Sukhoi S-70 Okhotnik UAV

[Cannonfodder43]

So much for those op-eds and "analysis" takes that repeat that the "the Russian's don't have as much experience" with LO design.

They don't?

Doesn't mean they can't learn though.

I probably could have worded it better in saying, they understand the physics and principles of stealth* just like us.

Just that Westerners seem to dismiss their designs and efforts without looking at Russian thinking or at Russian language sources that we at SP have. We Westeners tend to fall back on stereotypes instead of hard headed analysis with proper context.

*Although to be honest, most Western reporting on stealth seems too shallow and simplistic as well.

 

[Alifzero]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1470651355962527744

View: https://twitter.com/KomissarWhipla/status/1470651355962527744
5

https://twitter.com/x/status/1470649664928108545

View: https://twitter.com/HaoGao12/status/1470649664928108545

So much for those op-eds and "analysis" takes that repeat that the "the Russian's don't have as much experience" with LO design.

Are they put new small intake on the upper fuselage? Or its just some open panel? Never see that on first prototype.

 

[Trident]

They don't?

Doesn't mean they can't learn though.

Relative to whom? The US? Sure, but then that's a bit of a deliberately impossible standard to hold them to, even China doesn't match that benchmark.

Also - and I think that is the main point here - is this particular instance (LO nozzle, OML clean-up on S-70) really a case of learning? Our very first glimpse of Okhotnik was a full-scale mock-up which displayed both these features. Yet when the first flying prototype came covered in warts and had an axisymmetric nozzle, Western observers immediately jumped to the frankly ludicrous conclusion that this was representative of the intended production config.

All indications were, even at the time, that this was merely a X-47B-style demonstrator to test aspects of the design unrelated to low observability, and that the final airframe would correct all these "flaws". I think a "told you so" is perfectly warranted, given the sheer ridiculousness of the leap of logic that it was (and how pervasive the misconception was - there was nary a sane take to be found anywhere!).

 

[Alifzero]

 

[Trident]

In addition to the other changes mentioned (flat nozzle, LO air scoops), it now has the bespoke landing gear design, which was hinted earlier by some sources.

 

[Alifzero]

Forgot to include in my last post. Okhotnik progress looking really good compared to British and EU project.
Serial production contract will be concluded in six months. First delivery in 2024.

МО РФ: серийный контракт на поставку беспилотника С-70 будет заключен в течение полугода

Серийные поставки планируется начать с 2024 года

tass.ru

 

[QuadroFX]

high-res photos

(c)UAC

and a bonus: AI-enhanced photo of nozzle

 

[QuadroFX]

(c)1tv.ru

 

[TomcatViP]

Notice that the elevon's gap with the main wing structure is sealed with something like a flexible cover.

 

[Dr.Snufflebug]

Too bad it's gonna take a while before we see it in its final finish.

It seems they've "LO'd" most of it the way I expected them to do eventually, jet nozzle, all the intakes and vents everywhere etc. Only the big pitot tubes remain, but it's still a testbed so that's not too strange.

Notice that the elevon's gap with the main wing structure is sealed with something like a flexible cover.

Indeed, good catch.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

They don't?

Doesn't mean they can't learn though.

Relative to whom? The US? Sure, but then that's a bit of a deliberately impossible standard to hold them to, even China doesn't match that benchmark.

The original quote was ""the Russian's don't have as much experience" with LO design."

They don't. Neither does China. Both seem to be learning in this area. You don't get to be experienced until you've built and operated several generations of such aircraft.

Also - and I think that is the main point here - is this particular instance (LO nozzle, OML clean-up on S-70) really a case of learning? Our very first glimpse of Okhotnik was a full-scale mock-up which displayed both these features. Yet when the first flying prototype came covered in warts and had an axisymmetric nozzle, Western observers immediately jumped to the frankly ludicrous conclusion that this was representative of the intended production config.

Well, we didn't here.

All indications were, even at the time, that this was merely a X-47B-style demonstrator to test aspects of the design unrelated to low observability, and that the final airframe would correct all these "flaws". I think a "told you so" is perfectly warranted, given the sheer ridiculousness of the leap of logic that it was (and how pervasive the misconception was - there was nary a sane take to be found anywhere!).

Except in this topic here.

 

[Trident]

Yes, that was very encouraging to see I was talking about the Western press (both non-specialist and, worryingly, specialist like AvWeek).

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

 

[LMFS]

Notice that the elevon's gap with the main wing structure is sealed with something like a flexible cover.

This is one major source of backscatter, so its elimination may mean a not so trivial reduction in RCS and a serious advance in LO technology. Well seen!

 

[Saber]

Well, we didn't here.

Except in this topic here.

All due respect, but that's utter bullshit.

Page one alone.

Well, here's a design that makes precisely no sense at all.

Interesting, very much interesting, however I'm surprised - indeed disappointed - about these numerous lumps and bumps, scoops and intakes around the fuselage. ???

Not to mention the exposed, round, engine nozzle. Stealth was clearly not a serious consideration here.

I had a similar idea! :


View: https://twitter.com/RupprechtDeino/status/1088436480937283585

And don't even get started on the IR issues of making no attempt to conceal hot metal or to attenuate exhaust.

This is a bad joke of a design if they are even slightly concerned about signature management.

Had this been a prototype released in US/China, people here, people would have rationally thought out that maybe this wasn't the final version but a flight prototype, instead of pointlessly smearing Sukhoi's work.

But it's pretty much to be expected by now, first comes the reveal, followed by the usual stupid Drive/National Interest articles and drive-by picture analysis of prototypes, then as the project continues on with following improvements it switches to "no money, no serial production, etc" and so on and so forth, then the project reaches serial production and all the previous claims fade away into the memory hole and no one ever has to actually own up to their mistaken thinking and the amount of shit smearing they did.

We had the full cycle of above with the Su-57, we're now in the middle stage with the S-70, and currently in the first for the Su-75. And of course, this extends to other aviation projects as well as Army/Navy stuff as well.

 

[siegecrossbow]

The leading edge looks like it is made from special radar absorbing material.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

All due respect, but that's utter bullshit.

Alternative facts - also posts from page 1. Note after some initial varied reactions, a broad consensus in favour of "it's just a prototype".

It's not representing final configuration neither intended for RCS tests. Just like X-47B which had her own collection of bumps.

The lumps and bumps are expected on a first prototype. I would imagine the use of an off-the-shelf Izdeliye 117 engine is expediency - they have lots of control, guidance and other issues to work through before RCS becomes important. Maybe its waiting on a new nozzle to comes with Izdeliye 30...

This is a fair point, and mine was a bit of a knee-jerk reaction. It still looks like a remarkably rough draft design, but perhps it will eveolve into something more refined.

I know that this is a testbed or test-specimen only and I also did not want to offend anyone ...

With all due respect, the bad joke here is the assumption that this is what the final product will look like. Where does that come from?

It seems *decidedly* more likely to me that this is but the first of several prototypes, and intended to test aspects (FCS? Autonomy? Structures? Inlet performance?) for which full LO would be a needless waste of money. Flateric has already mentioned the X-47B as such an example, which was aerodynamically representative but also paid little heed to RCS reduction in detail because its job was merely to demonstrate aerial refueling and carrier ops. Apart from its "antenna farm", the nozzle was actually decidedly improvised too - sure, it was non-axisymmetric but the exhaust deck edges were exposed and *anything* but stealthy:

Last but definitely not least, the leaked slide which gave us the first public glimpse of Okhotnik showed a configuration (with hindsight probably a full-scale mock-up or RCS test model) that had a perfectly stealthy rear end:

As do the silhouettes painted on Su-57 #053. So to believe that the engine nozzle will stay this way flies in the face of both logic and multiple clues.

 

[GARGEAN]

Those leading edges are more than interesting...

 

[Forest Green]

Conformal radar?

 

[Maro.Kyo]

The leading edge looks like it is made from special radar absorbing material.

We actually call it a RAS; Radar Absorbing Structure. Typical of any LO and VLO airframes.

 

[siegecrossbow]

The leading edge looks like it is made from special radar absorbing material.

We actually call it a RAS; Radar Absorbing Structure. Typical of any LO and VLO airframes.

Yes that is what I had in mind. The structure is internally honeycombed.

 

[VTOLicious]

...

 

[tacitblue1973]

Too bad it's gonna take a while before we see it in its final finish.

It seems they've "LO'd" most of it the way I expected them to do eventually, jet nozzle, all the intakes and vents everywhere etc. Only the big pitot tubes remain, but it's still a testbed so that's not too strange.

Notice that the elevon's gap with the main wing structure is sealed with something like a flexible cover.

Indeed, good catch.

Boeing's Bird of Prey demonstrator had it decades ago. And at the time it was said that some features it had become industry standards. I'm assuming most unacknowledged programs to this day use the concept.

 

[TMA1]

It looks incredible. The flat nozzle is of a unique kind and some images I saw on russiadefenseforum (see below) seem to point to a similar injectors for lowering infrared, though of different kind izdeliye 30. The only seams I can spot on the aircraft are where the wings meet the central structure and they are bit big but I think they will have materials blended over them as it develops more and is further coated with radar absorbing paints.

 

[bobbymike]

That looks like the hanger from Firefox

 

[flateric]

It looks incredible. The flat nozzle is of a unique kind and some images I saw on russiadefenseforum (see below) seem to point to a similar injectors for lowering infrared, though of different kind izdeliye 30.

These are pressure tubes measuring pressure parameters at various nozzle sections during model tests iydk.

 

[QuadroFX]

FAB-500

View: https://youtu.be/3I0opI3fRH8

 

[Dr.Snufflebug]

Kind of odd that it's the M62 low-drag variant that was specifically designed for external carriage, and not the stubbier M54 variants that were made for internal carriage, and way more volume-effective. Any reason for that?

Edit: I just realized that the smallest remaining Russian tactical nukes follow the M62 FAB-250/500 shape (ie the RN-28/RN-32).

 

[Scar]

Very interesting footage, but i don't see the weapon-bay door... For me it looks like in this particular test there was no door at all.

 

[Anduriel]

Any reason for that?

Drag is lower - you can toss further. Plus Internal bays of S-70 are not that big, I dount that you can put two FAB-500M54 anyway. And if you only can put one, take one that has better ballistics.

 

[QuadroFX]

Plus Internal bays of S-70 are not that big

Similar to Su-57 main bays.

 

[Acatomic]

The leading edge looks like it is made from special radar absorbing material.

We actually call it a RAS; Radar Absorbing Structure. Typical of any LO and VLO airframes.

Yes that is what I had in mind. The structure is internally honeycombed.

From wingtip to wingtip the whole leading edge is populated within various antennas, similar to F-35, F-22, Su-57....


Timeline from bmpd:

After the successful implementation of the research "Hunter-B", according to well-known data, in December 2019 the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation concluded a contract with PJSC "Sukhoi Company" for full-fledged development work (ROC) on the topic "Hunter" on the creation of an unmanned strike complex SK-70 with unmanned aerial The contract includes the creation of prototypes of the SK-70 complex, including the construction of three flight prototypes (S-70-2, S-70-3 and S-70-4) of the S-70 UAV and three ground control points of the NPU-70. It is known that under the terms of the contract, the production of the prototype S-70-2 at NAZ was planned to be completed by September 30, 2021, S-70-3 by March 30, 2022 and S-70-4 by November 30, 2022.

According to the contract, from January 1, 2023, State (State Joint) tests of the unmanned complex SK-70 are planned, with their completion by September 30, 2025. By October 30, 2025, it is planned to approve working design documentation for the complex with the letter "O1".

On NPU-70 control point

The creation of the NPU-70 ground control point within the framework of the OCD "Hunter" is carried out under the contract with PJSC "Sukhoi Company" JSC "Kronstadt", which in its press release of December 14, 2021 reported that "when developing NPU-70, the reserve obtained during the work on the projects of the company "Kronsta In the future, it is planned to provide control from such a command post by any unmanned aerial vehicles of medium and heavy classes. The software development software for Kronstadt specialists is already able to solve this problem. The project has prospects for expanding functionality and increasing automation.

Выкачен первый опытный образец беспилотного летательного аппарата по ОКР «Охотник»

Как сообщил 14 декабря 2021 года Департамент информации и массовых коммуникаций Министерства обороны Российской Федерации, в ходе рабочей поездки в Новосибирск заместитель Министра обороны Российской Федерации Алексей Криворучко проверил ход выполнения государственного оборонного заказа на…

bmpd.livejournal.com

 

[Alifzero]

Beautiful S-70 image on the 2022 Russia MoD calendar. If you want to look at the rest or download it, you can visit this link

https://мультимедиа.минобороны.рф/multimedia/calendar2022.htm

 

[Alifzero]

So KF-21 flight in June iirc
And Okhotnik in July
Nice

https://twitter.com/x/status/1485432215542587393

View: https://mobile.twitter.com/RALee85/status/1485432215542587393?cxt=HHwWgoCzlduuqJ0pAAAA

 

[aonestudio]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_Q6V0M-Ono

 

[haavarla]

Now that is how you design a Heavy UAV these days. Looks stunning!
Congrat to Sukhoi

 

[stealthflanker]

and immediately 1 interesting image appear. The engine. Looks shorter than 117, and lacks the gimballed TVC "ring".

Also weapon bays.

 

[Acatomic]

Part 2

Also

An aviation plant for the production of UAV "Hunter" is being modernized in Novosibirsk​

TASS, February 15. /TASS/. Novosibirsk Aviation Plant named after V.P. Chkalov (NAZ named after Chkalova, a branch of PJSC "Company "Sukhoi") will modernize production within five years with the construction of a new building for the production of heavy stealth drones S-70 "Hunter", a source in the authorities told TASS.

Source: https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/13708025

 

[flateric]

...

 

[Forest Green]

Russian strategic S-70B Okhotnik UAV fires air-to-ground guided missiles

Russian strategic S-70B Okhotnik UAV fires air-to-ground guided missiles

www.airrecognition.com