Focke Wulf Fw-187

Justo Miranda

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-Luftwaffe in WWII (3)
-Model Airplane International -oct.2008
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-Focke Wulf Fw-187 der vergessene Hochleistungsjäger-by Dietmar Hermann/Peter Petrick-Aviatik Verlag

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Justo Miranda

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-Model Airplane International -oct.2008
-Bob Banka Collection
-Focke Wulf Fw-187 der vergessene Hochleistungsjäger-by Dietmar Hermann/Peter Petrick-Aviatik Verlag

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Justo Miranda

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-Luftwaffe in WWII (3)
-Model Airplane International -oct.2008
-Bob Banka Collection
-Focke Wulf Fw-187 der vergessene Hochleistungsjäger-by Dietmar Hermann/Peter Petrick-Aviatik Verlag

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Justo Miranda

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-Luftwaffe in WWII (3)
-Model Airplane International -oct.2008
-Bob Banka Collection
-Focke Wulf Fw-187 der vergessene Hochleistungsjäger-by Dietmar Hermann/Peter Petrick-Aviatik Verlag

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AeroFranz

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One of my favorite designs...Kurt tank at his best. Thanks for this :)

PS: is there any truth to the often heard assertions that one of the Focke-Wulf engineers shot down an aircraft while protecting the factory?
 

blackkite

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Thanks Justo! I love this fighter very much.
 

Pepe Rezende

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Skybolt said:
Ah, the Falke, maybe the greatest lost opportunity for the Luftwaffe, even more the the 262.

Don't forget the He100... It had the right range to operate over London. The FW187 could be a terrific partner to it at the strategic theatre. In my opinion, the only use for BF110 was as a night fighter.

Cheers

Pepe
 

airman

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Pepe Rezende said:
Skybolt said:
Ah, the Falke, maybe the greatest lost opportunity for the Luftwaffe, even more the the 262.

Don't forget the He100... It had the right range to operate over London. The FW187 could be a terrific partner to it at the strategic theatre. In my opinion, the only use for BF110 was as a night fighter.

Cheers

Pepe
BF 110 could be used as light bomber and night fighter , and Fw 187 as fighter, but in real facts during trials of three Fw187 the german pilots had preferred Fw 187 to Bf 110 and for this reason Fw 187 was retired !
 

Hammer Birchgrove

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airman said:
Pepe Rezende said:
Skybolt said:
Ah, the Falke, maybe the greatest lost opportunity for the Luftwaffe, even more the the 262.

Don't forget the He100... It had the right range to operate over London. The FW187 could be a terrific partner to it at the strategic theatre. In my opinion, the only use for BF110 was as a night fighter.

Cheers

Pepe
BF 110 could be used as light bomber and night fighter , and Fw 187 as fighter, but in real facts during trials of three Fw187 the german pilots had preferred Fw 187 to Bf 110 and for this reason Fw 187 was retired !
For sake of clarity: Are you suggesting that the Bf 110 got elected because Willy Messerschmidt had lots of influence among the Nazi leaders? I think it's probable. Though I wonder why Kurt Tank and Ernst Heinkel wasn't as highly regarded...
 

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As originally conceived, the Fw 187 was a twin engined single seat fighter, whereas the RLM had a
"destroyer" in mind, with at least some means of rearward defence. Although with hindsight, the
Fw 187 may have done better, than the Bf 110, it was the aircraft, that matched the tender least.
And for a single seat fighter it may have seemed a waste of resources, as it needed two engines,
instead of only one.
 

saturncanuck

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Yes, the Fw 187 Falke was everything the Bf 110 should have been. Mind you the Hs 124 should have won the Rüstungsflugzeug III specification anyway. Still, the Fw 187 would have given the Luftwaffe more teeth and a longer range to do combat over London. If that had have happened, would I be writing this in German?
 

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Doubt it. Concerning airpower, Germany was, IMHO, at least 5-10 years ahead of everybody else. Their politics however doomed them. If you recall the Graf Zeppelin, She was navy but all flight crews were to air force and not subject to navy orders, only Goerings.
 

Nick Sumner

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fockewulf261 said:
Doubt it. Concerning airpower, Germany was, IMHO, at least 5-10 years ahead of everybody else.

Eh? In which universe?
 

fockewulf261

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Consider the fact that the Germans built and flew the first jet fighter (though no production was undertaken) in 1940. I'm not talking the Me 262 but Heinkel He 280. Everyone else were still experimenting with jet developement.
 
J

joncarrfarrelly

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Consider the fact that the Germans built and flew the first jet fighter (though no production was undertaken) in 1940. I'm not talking the Me 262 but Heinkel He 280. Everyone else were still experimenting with jet developement.
Try April 2, 1941 for the He 280's first powered flight and the HeS 8 engines were crap so it couldn't have been used as a fighter anyhow.

The Gloster E.28/39 specification was issued on February 3, 1940 and had its first flight on May 15, 1941. Provision for an armament of four .303 Browning MG had been made in the design of the aircraft.

Gloster started work to design an operational jet fighter before the E.28/39 was built and a Gloster brochure of August 1940 formed the basis of specification F.9/40 issued by the Ministry in November 1940. F.9/40 is, of course, the Gloster Meteor,
a far better aircraft than the He 280.

5 to 10 years ahead of everybody else, eh? Yeah, right.
 

Nick Sumner

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Looking at the issue in broader terms I would be hesitant to identify one nation or another as being 'ahead' by much in terms of aviation technology in the 1935-45 period - every nation had something that it did incredibly well - but if you must it is a two horse race between the Brits and the Germans and until 1943/44 when Nazi idiocy, wartime disruption and materials problems start to hamstring the German effort. If the war had gone into 46/47 the British lead in jet engine technology would have been even greater than it was in 44/45 as such technological train wrecks as the HeS011 would have been revealed. Before that neither side were ever ahead by more than a few months before the other caught up.

You really do 'pay your money and take your choice' on this question. British Jets, British and German piston engines, French cowling design for radials, French aircraft weapons design, the Japanese ability to get good performance from poor fuels, the American's ability to increase production by orders of magnitude, the Russian's acheivement in picking up their entire aircraft industry and moving it east while simplifying every process in production to increase output. All of these can be seen as demonstrating a lead.
 

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First drawing is from magazine the Aero plastic kits revue no. 70/1999. It is my work...
More link: http://www.modelforum.cz/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=41082

Cheers
Michal Bradáč
 

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Hammer Birchgrove

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Nick Sumner said:
Looking at the issue in broader terms I would be hesitant to identify one nation or another as being 'ahead' by much in terms of aviation technology in the 1935-45 period - every nation had something that it did incredibly well - but if you must it is a two horse race between the Brits and the Germans and until 1943/44 when Nazi idiocy, wartime disruption and materials problems start to hamstring the German effort. If the war had gone into 46/47 the British lead in jet engine technology would have been even greater than it was in 44/45 as such technological train wrecks as the HeS011 would have been revealed. Before that neither side were ever ahead by more than a few months before the other caught up.

You really do 'pay your money and take your choice' on this question. British Jets, British and German piston engines, French cowling design for radials, French aircraft weapons design, the Japanese ability to get good performance from poor fuels, the American's ability to increase production by orders of magnitude, the Russian's achievement in picking up their entire aircraft industry and moving it east while simplifying every process in production to increase output. All of these can be seen as demonstrating a lead.

With no intention of being jingoistic ;) , even a small nation such as Sweden could make innovative designs and produce them, such as the SAAB B/S17 dive bomber/photo recce aircraft/recce sea plane, SAAB B18 medium bomber/T18 "torpedo bomber" (actually using a Bofors 57 mm auto cannon), SAAB J/A21 push-prop fighter/ground attack aircraft with an ejector seat of domestic design and the FFVS J22 fighter (of conventional design, but using wood and steel instead of scarce aluminium and getting relatively good performance while using a good but not so strong engine).

BTW, I like to mention Poland's aircraft industry, which right before WWII were about to start to produce modern all metal aircrafts like the fighter PZL.50 Jastrząb and the medium bomber PZL.49 Miś, and Poland's air force had started to use the previous modern medium bomber PZL.37 Łoś.

Romania had its I.A.R. 80 fighter and its derivatives. I'm not sure if Czechoslovakia's AVIA had plans to develop a monoplane to replace the biplane fighter Avia B-534 (before the German annexation of the Czech Republic and forming of the "independent" Slovak Republic (forced to be an ally with Germany)).

Edit: Just checked, AVIA was about to manufacture the semi-modern monoplane fighter Avia B.35 before the German invasion in 1939 and after the invasion developed the improved Avia B-135. Avia and competing company Aero Vodochody also developed medium bombers, Avia B-158 and Aero A.300 before the war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avia_B.35

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avia_B-135

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avia_B-158

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aero_A.300
 

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joncarrfarrelly said:
F.9/40 is, of course, the Gloster Meteor,
a far better aircraft than the He 280.

5 to 10 years ahead of everybody else, eh? Yeah, right.

I can't agree that Germany was 10 years ahead of everybody else (if so, Luftwaffe would operate swept-wing transonic jet fighters during Battle of Britain ;) ), but I also don't think that Meteor was far better than He 280. The Meteor F.1 (676 km/h maximum speed) even wasn't much better than most of contemporary piston fighters...
 

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-Focke Wulf Fw-187 der vergessene Hochleistungsjäger-by Dietmar Hermann/Peter Petrick-Aviatic Verlag

I can highly recommend this book! :)
 

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MiBr said:
First drawing is from magazine the Aero plastic kits revue no. 70/1999. It is my work...
More link: http://www.modelforum.cz/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=41082

Cheers
Michal Bradáč
If you could draw that good in 1998, I'd sure like to see some of your current work! -SP :)
 

MiBr

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XB-70 Guy said:
If you could draw that good in 1998, I'd sure like to see some of your current work! -SP :)
My recent drawings of the Ar 196 are printed in the magazine REVI no.82 ( from the previous month ).

Cheers
Michal Bradáč
 

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AeroFranz

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Congratulations. These are as nice as any i've ever seen.
 

saturncanuck

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fightingirish said:
-Focke Wulf Fw-187 der vergessene Hochleistungsjäger-by Dietmar Hermann/Peter Petrick-Aviatic Verlag

I can highly recommend this book! :)

Also, "Clipped Wings -- World War Two Edition" has the Fw 187.

www.aerofile.ca
 

Pioneer

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Proposed Focke-Wulf Fw 187 Falke variants

G'day gents
I have just found an article about one of my favorite German WWII fighter designs - the Focke-Wulf Fw 187 Falke.
Most of us would know it's background, as an excellent and potential design the RLM and Luftwaffe did not want.
But I have just found the following -


Kurt Tank studied a wide variety of new versions of the Focke-Wulf Fw 187 Falke basic airframe (after it’s rejection by the RLM for wide spread production and service), everything from dive bomber, night fighter, fighter-bomber, high-altitude interceptor (with greater wingspan and lengthened rear fuselage) and others. These sported a variety of engines, including the Daimler-Benz DB 601, DB 605 and even the BMW 801 radial.

Does anyone have anything on these projects?
Particuly of interest to me is the high-altitude interceptor (with greater wingspan and lengthened rear fuselage)

Thanks in advanced

Regards
Pioneer
 

cluttonfred

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Re: Proposed Focke-Wulf Fw 187 Falke variants

A search in this group for "Falke" turns up several threads...I'm just saying.
 

sienar

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Would anyone happen to have info on what type of airfoil was used?
 

blackkite

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Hi!

http://alternathistory.com/tyazhelyi-istrebitel-focke-wulf-fw187-falke-germaniya

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueuoirOohQI
 

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blackkite

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;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh1Sd9yJ_Hw
 

blackkite

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focke-Wulf_Fw_187

"Prototype(V1?)...
The engine nacelles were relatively normal, including both the engine and the main landing gear storage, but the front-mounted radiators for the engines were retractable for high speed when less frontal area would be needed to get the same airflow (an idea which was in some vogue at the time, and also used in the French Morane-Saulnier MS.406)."

http://s199.photobucket.com/user/kemmell/media/fw187-1.jpg.html

http://lmk.vsetin.org/?clanek=81

http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fww2/ms406.html

http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fww2/ms405.html

http://lapatrouillesimple.forumgratuit.org/t10-morane-saulnier-406

http://www.fliegerweb.com/de/reports/Geschichte/Die+Focke+Wulf+Fw-187-13

http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/fw187-2.html

http://www.warbirdphotographs.com/luftwaffephotos/lfw1871.htm
 

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blackkite

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sienar said:
Would anyone happen to have info on what type of airfoil was used?
I can not find Fw187 airfoil.
http://m-selig.ae.illinois.edu/ads/aircraft.html

Like this?
Wing Root Airfoil Wing Tip Airfoil
Focke Wulf Fw 190 Wurger NACA 23015.3 NACA 23009
 

Flitzer

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Found these in my back files...the Stuka project version.
 

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blackkite

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Oh high speed Stuka with air cooling engine!! Thanks a lot. :D
 

Flitzer

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blackkite said:
Oh high speed Stuka with air cooling engine!! Thanks a lot. :D

Ah I'm no expert :eek:. Configuration/spec via the original progress thread. Who am I to argue? ;) ;D

P
 

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Do you think that the Fw 187, had it been cleared for production, could have been developed into a fighter which
was on par with the De Havilland DH 103 Hornet boasting with similar performance and capabilities?
 
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