 13.36 m (43 ft 10 in)
Wheel track: 7.92 m (26 ft 0 in)

Areas (provisional):
Wings, gross: 181.6 sq m (1,955.0 sq ft)
Vertical tail surfaces (total): 37.2 sq m (400.0 sq ft)
Horizontal tail surfaces (total): 35.7 sq m (384.0 sq ft)

Source: Jackson, Paul ed. Jane's All the World's Aircraft 1995-96 Jane's Information Group Ltd 1995 p. 604.
 

Graham1973

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2010
Messages
1,331
Reaction score
89

Attachments

Triton

Donald McKelvy
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
9,723
Reaction score
264
Website
deeptowild.blogspot.com
Artist's impression of McDonnell Douglas DC-XX concept, dubbed MD-11, from the early 1980s.


McDonnell Douglas developed a 180-seat twin-aisle concept in a 2-2-2 configuration in the early 1980s dubbed the DC-11. Delta Air Lines wanted to order 60 but MDC balked at the commitment, considering it too risky given the lack of interest from another US airline. The fuselage had a cross-section that was 22 in. wider than the 727/757, allowing for 17.7-in.-wide seats in doubles with two 18-in. aisles. In an all-economy layout at a 30-in. pitch, it could seat 214.
Source:
http://atwonline.com/aircraft-engines-components/news/boeing-focusing-twin-aisle-concept-737-replacement-will-be-announce?cid=nl_atw_dn&YM_RID=lcg@bilrevyen.no
 

Attachments

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672
hesham said:
Hi,

the MDC ATMR2 airliner aircraft project of 1978.

http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1978/1978%20-%200847.html?search=lockheed%20aircraft%20project%201978
Anther info about MDC ATMR,ATMR-2,ATMR-3 and ATMR-4;

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1978/1978%20-%202865.html
 

Attachments

Caravellarella

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
1,032
Reaction score
151
Dear Boys and Girls, here is an article about the McDonnell-Douglas ATMR II jet airliner "project" which (unusually) had a fuselage diameter sized for a six-abreast twin-aisle seating arrangement......

The article comes from the February 1980 issue of Air International......

Terry (Caravellarella)
 

Attachments

Caravellarella

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
1,032
Reaction score
151
Dear Boys and Girls, here is an article about the McDonnell-Douglas DC-XX jet airliner "project" which had a fuselage diameter sized for a six or seven-abreast twin-aisle seating arrangement......

The article comes from the November 1980 issue of Air International......

Terry (Caravellarella)
 

Attachments

Caravellarella

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
1,032
Reaction score
151
Dear Boys and Girls, here is an article about the McDonnell-Douglas DC-10 Super 60 series airliner "projects"; the DC-10-61, DC-10-62 and the DC-10-63. The projects are analogous to the DC-8 Super 60 series of 1965; the DC-10-61, DC-10-62 and the DC-10-63 bear the same basic relationship to the baseline McDonnell-Douglas DC-10-30 as the the DC-8-61, DC-8-62 and the DC-8-63 did to the original Douglas DC-8-53/54/55......

The DC-10-61, DC-10-62 and the DC-10-63 remained "projects", but the "project" work done would lead in due course to the McDonnell-Douglas MD-11......

The article comes from the January 1980 issue of Air International......

Terry (Caravellarella)
 

foiling

CLEARANCE: Secret
Joined
Aug 12, 2007
Messages
275
Reaction score
4
Caravellarella, I have found this whole discussion very interesting, especially your - now expected - huge contribution. Especially grateful for the article & 3-views of the McDonnell-Douglas DC-10 Super 60 series today. A very big & grateful thanks.
 

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672

Attachments

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672

Attachments

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672
Hi,


the McDonnell Douglas MD-89 was a project for 170 passenger airliner,here is with
turbofan engines.


http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1989/1989%20-%200683.html
 

Attachments

Mark Nankivil

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
1,559
Reaction score
226
Hi All -

Original artwork for what is noted as the DC-11:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/airline-mcdonnell-douglas-aircraft-painting-memorabilia-/281070427674?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item41711a5e1a

Enjoy the Day! Mark
 

Attachments

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672
Hi,


here is a stretched version of MD-11 airliner.


http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1989/1989%20-%201285.html
 

Attachments

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672
A very strange MD series,the amazing project is MD-90-40;


http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1990/1990%20-%203027.html
 

Attachments

Triton

Donald McKelvy
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
9,723
Reaction score
264
Website
deeptowild.blogspot.com
Very interesting concept!

Seller's description:
Mc Donnell Douglas Concept Proposal to KLM for DC-11 Double Deck 350 Passenger Plane in 1974.
This configuration was proposed to 10 major airline, none of which accepted the idea. the concensus was that if one went down it would do serious damage to the industry.
Original watercolor (gouache) painting on illustration board. Image size is 14" X 20". One of a kind. No other images exist. Signed by the artist David G. Beigle, renowned Aviation Illustrator. This is the last original painting to be sold.
 

Graham1973

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2010
Messages
1,331
Reaction score
89
Another DC-X-200 variant - The Energy Efficient Transport.

It has long been recognized that penalties in weight and trim drag along with the resultant increase in energy usage are incurred by utilizing the conventional solution to provide adequate longitudinal stability in aircraft.

These penalties could be reduced somewhat by incorporating artificial stability through an active control system. However it is difficult to determine the best combination of aircraft configuration and control system design because the process involves an interrelationship of flying qualities, reliability and safety, and the design and development of the control system.

The design must be governed also by certification and cost factors. Anticipating that a significant gain could be realized in the next generation of aircraft, it was proposed to consolidate into one study the principal considerations that would guide the selection of an acceptable standard.

It would seem logical that the flight integrity of the next generation of aircraft would not be allowed to depend completely upon the augmentation system. Accordingly in the event of any failure of the systemt the aircraft should be so configured as to permit the pilot to fly and land safely. In this sense, the augmentation system is described as having "low risk."

Development Of A Low-Risk Augmentation System For An Energy-Efficient Transport Having Relaxed Static Stability

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19820024501_1982024501.pdf
 

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672
Hi,


the McDonnell Dougals MD-11 and MD-12 series,also the projected versions,the
first time for me to know the AM-300,which proposed the designation MD-11SS if
launched as joint Airbus/MDC project.
 

Attachments

Grey Havoc

The path not taken.
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
9,708
Reaction score
503
Regarding the KC-10B, looks like it wasn't the first time the designation had been used:

It is not uncommon for a weapon system program to generate a
follow-on, or enhanced system, and the idea for a KC-10B arose in
July 1980 (23:100-103). This program would allow the KC-10 to
carry "outsize" cargo, such as the Army's XM2 infantry fighting
vehicle, the XM3 cavalry fighting vehicle, the M35A2 truck, and
light observation helicopters. To accommodate such equipment,

design changes would increase the cargo door to approximately
14 x 10 feet, reinforce the main cabin floor, revise the location
of certain equipment in the main cabin area, modify the cargo
handling system, and develop a new pallet. There were several
drawbacks to the KC-10B; however, such as a decrease in
unrefueled distance by about 200 miles, loss of provision for
carrying 55 passengers, loss of commonality with the KC--10A and
DC-10, and an additional cost of $1 million per aircraft. At the
end of 1980 any hope for developing a KC-10B vanished when
General Poe, now Commander of AFLC, declared (24:287-288):

I was going to die right in the door of the KC-10
before it was enlarged as some MAC and SAC people
wanted. It would have cost another million dollars
per airplane and would have made it about 81 percent
common with the civilian model instead of 88 percent
common as planned. I absolutely refused to even talk
about it.



23. Air Force Logistics Command. History of the Air Force
Logistics Command, October 1979-September 1980, Vol. 1,
K200.01, in USAF Collection, USAFHRC.

24. Air Force Logistics Command. History of the Air Force
Loalstics Command, October 1980-September 1981, Vol. 1,
K200.01, in USAF Collection, USAFHRC.
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a194398.pdf
 

carsinamerica

CLEARANCE: Confidential
Joined
Feb 19, 2010
Messages
110
Reaction score
10
hesham said:
Hi,


the McDonnell Dougals MD-11 and MD-12 series,also the projected versions,the
first time for me to know the AM-300,which proposed the designation MD-11SS if
launched as joint Airbus/MDC project.
What a list, Hesham! Look at how many times the same ideas reappear. I'd love to find something similar for all the proposed variants of the Boeing 747.
 

hesham

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
24,883
Reaction score
1,672
Hi Carsinamerica,


I think it is very hard to get list like this to Boeing 747.
 
Top