What kind Wind Turbine is this ?

[Michel Van]

I need your Help
in 1970s this kind Wind Turbine was proposed
(here illustrated by Roger Leloup in 1976)
has some one more information about this ?

 

[Fluff]

Will This Massive Solar-Wind Tunnel Ever Be More Than a Pipe Dream?

The project has new land and water agreements, but no track record—and more debt.

www.greentechmedia.com

 

[publiusr]

I have heard of tornado power towers for decades

Increasing fossil-fuel power by 40% with a green, clean tornado turbocharger - ExtremeTech

Peter Thiel, the billionaire co-founder of PayPal and now a venture capitalist and philanthropist, has decided that harnessing tornadoes is the future of green energy production.

www.extremetech.com

https://inhabitat.com/tornado-tower-features-energy-generating-facade-and-countless-pearls/

Popular Science January 1977 Vintage Magazine Tornado Turbine PSB Scanner | eBay

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[Michel Van]

Thanks Publiusr

here the article in question

Popular Science

Popular Science gives our readers the information and tools to improve their technology and their world. The core belief that Popular Science and our readers share: The future is going to be better, and science and technology are the driving forces that will help make it better.

books.google.de

 

[Justo Miranda]

Hi

 

[Charlesferdinand]

Will This Massive Solar-Wind Tunnel Ever Be More Than a Pipe Dream?

The project has new land and water agreements, but no track record—and more debt.

www.greentechmedia.com

'Completion slated for 2018' I guess that answers the question in the title.

 

[_Del_]

Will This Massive Solar-Wind Tunnel Ever Be More Than a Pipe Dream?

The project has new land and water agreements, but no track record—and more debt.

www.greentechmedia.com

'Completion slated for 2018' I guess that answers the question in the title.

They were still fiddling with this in 2018. Had even secured water rights, etc. They were looking for a utility In California, Mexico, or AZ to sell the power to. More precisely, I believe they wanted the utility to invest the infrastructure to integrate the tower with the grid. Later, they wanted to sell licenses for utilities to build their own (which makes more sense to me, but they didn't have a functional prototype -- only computer modeling).
I don't know what happened with it, but I suspect investment money was hard to come by for construction of the tower and associated infrastructure for a company that had never built anything.

This idea has a "cousin", of sorts, that was actually built and operated in Spain. That one used a greenhouse at the base to create an updraft drawn through the tower with turbines at the base.

 

[Fluff]

Will This Massive Solar-Wind Tunnel Ever Be More Than a Pipe Dream?

The project has new land and water agreements, but no track record—and more debt.

www.greentechmedia.com

'Completion slated for 2018' I guess that answers the question in the title.

They were still fiddling with this in 2018. Had even secured water rights, etc. They were looking for a utility In California, Mexico, or AZ to sell the power to. More precisely, I believe they wanted the utility to invest the infrastructure to integrate the tower with the grid. Later, they wanted to sell licenses for utilities to build their own (which makes more sense to me, but they didn't have a functional prototype -- only computer modeling).
I don't know what happened with it, but I suspect investment money was hard to come by for construction of the tower and associated infrastructure for a company that had never built anything.

This idea has a "cousin", of sorts, that was actually built and operated in Spain. That one used a greenhouse at the base to create an updraft drawn through the tower with turbines at the base.

Shirley they just need to find an old fashioned cooling tower and modify that? But that doesnt need $500M from investors, does it.....

 

[Grey Havoc]

Wouldn't be big enough, I believe.

 

[Charlesferdinand]

This idea has a "cousin", of sorts, that was actually built and operated in Spain. That one used a greenhouse at the base to create an updraft drawn through the tower with turbines at the base.

The updraft idea (as outlined in the Popular Science magazine) makes more sense to me, as there you not only can use natural drafts created by wind, but as is stated you can use waste and/or solar heat to create additional draft to even out variations in natural draft. In the downdraft version, the power you generate is based on the weight difference between dry air and moist air, and it seems like you'd need a lot of air.

 

[Michel Van]

Thanks for infos

I don't know if this is a Vortex or tornado or Updraft turbine

in Comic the turbine use geographic Temperature difference hot to cold
to let wind flow that on end of long tunnel end in this kind of turbine
i don't know if original concept use this method also...

 

[_Del_]

The updraft idea (as outlined in the Popular Science magazine) makes more sense to me, as there you not only can use natural drafts created by wind, but as is stated you can use waste and/or solar heat to create additional draft to even out variations in natural draft. In the downdraft version, the power you generate is based on the weight difference between dry air and moist air, and it seems like you'd need a lot of air.

At least part of the draw selling green energy to California's Global Warming Crisis™ was that instead of adding waste heat or solar heat to increase power, the evap tower was going to use the already existing solar heat in the atmosphere, generate power, and spit nice cool air out the bottom.

It does need air and large scale for the tower, but figure they are pumping water to the top and dropping it down the tower. Almost all of that water (in terms of weight, not as water) is going to down to spin the turbine. It is A LOT of air, and even a lot of water.

That article linked used the figure 8,000 acre-feet a year, which is a little more than the amount 16,000 homes use in a year. It's a lot. Probably has an allowance for waste/loss in storage and transportation, but we're going to use it for rough numbers. So divide that by 365 days a year, you get about 22 acres feet a day-- here the real figure for days is probably lower, because you're going to have factor downtime for maintenance and weeks of cold, moist weather, but again, it's the only numbers we're given, so we're rolling with it.
(Reasonable assumptions are: A little less water getting to the top of the tower, and less than 365 days a year operating. We can ass-u-me they wash and do some stupid math just to get an idea of the massive amounts of water planned for the tower....)

Using the numbers above, if it operates 14 hours a day during the hottest parts of the day, using 22 acre-feet, that's over 500,000 gallons an hour. Over 8500 gallons per minute sprayed, evaporating, adding it's weight to the air, at over eight lbs a gallon, that's somewhere close to 70,000 lbs added in a minute -- which then accelerates down the tower via gravity.

So it's massively scaled for a reason. It's not just that the damp, cold air weighs more than hot, dry air, it is also accelerating down the tower from where the water was added up towards the top.

Having said all that, how efficient the capture is depends on the outside weather. Otherwise you're just sending liquid water down, and that's a losing proposition.


Again, building a simple green house, with or without mirrors at the base of a tower and using the updraft seems a lot simpler, uses no water in the desert, doesn't require lots of large pumps or as large a structure, little or no maintenance apart from the sole moving parts (turbines), etc.


But the down draft tower is a fun marvel in it's own right. If it ever eventually exists.

 

[Justo Miranda]

Cooling towers are based on an ancient technology used by Persian architects to cool houses.

 

[Michel Van]

I found it
it base on 1964 design "Tour Aero Solaire" by Edgard Nazare and combination Vortex and Tornado turbine

Tour Aéro Solaire: centrale aérothermique par Edgar Nazare

Voici un article sur la Tour Nazare paru en juillet août 1985 dans L Ère Nouvelle . La Tour Nazare était une tour solaire à effet vortex. L idée a rémise à la mode depuis...

www.econologie.com

source:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1584579209196105729

View: https://twitter.com/Space_Folamour/status/1584579209196105729

 

[Charlesferdinand]

Fascinating. If I understand this correctly, this is also supposed to work by creating a draft upwards. I also like the fact that, like a true oddball inventor Edgard Nazare has also developed an aircraft (airship?) to help with the construction. Any clue what this "aéronef allégé torique" would look like?

 

[Michel Van]

Any clue what this "aéronef allégé torique" would look like?

according new data
it use difference between temperature between +30°C to +50°C with humidity around 40%
This reduce build hight from 990 meter hight tower to 300 meter height, but collector size goes 145 meter to 300 meter in diameter !
There are in illustration some kind channeling of incoming wind into rotation movement in center of tower (see Picture)
and there additional Structure in center of tower, i not understand it function for now.