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Author Topic: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)  (Read 33543 times)

Offline raravia

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Have you ever heard about the Zeppelin/SNCASO  ZSO 523?

I´ve been trying to find info about it, but it was very hard, all I have is it was a big aircraft with six engines.

Raravia
« Last Edit: January 12, 2013, 03:02:57 pm by Stargazer2006 »

Offline Archibald

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2006, 12:42:13 pm »
SNCASO = french firm (nationalised aviation industry , 1936)
ZSO looks like a merge of Zeppelin and SO. Try SO-523 maybe?
Conservatoire de l'Air et de l'Espace d'Aquitaine
http://www.caea.info/en/plan.php

Profanity: weaker mind trying to speak forcefully

Political correctness: just bury your head in the sand for the sake of appeasement and "peace for our time"
- https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serge_Dassault#Affaires_

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2006, 12:54:37 pm »
It was a development of the Me 323 Gigant, transfered to Zeppelin and Sud-Ouest,
with an tow of about 95.000 kg, and a payload of 46.800 kg. Span would have been
70,0 m, lenght 40,25m .Regarding the FLUGREVUE article, where I found this 3-view,
too, development of this aircraft reached a very detailed stage, but ended, of course,
when France was freed by the allies in 1944.
Some years ago, I've asked in another forum, if this development was followed in France
after the war, but unfortunately not. Would be nice stuff for my collection ...
Or is there anyone, who has other information ?
Who's interested in the article, just drop a PM, but please be patient for about 3 weeks,
because tomorrow morning my holidays begin !!!  .   :D  :D  :D
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline Archibald

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2006, 01:10:29 pm »
Eureka! During WWII, SNCASO and Zeppelin were surely colaborating. Found a wabsite (in an unknwon language, sorry!) but apparently your aircraft is linked to the Me 323 (the monstruous glider Me-321 with six Gnome Rhone 14M). during France occupation, the Germans asked France to produce all their secondary aircrafts (Me-108, Do-24, Ju-52...). They could concentred on fighters and bombers...
look here
http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str222.htm
Conservatoire de l'Air et de l'Espace d'Aquitaine
http://www.caea.info/en/plan.php

Profanity: weaker mind trying to speak forcefully

Political correctness: just bury your head in the sand for the sake of appeasement and "peace for our time"
- https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serge_Dassault#Affaires_

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2006, 01:19:10 pm »
This website refers to the same article , as I did (FlugRevue 4.77). No, I can't read it, too,
 it's in polish language. But I could try a translation, or at least a summary from the original #
text  into english, for those, who can' read german.
It's a good task, while lying on the beach !   ;D
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline raravia

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2006, 04:38:36 pm »


Thanks Jemiba, time to learn polish, take a soda, or a better drink and please send me the article when you get back form the beach.

Gracias

Raravia

Offline Skybolt

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2006, 05:04:29 am »
As an addendum, I'd like to mention another Zeppelin project aparently resulting from the collaboration with SNCSO: a double deck long, distance high-capacity civilian airliner. It's mentioned in the Nowarra Deutsche Lusftstrung, vol. 4. This night I'll post a scan. It's really impressive (big windows on the ceiling..., just to mention one feature)

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2006, 01:15:20 pm »
Here's the translation of the FlugRevue article about the ZSO 523.
Perhaps one of our native english speakers could give a correction ?
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline toura

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2009, 06:16:03 am »
Hi all,
We, all, know the ME 321 and ME 323.
I have few on the ZEPPELIN:SNCASO ME 523
But I 've nothing on the project Messerscchmitt Zeppelin me 423 !
Could someone give something on this project ?
I thank you, if you could answer
THANKS

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2009, 11:55:52 am »
In "Willy Messerschmitt - Pionier der Luftfahrt und des Leichtbaus" two Messerschmitt
projects, P.1202 for a heavy and 1203 for a medium transport are mentioned, both based
on the Me 323. May there be some connections ?
« Last Edit: July 13, 2009, 12:17:07 pm by Jemiba »
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline Würger

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2009, 03:00:44 pm »
Hans-Peter Dabrowski, in the chapter "Die Abteilung Flugzeugbau der Luftschiffbau Zeppelin GMBH 1942 bis 1945" from the book "Zeppelins Flieger", page 252, mentions the Z Me 423 as included in a report dated 3rd September 1943 , with no additional data. Maybe it was the Z Me 323 H with six BMW 801 ("8801-TP-Motoren" in the original), as Walter Stender, the chief proving designer, intended to do.

In the book Jemiba mentioned, nothing more to add, but I have never heard about Messerschmitt projects beyond 1112. Can you please tell in which page you have found it?

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2009, 09:23:50 pm »
Sorry, should have made this clearer, I think :
The P.1202 was proposed post-war, but was closely based on the
Me 323. So my thoughts just were, if it could have been in fact a
"recycled" project from war times ?
(page 367)
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline toura

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2009, 02:33:58 am »
Dear JEMIBA and WURGER.

Thanks you for your answers.

Now I have a new question ! ,as Wurger, I stop Me projects at P1112
and you speak of after war projects P1202 & 1203 with a three views. I don't know.
Very well, I learn.
Well, but after the war I only know M.B.B. and no projects in the 1200 serie ?

In an other hand, In these rubrique, page 38, dated 08.13.2006, a long time ago
I found a three views of the ZSO 523  and also a three views of a big Zeppelin pusher
what is the reference of this studie ?

Excuse me for this questions !!
THANK YOU VERY MUCH
Bye

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2009, 03:34:43 am »
I'll send you the projects list from the mentioned book and the articles about
the ZSO 523 and the airliner this evening.

MBB was actually founded as late as 1969 and Messerschmitt developed quite
a lot of designs in the meantime, although not only aircraft ! His most famous
non-aircraft probably was this :
(photo from wikipedia)
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline toura

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Re: Messerschmitt Me 321/323, pre- and follow-on projects (ZSO 523)
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2009, 04:38:05 am »
HI JEMIBA.
Thanks. i'm waiting...
I'm an old man, I remenber that I saw this Messerschmitt ' car.
Bye