WW1 and WW2 Never Built Warship Designs

Could you please quantify your request? What do you mean by "lesser known"?
There would well be over hundred such never-built designs for both world wars, including all the involved nations.
Many of them you'll find through searching this section of the forum.
 
I would say a few thousand unrealized projects, designs, preliminaries and refit/modernization proposals from submarines through corvettes and frigates/avisos, cruisers to battleships and carriers.
Indeed what is lesser known means to you?
 
Tzoli said:
I would say a few thousand unrealized projects, designs, preliminaries and refit/modernization proposals from submarines through corvettes and frigates/avisos, cruisers to battleships and carriers.
Indeed what is lesser known means to you?
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Like cruiser, destroyer and battleship designs from WW1 and 2 from South America, Poland, Romania, Asia, Netherlands etc. Lesser known designs to me are non-major designs that aren't from the major world powers during WW1 and 2. Ones that have drawings, pictures and stats.
 
Yes to pretty much all of the above, with the caveat that they all went to the major powers for their designs.

See the South American Dreadnought Race for one famous group of designs.
 
Select one country. If you want Asia excluding Japan that will be a short list.
 
Hood said:
Could you please quantify your request? What do you mean by "lesser known"?
There would well be over hundred such never-built designs for both world wars, including all the involved nations.
Many of them you'll find through searching this section of the forum.
Click to expand...
There are so many pages of post-war ever-built designs over the 12 pages that exist, I've already looked through most of them which are from major powers.
 
For Asia
Designs for China:
These are for Nationalist China. I do not know projects for the two other Cliques that had access to the sea: Manchuria and Guangxi Clique.

For other Asian countries that leaves Thailand/Siam. Though there are only 4+1 projects I know.
The Naresuan class Light Cruisers which became the Etna class in Italian non-service
Vickers Export designs:
A Destroyer in 1938
A Light Cruiser Design 1087 in 1938
Armstrong designs:
An Armoured Cruiser Design 423 in 1903
Also 4 more sister ships for the Sinsamudar class Submarines

I do not know any projects for the Philippines, India or Burma/Myanmar.
And that is all for Asia.
All current existing countries there did not existed pre-WW2.
 
Vickers Destroyer Export Design 1056 from 1938:
Displacement: 2.000tons (standard) 2.320tons (full load)
Dimensions: 106,68(pp) x 11,43 x 3,27 meters
Armament:
2x1 120mm/45 QF Mk IX
2x1 76mm/45 QF HA Mk IV
2x4 533mm Torpedo Tubes

Vickers Light Cruiser Export Design 1087 from 1938:
Displacement: 4.550tons (standard)
Dimensions: 137,16(pp) x 144,78(wl) x 145,69(oa) x 14,48 x 4,34 meters
Speed: 56km/h (30knots)
Armour: 50mm over Magazines, 75mm Over Machinery Belt, 40mm Deck
Armament:
3x2 150mm/50 likely Wilton-Fijenoord Mark 9 or a Bofors Gun
6x1 75mm/50 likely Bofors m/36
4x2 40mm/56 Bofors m/36
2x3 457 or 533mm Torpedo Tubes
 
Tzoli said:
For Asia
Designs for China:
These are for Nationalist China. I do not know projects for the two other Cliques that had access to the sea: Manchuria and Guangxi Clique.

For other Asian countries that leaves Thailand/Siam. Though there are only 4+1 projects I know.
The Naresuan class Light Cruisers which became the Etna class in Italian non-service
Vickers Export designs:
A Destroyer in 1938
A Light Cruiser Design 1087 in 1938
Armstrong designs:
An Armoured Cruiser Design 423 in 1903
Also 4 more sister ships for the Sinsamudar class Submarines

I do not know any projects for the Philippines, India or Burma/Myanmar.
And that is all for Asia.
All current existing countries there did not existed pre-WW2.
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Japan also has export cruise designs for Thailand，But there is no detailed information
 
Dhonburi preliminaries?
And CL proposals?
 
Dilandu said:
It's them, yeah. And to think that less than ten years ago their team was actually quite embarassed when they put "Emden" (premium German cruiser of WW1) fake funnel the wrong place, and players noticed that...
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That's because once they realized that it wasn't going to affect the revenue stream, they also realized they no longer had to care.
 
Where there any British inter-war battleship designs like the L2 offered to Spain?
 
A ton. And L2 was not offered to Spain. The N3/G3 series were Top Secret at the time. Vickers offered a Nelson like design for Spain.
 
Godzilla37 said:
Where there any British inter-war battleship designs like the L2 offered to Spain?
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It's important to remember that the Washington Treaty barred the signatories from building battleships for export, so in general there's no trade in battleships from 1922 until the building holiday expired in the 1930s. However the UK and Spain were in a unique position, there was a Vickers shipyard actually in Spain.
 
What was the largest battleship design offered to Spain? Since Italy offered Spain to build four Vittorio Veneto class battleships (providing all of the necessary material and modernizing the Spanish shipyards to build them) would it have been possible for Italy to have offered Spain the UP41 design if Italy didn't enter WW2?
 
Godzilla37 said:
What was the largest battleship design offered to Spain? Since Italy offered Spain to build four Vittorio Veneto class battleships (providing all of the necessary material and modernizing the Spanish shipyards to build them) would it have been possible for Italy to have offered Spain the UP41 design if Italy didn't enter WW2?
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No UP41,no ship for wows
 
Godzilla37 said:
What was the largest battleship design offered to Spain? Since Italy offered Spain to build four Vittorio Veneto class battleships (providing all of the necessary material and modernizing the Spanish shipyards to build them) would it have been possible for Italy to have offered Spain the UP41 design if Italy didn't enter WW2?
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The España class were the smallest dreadnoughts of all, and that was without an economy wrecked by civil war. If Italy wanted Spain building Vittori Venetos then supplying all the necessary materials would have to include all the gold needed to fund them. Chances of them being able to fund even one UP41 are pretty minimal.
 
Certainly didn't help that the Soviet Union had effectively stolen most of Spain's gold reserves during the latter part of the Spanish Civil War.
 
DWG said:
It's important to remember that the Washington Treaty barred the signatories from building battleships for export, so in general there's no trade in battleships from 1922 until the building holiday expired in the 1930s. However the UK and Spain were in a unique position, there was a Vickers shipyard actually in Spain.
Click to expand...
Actually it didn't. Articles XV, XVI and XVII specifically dealt with this matter:

Article XV

No vessel of war constructed within the jurisdiction of any of the Contracting Powers for a non-Contracting Power shall exceed the limitations as to displacement and armament prescribed by the present Treaty for vessels of a similar type which may be constructed by or for any of the Contracting Powers; provided, however, that the displacement for aircraft carriers constructed for a non-Contracting Power shall in no case exceed 27,000 tons (27,432 metric tons) standard displacement.

Article XVI

If the construction of any vessel of war for a non-Contracting Power is undertaken within the jurisdiction of any of the Contracting Powers, such Power shall promptly inform the other Contracting Powers of the date of the signing of the contract and the date on which the keel of the ship is laid; and shall also communicate to them the particulars relating to the ship prescribed in Chapter II, Part 3, Section I (b), (4) and (5).

Article XVII

In the event of a Contracting Power being engaged in war, such Power shall not use as a vessel of war any vessel of war which may be under construction within its jurisdiction for any other Power, or which may have been constructed within its jurisdiction for another Power and not delivered.
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The misconception of "Washington treaty limited export" was born out of British inter-war paranoia - the notion that export building of warships could be somehow used by USA and Japan to either claim that Britain broke the treaty (and thus they aren't obliged to it anymore) or claim that due to threat of non-participating countries the terms must be re-evaluated. Basically Britain feared that other nations need only an excuse to start a new naval arm-race - to which Britain in late 1920s - early 1930s was even less prepared than in 1922.
 
Godzilla37 said:
Some interesting things I found from https://alnavco.com/content/modeling_historic_notes/pdfs/alnavco_the_fleet_that_never_was.pdf so far:
US Max Fast BB: Displacement: 72,500 tons Length: 975' Width: 107' Speed: 30 knots Armament: 8-20”(4x2) and 20-5”/38(10x2)
US CA Scheme M: Date: June 1940 Displacement: 17,300 tons Length: 735’ Width: 74’ 82 Speed: 33.2 knots Armament: 10-10” (2x2,2x3)
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Off the top of my head, I can verify the 72,000 ton fast battleship. It is one of the two "Maximum Battleships of 1934". It is documented in Friedman's "U.S. Battleships: An Illustrated Design History" pg. 235. If there is a drawing of the fast version, I have never seen it.

I'll have to look up the cruiser.

DRW
 
drwells42 said:
Off the top of my head, I can verify the 72,000 ton fast battleship. It is one of the two "Maximum Battleships of 1934". It is documented in Friedman's "U.S. Battleships: An Illustrated Design History" pg. 235. If there is a drawing of the fast version, I have never seen it.

I'll have to look up the cruiser.

DRW
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Another interesting one I found:
Projekt KW45 Displacement: 45,000 tons Length: 984’ Width: 111’ Speed: 36-37 knots Armament: 8-15”/47 (4x2), 12-5.9”/55 (4x3), 8-4.1” (4x2) and 8-21” TT Armor: 8"
Opera Snapshot_2024-05-20_224522_alnavco.com.png
Prokjet KW50 is basically the same as KW45 but with Displacement: 50,000 tons Width: 121' Speed: 35 knots Armor: 11.8"
 
Godzilla37 said:
Another interesting one I found:
Projekt KW45 Displacement: 45,000 tons Length: 984’ Width: 111’ Speed: 36-37 knots Armament: 8-15”/47 (4x2), 12-5.9”/55 (4x3), 8-4.1” (4x2) and 8-21” TT Armor: 8"
View attachment 729604
Prokjet KW50 is basically the same as KW45 but with Displacement: 50,000 tons Width: 121' Speed: 35 knots Armor: 11.8"
Click to expand...
It's not a new thing, basically everything that you get in the wows fans group has been discussed,
 
drwells42 said:
I'll have to look up the cruiser.
Click to expand...

OK, I looked up the cruiser. It is mentioned in Friedman's U.S. Cruisers: An Illustrated Design History, pg 297, but there is no illustration. If a drawing exists, I haven't seen it. Friedman doesn't even provide tabular data for it, though it might be reasonable to assume that the hull was similar to Type MM.

DRW
 
Godzilla37 said:
There's nothing like this in any WOWS "fan group" the only thing in WOWS similar to it is the premium tier IX cruiser Admiral Schröder which has 4x2 305 mm guns, 3x3 150 mm secondaries and 10x2 128 mm secondaries.
Admiral_Schröder_wows_main.jpg

You can go search for Projekt KW45 in whatever WOWS fan group you are talking about.
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Well，You're even looking for the wrong thing, this is Weimar Germany's 1928 cruiser killer , has nothing about KW45
Stop playing World of Warships
1928_German_BC_McLau_3392E2.jpg
 
Godzilla37 said:
There's nothing like this in any WOWS "fan group" the only thing in WOWS similar to it is the premium tier IX cruiser Admiral Schröder which has 4x2 305 mm guns, 3x3 150 mm secondaries and 10x2 128 mm secondaries.
Click to expand...

That looks like an evolution of the 1928 "Zenker" battlecruiser, which never got off the drawing board. It is also quite well known.

DRW
 
Godzilla37 said:
Another interesting one I found:
Projekt KW45 Displacement: 45,000 tons Length: 984’ Width: 111’ Speed: 36-37 knots Armament: 8-15”/47 (4x2), 12-5.9”/55 (4x3), 8-4.1” (4x2) and 8-21” TT Armor: 8"

Prokjet KW50 is basically the same as KW45 but with Displacement: 50,000 tons Width: 121' Speed: 35 knots Armor: 11.8"
Click to expand...

IIRC, these two were designed by a private shipyard rather than the Warship Construction Office (K-Amt), and were never seriously considered for construction.

They are notable for their 5-shaft propulsion system.

DRW
 
cattalonX said:
Well，You're even looking for the wrong thing, this is Weimar Germany's 1928 cruiser killer , has nothing about KW45
Stop playing World of Warships
View attachment 729607
Click to expand...
That's still Admiral Schröder. Check https://alnavco.com/content/modeling_historic_notes/pdfs/alnavco_the_fleet_that_never_was.pdf for Projeckt KW45 it's there.
Here is an excerpt from page 56: "More intriguing were projects KW45 and KW50 designed between June and September 1939. These plans were found by Capt (Ret) Ken Johnson and placed in the National Archives. Reports issued by the Director of Naval Intelligence on 8/29/45 contained capture documentation of submarines, cruisers, destroyers, battleships and carriers. Discussed by the “Neubauausschuss” during the 1939 time period, no other previous or subsequent mention of these ships have been found in the German archives. Immense, fast, under-armed and under-armored battlecruisers had advanced designs completed but were never approved. These would have suffered from the same design defects as the OPQs but remain intriguing ships."
 

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