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Chinese Stealth bomber program - XAC H-X (H-20)

Blitzo

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PaulMM (Overscan) said:
My opinion - H-20 will fly first and enter service long before PAK DA.
More fun to guess would be whether H-20 or B-21 will make their maiden flight first... And bonus fun if both end up looking very similar to each other.
 

FighterJock

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Blitzo said:
PaulMM (Overscan) said:
My opinion - H-20 will fly first and enter service long before PAK DA.
More fun to guess would be whether H-20 or B-21 will make their maiden flight first... And bonus fun if both end up looking very similar to each other.
I would not be surprised if the H-20 did end up being like the B-21 Raider, there is not a lot that you can do to for a stealth bomber in terms of design using current technology.
 

flateric

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I guess just like AVIC was trolling NG with their Super Bowl 'Hangar' ad with curtailed aircraft that turned out to be not B-21 configuration selected, H-20 will not be cranked delta as well.
Would be interesting to check my understanding of Chinese psychology.
 

flateric

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It definitely will not look like this
 

Deltafan

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kcran567 said:
Any chance it will not look like a flying wing or cranked kite...

and maybe look more like this...
From where comes the fifth plane in the red circle before the four J-20 ? Is it a fake or an old project or an artist view ?
 

Blitzo

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Deltafan said:
kcran567 said:
Any chance it will not look like a flying wing or cranked kite...

and maybe look more like this...
From where comes the fifth plane in the red circle before the four J-20 ? Is it a fake or an old project or an artist view ?
just a fan made CGI or doctored photo
 

antigravite

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Hi,

I'm not quite sure this is related to this thread but it may fit in. Found a Chinese stealth UAV patent issued in March of 2018.

Patent number: CN207141406.
Title: Stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle driving system of all-wing aircraft overall arrangement
Applicant(s): XIAN UAVTOP AVIATION TECH CO LTD +
Inventor: 不公告发明人
Abstract:
The utility model relates to an unmanned air vehicle technique field, the utility model discloses an overcoming the not enough of current unmanned aerial vehicle driving system stealth effect difference, and providing a stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle driving system of all-wing aircraft overall arrangement, it includes intake duct, turbine jet engine and the jet pipe of following aircraft nose to tail and connecting gradually, the inlet set of above -mentioned intake duct is square at quick-witted back, its cross-section, the lower limb and the coincidence of unmanned aerial vehicle leading edge of above -mentioned air inlet, above -mentioned inlet set has the radar shielding net of being made by conducting material, and above -mentioned radar shielding netlist face and stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle surface keep camber continuous to lead to with stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle surface conductance.

A.
 

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Deltafan

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Blitzo said:
Deltafan said:
kcran567 said:
Any chance it will not look like a flying wing or cranked kite...

and maybe look more like this...
From where comes the fifth plane in the red circle before the four J-20 ? Is it a fake or an old project or an artist view ?
just a fan made CGI or doctored photo
OK, thanks for the answer.
 

flateric

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antigravite said:
Hi,

I'm not quite sure this is related to this thread but it may fit in. Found a Chinese stealth UAV patent issued in March of 2018.

Patent number: CN207141406.
Title: Stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle driving system of all-wing aircraft overall arrangement
Applicant(s): XIAN UAVTOP AVIATION TECH CO LTD +
Inventor: 不公告发明人
Abstract:
The utility model relates to an unmanned air vehicle technique field, the utility model discloses an overcoming the not enough of current unmanned aerial vehicle driving system stealth effect difference, and providing a stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle driving system of all-wing aircraft overall arrangement, it includes intake duct, turbine jet engine and the jet pipe of following aircraft nose to tail and connecting gradually, the inlet set of above -mentioned intake duct is square at quick-witted back, its cross-section, the lower limb and the coincidence of unmanned aerial vehicle leading edge of above -mentioned air inlet, above -mentioned inlet set has the radar shielding net of being made by conducting material, and above -mentioned radar shielding netlist face and stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle surface keep camber continuous to lead to with stealthy unmanned aerial vehicle surface conductance.

A.
Apparently not related to H-20, nonetheless interesting
https://youtu.be/uzVK7j0eCCk
 

lastdingo

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There's a photo, apparently meant to depict H-20:
https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/2179198/after-heavy-investment-chinas-next-generation-weapons-and

I try to attach.

edit: attachment works. I want to clarify that I have no clue whether it's fake.
 

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flateric

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Another vivid example of SCMP news level.
 

Grey Havoc

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To be fair, they weren't trying to pass off the image as the H-20; the image was being used just for illustrative purposes, and appears to have originally created by state television (in this case CCTV 7) from some older footage to give an idea to it's audience of what the H-20 could look like.
 

totoro

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Aviationweek article is behind a paywall. Anyway, as it cites the DIA report, I read through that. What it does mention is a prospective long-range stealth bomber and a prospective next generation fighter-bomber. Which may or may not be stealthy, though in this day and age it seems prudent to assume it's going to be stealthy.

Since JH-7 was also labeled by DIA as a fighter-bomber, that mystery plane might be better labeled as a tactical strike plane. Serving a role like F-15E for USAF or Su-34 for RuAF.

But all that being said, the DIA report doesn't really seem all that credible. It's basically a rehash of known facts and rumors. Appears cobbled up from various public sources, perhaps by some low level "analysts".

While there have been rumors of a tactical bomber for PLAAF, there haven't been any indications coming from official sources. Unlike with the big strategic bomber that we know is indeed coming.

All that doesn't mean PLAAF won't indeed replace their JH7 planes with such a new bomber. We simply don't know. PLANAF may have recently gotten some J-16 planes. IF they substitute their own JH7 with them, it may be a precedent for PLAAF to follow as well.
 

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totoro said:
Aviationweek article is behind a paywall. Anyway, as it cites the DIA report, I read through that. What it does mention is a prospective long-range stealth bomber and a prospective next generation fighter-bomber. Which may or may not be stealthy, though in this day and age it seems prudent to assume it's going to be stealthy.

Since JH-7 was also labeled by DIA as a fighter-bomber, that mystery plane might be better labeled as a tactical strike plane. Serving a role like F-15E for USAF or Su-34 for RuAF.

But all that being said, the DIA report doesn't really seem all that credible. It's basically a rehash of known facts and rumors. Appears cobbled up from various public sources, perhaps by some low level "analysts".

While there have been rumors of a tactical bomber for PLAAF, there haven't been any indications coming from official sources. Unlike with the big strategic bomber that we know is indeed coming.

All that doesn't mean PLAAF won't indeed replace their JH7 planes with such a new bomber. We simply don't know. PLANAF may have recently gotten some J-16 planes. IF they substitute their own JH7 with them, it may be a precedent for PLAAF to follow as well.
The DIA assumes both will be stealthy bombers. Perhaps that new 'medium bomber' could be a variant of the J-20?

http://www.dia.mil/Portals/27/Documents/News/Military%20Power%20Publications/China_Military_Power_FINAL_5MB_20190103.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1I4ErB0VCYQUiMmrpg82NGWUJRuFwAki4dtyUwS6GAIuFuTg_FFNRy4Dw
 

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Deino

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datafuser said:
Yes, but overall I must admit; I'm a disappointed. My biggest concern is that this report does not mention any source and given how these reports usually were put together in recent years I expect that simply open source reports and rumours were summarised.

This surely relates only for this regional bomber, for which NO official reports are available and I'm highly sceptical that they have better - or even official - reports than we now from several forums or well-known public reports. Also, there have been already published ones since years: I noted it in the Jamestown-report I think two years ago, Rick Joe did a most impressive summary for The Diplomat and there are more to quote:

https://thediplomat.com/2018/05/chinas-future-stealth-bomber-fleet/

I know some will argue, that intelligence sources are usually not revealed and this is an intelligence based report. But let me admit that given some very easily avoidable mistakes in this report (like the expected An-225) but also in older ones, where systems are mentioned, which never existed, were long retired and so on I sometimes have my doubts on these "intelligence sources".

Deino
 

aonestudio

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Variant of the J-20 like this.

China's most advanced stealth fighter jet J-20 could be developed into a bomber, electric warfare (EW) aircraft and a carrier-based variant, Chinese military experts said on Wednesday as latest reports suggested a two-seat version of the warplane is under development.

The current J-20 is a basic version, and it is by design highly customizable, Song Zhongping, a military expert and TV commentator, told the Global Times on Wednesday.

Outfitting the warplane with a second seat allows it to play multiple roles in addition to winning air superiority, Song said, noting that the two-seat version can be further developed into a tactical bomber or EW aircraft.

http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1135957.shtml
 

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LowObservable

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His name may sound like a runaway pinball machine but he has a good point.
 

lastdingo

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The landing gear doesn't allow for much of an AOA during landing. I doubt that the J-20 could be modified into a carrier aircraft without major redesign. It's also awfully large (though Vigilante was huge as well).
 

Deino

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J-20 and carrier speculations??? You are in the wrong thread!
 

zebra159357

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Does anyone have an idea when is the 70th anniversary of the PLAAF taking place ? There were rumors about a year ago about a possible rollout of the H-20.
 

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Regarding the object, optionnaly manned scaled down prototype (swappable front section)??!

Edit:
Added interrogative points and exclamation to emphasize the conjoncturel content.
 
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Foo Fighter

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An awful lot has been written about this topic but conjecture reigns supreme, facts are in very short supply as is logical in such a tightly controlled nation.
 

Deino

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Does anyone have an idea when is the 70th anniversary of the PLAAF taking place ? There were rumors about a year ago about a possible rollout of the H-20.

The true anniversary will be on November 11th, but the celebrations were just the last days from October 18th to 21st with a dedicated air show.
Regarding these rumours, they were simply stupid reports hyped up by stupid reporters and eagerly reposted by not much cleverer other sites. In fact anyone with tbe slightest understanding of the PLAAF knew from the beginning that these were nothing but fake.
 

Deino

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To be fair, they weren't trying to pass off the image as the H-20; the image was being used just for illustrative purposes, and appears to have originally created by state television (in this case CCTV 7) from some older footage to give an idea to it's audience of what the H-20 could look like.

They were ... Come on, and why then did they say this and not that it clearly is NOT a well known FAKE?

"A possible prototype image of the H-20 stealth bomber. Photo: CCTV"

Thanks plain wrong a lie... nothing more, nothing less.


FAKE H-20.JPG
 

FighterJock

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I am getting rather tiered of that image. Let’s all wait until the actual H-20 design is ready to be revealed, rather than getting exited about somebody’s photoshopped image.
 

kaiserd

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IIRC, a TsAGI model used to analyse the YF-22's aerodynamics.View attachment 620757
No
Thanks. Can you update me?

My recollection is that the Russian Secret Projects Fighter book and other sources from that time had this (or something similar) as a potential Yak design.
It’s definitely not a YF-22 or F-22; apart from very general configuration (twin engined, twin tails) the detail of the design is almost completely different.
 

In_A_Dream

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You have to keep in mind the Chinese have pillaged US defense contractors and we still do have black aircraft out there that fulfill certain roles (some that may no longer be in operation as well). It wouldn't surprise me if we saw one or two airframes emerge out of China that mirror some of those aircraft (maybe not as far as capability, but in terms of the air frame). After all, they did get their hands deep into Sandia & Los Alamos (and this was decades ago) to assist their nuclear program. Would love to be a fly on the wall out near the Gobi Desert.
 

flateric

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IIRC, a TsAGI model used to analyse the YF-22's aerodynamics.View attachment 620757
No
Thanks. Can you update me?

My recollection is that the Russian Secret Projects Fighter book and other sources from that time had this (or something similar) as a potential Yak design.
It’s definitely not a YF-22 or F-22; apart from very general configuration (twin engined, twin tails) the detail of the design is almost completely different.
That was multi-parameter TsAGI in-house test model dubbed Lamprey (Minoga) from early 90s. Allowed testing zillion configurations from canard delta to pure canard and classic four-poster. Was not directly affiliated with any design bureaus studies.

And now we can stop with off-topic,
 

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