Chinese aircraft carriers: Type 002 'Shandong', Type 003 'Fujian', Type 004

[Hydroman]

The first three photos look kinda like the American carrier pics... except, just needs more planes, haha.
View attachment 791627View attachment 791628View attachment 791629View attachment 791631View attachment 791632

I have to give the Chinese kudos, very nice looking ship and like with every nations new ship types, how do they perform and hold up over time and in combat even the Ford-class. As far as I am concerned, the Chinese are the closest to the US now, Europe is lagging and are the Brits going to build any more QE-class carriers or can they only afford two? Hopefully, France will move forward with their new carrier. And Russia, they seem to constantly have problems with their Navy. I think Japan needs to step it up as well since they have no restrictions regarding building up their military. Hopefully, with all these country's build-ups this will create an automatic, global deterrence for all.

 

[Sferrin]

I am curious how the paint will hold up after numerous deployments. Seems our US ships have either changed to a new non-toxic, California hemp, herbal tea and tofu-based haze gray paint or the CO's don't give a crap about ship upkeep and maintenance or a combination of both. I am glad some of those loser CO's got bumped from their commands.

I read somewhere, some years back, it was shitty paint. But green.

Hmmmm.

NAVSEA Comments on Rusty U.S. Navy Ships and New Paint Coatings - Naval News

NAVSEA replied why U.S. Navy warships are rusty, an issue that has attracted the attention of the public, social media, and the media.

www.navalnews.com

 

[CV12Hornet]

I am curious how the paint will hold up after numerous deployments. Seems our US ships have either changed to a new non-toxic, California hemp, herbal tea and tofu-based haze gray paint or the CO's don't give a crap about ship upkeep and maintenance or a combination of both. I am glad some of those loser CO's got bumped from their commands.

Ships rust over long deployments. It's always happened and the rust is cosmetic. It's not a sign of bad maintenance or anything like that.

 

[whatismoo]

Ships rust over long deployments. It's always happened and the rust is cosmetic. It's not a sign of bad maintenance or anything like that.

Yeah it's not like even with lead paint we didn't have ships rusting on yankee station!

 

[Hydroman]

I agree in regards to deployments/out to sea involving rust, but we (the US) had and have ships tied to the pier with large amounts of rust which should have been taken care of. We had cleaner, more rust-free ships when I was on CVN-65 (80-84).

 

[whatismoo]

I agree in regards to deployments/out to sea involving rust, but we (the US) had and have ships tied to the pier with large amounts of rust which should have been taken care of. We had cleaner, more rust-free ships when I was on CVN-65 (80-84).

I've heard they changed safety protocol about bosuns chairs and switched away from lead paint which contributed to the higher rust?

 

[lancer21]

Fujian CV-18 first operational training video. Noteworthy first shown traps/launches of J-15DT.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxHAIo_WIOE&t=8s

 

[Sferrin]

I've heard they changed safety protocol about bosuns chairs and switched away from lead paint which contributed to the higher rust?

I'd read about the paint issues too but then you have their response in that link I posted up the page. (Of course that could just be CYI and not match reality very well.) The bottom line is, for whatever reason, US ships are the rustiest they've ever been. Doesn't matter why, it's still an eyesore that doesn't reflect well.

 

[TwoTribes]

 

[TwoTribes]

Takeoff and Landing

 

[SUPER=BUG]

The 730 improved version, but unfortunately I didn't see this one.

 

[Tomboy]

The 730 improved version, but unfortunately I didn't see this one.
View attachment 792244

ngl why have this when you can like simply have two 1130 side by side?

 

[Sferrin]

The 730 improved version, but unfortunately I didn't see this one.
View attachment 792244

Doubt you ever will either.

 

[Sferrin]

ngl why have this when you can like simply have two 1130 side by side?

Money. The 20-barrel monstrosity seems impractical though.

 

[thanix01]

The 730 improved version, but unfortunately I didn't see this one.
View attachment 792244

Probably not worth the extra complexity. But man I too am sad to never see at least a video of it firing. The barrel in 12 o clock and 6 o clock position firing at once would be so cool.

 

[Blitzo]

The 730 improved version, but unfortunately I didn't see this one.
View attachment 792244

There was no expectation that the 20 barrel version was ever under serious consideration to be developed into a fully fledged system

 

[Sferrin]

Probably not worth the extra complexity. But man I too am sad to never see at least a video of it firing. The barrel in 12 o clock and 6 o clock position firing at once would be so cool.

Good for a laugh but not very practical.

 

[snne]

004 high-res update

 

[Scott Kenny]

14x16m boxes?

Oh, heck yes that's a nuke carrier.

 

[whatismoo]

14x16m boxes?

Oh, heck yes that's a nuke carrier.

yeah unless they're using the world's largest gas turbines (though come to think of it you could run an AGR fed gas turbine......)

 

[NMaude]

14x16m boxes?

Oh, heck yes that's a nuke carrier.

46' by 52', is that the rough size of the reactor compartments in a CVN?

 

[Scott Kenny]

46' by 52', is that the rough size of the reactor compartments in a CVN?

Dunno. But it's at least 1.5x the size of an Ohio-class reactor compartment. In each direction.

 

[snne]

Ford-class has 2 Bechtel A1B reactors

The A4W is ~550 MWth and the A1B is ~700 MWth. The A4W is about 15 feet in diameter and about 20 feet long. The A1B reactor is roughly the same diameter but a bit longer (I don’t know the precise numbers and don’t care enough to look them up). The A4W is a Westinghouse design while the A1B is a Bechtel design.

Gerald R. Ford-class aircraft carrier - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

That 14m x16m probably is large enough for this and all the containment/safety related stuff.

(Via Tphuang/sinodef)

 

[Scott Kenny]

Ford-class has 2 Bechtel A1B reactors

Gerald R. Ford-class aircraft carrier - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

That 14m x16m probably is large enough for this and all the containment/safety related stuff.

(Via Tphuang/sinodef)

Right, you need to keep the entire primary loop inside the reactor compartment. So that no water that has touched the core leaves the reactor compartment.

The reactor compartment holds the reactor vessel itself, steam generators (at least 2 per reactor, possibly 4), reactor cooling pumps (2 per steam generator), all the piping and valves, a pressurizer tank, and access space to maintain all that stuff. Plus a couple of big pipes for the secondary loop going into each steam generator.

 

[snne]

14x16m boxes?

Oh, heck yes that's a nuke carrier.

 

[TwoTribes]

46' by 52', is that the rough size of the reactor compartments in a CVN?

Ford CVN reactor compartment. The unit is meters.

 

[NMaude]

The unit is meters.

46' by 52' is 46ft by 52ft, that's what "'" means.

 

[scautomoton]

Probably not worth the extra complexity.

Would additional barrels not allow for a higher sustained rate of fire with less wear?

 

[TwoTribes]

46' by 52' is 46ft by 52ft, that's what "'" means.

What I said wasn't very clear. My two images are of the reactor compartments of the Ford-class. Their length and width are measured in meters. 12*16 is very close to 14*16.

So, "is that the rough size of the reactor compartments in a CVN?" — yes.

 

[NMaude]

But it's at least 1.5x the size of an Ohio-class reactor compartment. In each direction.

No surprise there given that a Ford-class CVN is significantly bigger than a Ohio-class SSBN so it doesn't have the space and weight constraints of a submarine hull.

 

[Rumil]

Estimates of Type 004 made by 头寸评论 (weibo) were close.

Waterline length of 330m and Beam of 43.5m (actually 43m) and Draft of 13m giving a displacement of 118,000 Tons.

We are looking at the largest Carrier in construction.

 

[lancer21]

When is the drawing from, is it recent or older?

 

[Rumil]

When is the drawing from, is it recent or older?

A month ago, he will make a new one soon.

 

[Antonio]

renamed

 

[Scott Kenny]

Would additional barrels not allow for a higher sustained rate of fire with less wear?

But also means more pieces to make so it's more expensive.

 

[snne]

004 high-res update

Progressing at roughly the same pace as 003 is quite good, considering this is China's first CVN.

 

[In_A_Dream]

Progressing at roughly the same pace as 003 is quite good, considering this is China's first CVN.

View attachment 795639

China definitely has a significant advantage in manufacturing & production.

 

[Scott Kenny]

China definitely has a significant advantage in manufacturing & production.

And frankly, outside the heat source, a carrier with IEP is a carrier with IEP.

Using reactors means the detail design is different but not obnoxiously so. 4-8 big fecking turbogenerators and 4 shaft motors.

 

[lancer21]

Yesterday sat image of 004.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2003064066894708897

View: https://x.com/CHINAPLA1/status/2003064066894708897

 

[snne]

Yesterday sat image of 004.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2003064066894708897

View: https://x.com/CHINAPLA1/status/2003064066894708897

View attachment 796009

This is why the sister ship to Fujian was/is needed. The delay that came with the decision of the CVN as the next main effort would’ve otherwise resulted in a fleet of four CV(N)s, which is a real weakness if your goal is to be able to contest the 2IC waters by 2030 with USN CVNs. This also means, conservatively, six or even seven CV(N)s by 2035.