Polish tanks, armored cars, etc. Designs, prototypes, mock-ups, etc. 1918 to the present day.

[USSEssex]

Hi.
This topic is about Polish tanks, but not only that, I don't want to assume many separate topics about Poland for each separate vehicle or tank, so I decided to give everything in this topic.
I want to write that I have problems with memory, I generally forget something for a while and remember something after some time, or I have difficulties remembering something, i.e. I cannot write long sentences in English from memory, it is because of my childhood accident.
So for my English mistakes, sorry.
So after the introduction, I come to the topic.
I will start with the times of communism in Poland.
Generally, when it comes to atypical combat vehicles, for example tanks, prototypes or experimental combat vehicles in the communist era in Poland, there is a great unknown here, no one has researched this topic so far, even tanks for training, and this is a pair of boots other than the basic one arming the Polish army like IS-2, T-34 T-54, T-55, and later T-72.
So I decided to look for some information about Polish tanks from the communist era, such as prototypes, modernizations or tanks for training.
I found such information and I will share it.
1) Tanks for training.
a) T-62
I heard that Poland was supposed to use these tanks, if I remember in Czechoslovakia, I don't remember where I heard it because it was a long time ago, I think this version is unlikely, I do not exclude the fact that Poland could have had such tanks.
The first information I found about these tanks in Poland is the CIA report from 1977. Here https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80m00165a001100020005-6
According to this and the table on the export of tanks from the USSR to countries, Poland received 10 tanks of this type.
It is very possible that these tanks were used for training.
So I started search for photos or something more, because the report is credible and authentic and it is strong evidence, but it is not enough to confirm 100% of this type of tanks in Poland.
So I found 2 photos.
a1) This is the first one, the T-62 tank was marked under this photo, so this photo should show this tank, or at least one of the three tanks. I think is this first tank in photo. Link here https://www.tumbex.com/search?q=ludowe+wojsko+polskie+

a2)
Second photo.
T-62 tank in my opinion in this photo is a tank number 1845, this is evidenced by the gun blower on the barrel, I think I see it, it is somewhere in the middle, in my opinion it is also confirmed by the side of the turret. And maybe the tank number 1846 as well.

This photo was taken by L. Wróblewski, and comes from the collection of the user Hajer, here I found this photo https://myvimu.com/exhibit/54777480-park-wozow-pancernych
As for the first photo where I found it, I will add a link later. But it was taken on the 30th anniversary of the Battle of Studzianki, i.e. in 1974. And the second photo is marked 1980-1985.
B) IS-3. Currently it is claimed that Poland only had 2 IS-3 tanks, but it turns out that this is not true, currently I found 2 photos of the IS-3 .
b1) Fist photo here https://www.szukajwarchiwach.gov.pl...0fb4ad27ef6bdd97ccc1890d6c0c7a3b4831157c37982, Polish Army Parade, Warsaw , dated 1/05/1950, In photo polish IS-3 number 112.

B2) The last photo is here https://archiwum.allegro.pl/oferta/zestaw-czolg-czolgista-czolg-is-t34-zdjecia-i8599656341.html .
As for the second photo from IS-3 , I cannot read the tactical numbers, maybe one of you will read them, it is either the same as above or the next one.
Polish 2 IS 3 did not have tactical numbers as far as I remember, so yes, it looks like another IS 3.
c) T-44. Well, as for these tanks, I know they were used for training. Here https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp82-00457r014500130001-0 , and here

THE 15TH TANK TRAINING REGIMENT IN GLIWICE, POLAND | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

In the first of these reports, the CIA said that Poland was testing 3 types of tanks, this is the Centurion, Cromwell and something American, and I think this is the M36 Jackson, they came from Korea.
That's it for now, I have a lot of it, so part two later. And now it's late for me. So as I wrote the second part later.

 

[riggerrob]

You might want to divide your research into 4 distinct time-periods: pre-World War 2, during WW2, Cold War and post-cold War.

During WW2, Polish ex-pats fought alongside British troops in Italy and Northwestern Europe. Polish troops were frequently assigned difficult objectives (Monte Casino Italy, Falaise Gap France and Driel, Holland) which they captured and held against repeated German counter-attacks. Polish Uhlans were the first Allied troops to the top of Monte Casino in Italy and the 1st Polish Armored Brigade "plugged" the Falaise Gap in France (August 1944). During both those campaigns, Polish tankers drove British (e.g. Cromwell) or American-made tanks (e.g. M4 Sherman).

On the Eastern Front, Soviets did re-badge and re-equip some Polish P.O.W.s and sicced (sp?) them on German invaders. Sadly, Soviets held Polish troops East of Warsaw during the Jewish uprising.

 

[USSEssex]

I will join the army in the east of 1943 1945 later.
As I found some of it from the communist era, it will probably be a few parts of it, and then I'll move on to other times.
However, I can say that the Polish army in the east did not have Sherman tanks during the war, at least not directly, because the corps was subordinate to the Poles who had Sherman tanks.
I added a link to the first photo with the alleged T-62.
This is now the second part of the above post.
D) T-54
Poles used this type of tanks, but for someone it may be a novelty that Poland had them since at least 1952, a CIA report from 1953 writes that Poles used these tanks for training that were in Drawsko Pomorskie, in addition to them in the school there were tanks IS-2, IS-3, T-44, and T-34. Apart from them, there were also American and British tanks, but it is not written what types. Link https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a002701130002-5
I came across another CIA report, he writes that the school in Jablonna had the latest models of Soviet tanks, including a tank with 120 mm armor, or at least that's what it was described, in addition, according to this report, there were also Western tanks such as the Centurion, Cromwell and Sherman were also used for training. And yes, that's right, I think that 120mm tank is the T-54. Link https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a002500140009-3
E) Panzerkampfwagen V Panther
This is another tank on the list that was used for training by the Polish People's Army.
I currently know one photo taken after the war, it is the early years of the People's Republic of Poland.
The tank is a Panther ausf A or D.
Picture below.

In addition, I found a CIA report that writes about a larger tank than the T-34, has 1 artillery and 2 machine guns, and I think this is Panzerkampfwagen V Panther, in the 1950s Poland probably still had German equipment so it could be possible, it probably not it is T-28. https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a003900560007-1
F) Type 42
This CIA report writes about Type 42 tanks that are armed with a 76mm gun, I was wondering what this is and I think it might be the designation for the M4 Sherman with a 76mm gun. https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a003800440006-6

Later, the third part, and perhaps the last or penultimate one, which concerns training tanks.
Then I will move on to the experimental tanks and prototypes of the People's Polish Army.

 

[dan_inbox]

F) Type 42
This CIA report writes about Type 42 tanks that are armed with a 76mm gun, I was wondering what this is and I think it might be the designation for the M4 Sherman with a 76mm gun.

T-34/76 ?

 

[Apophenia]

Poland had both SU-76 and SU-76M self-propelled anti-tank guns in service. Could the CIA's "type-42 tanks" reference have been a garbling of the SU-76's main armament designation - M1942 (aka ZiS-3)?

 

[USSEssex]

F) Type 42
This CIA report writes about Type 42 tanks that are armed with a 76mm gun, I was wondering what this is and I think it might be the designation for the M4 Sherman with a 76mm gun.

T-34/76 ?

You know what, I do not think it would be a T-34/76 under the Type 42 designation, T-34/76 tanks may be under the Type 34 designation, it says that there were 16 of these, and less of the latter because 7 that were written as Type- 42, both tanks have 76 mm guns, or at least that's how I read it. That is, the Type-34 is the T-34 and the Type-42 is the T-42.
There is probably a T-34 tank here, but apart from it there is one more tank, so I assume that the alleged Type-42 is the M4 Sherman with a 76 mm gun. In addition, it was stated directly in the report that the tanks had 76 mm guns, and this applies to both the Type 34 and Type 42 tanks.
However, as for the SU-76 as T-42, I thought about it, but the CIA reports in SU-76 describe more as SPG Self propelled gun, similar to ISU-122 or ISU-152, as well as SU-85 or SU-100, but the CIA report directly writes It was similar with the T48 tank destroyer, which in the east had the designation SU-57, 57 from the gun, I followed this route, considering that the 42 was the designation of the start of production or the mass of the tank. So I stayed with the Sherman with the 76 mm gun, when my friend read the report with the Type-42 designation, he was also surprised because, just like me, he had never encountered such a designation. We discussed a bit and we came to the conclusion that there was a good chance that it could be the M4 Sherman with a 76 mm gun, but that would settle a photo, and I haven't seen one like that at the moment. Looking at what the exotic equipment was in the 1950s, I would honestly not be surprised if it turned out to be true with this M4 Sherman.
I shared the first part about the tanks of the Polish People's Army from 1945 after the war. until around 1980, for a few posts, mainly because I found a lot of information, and secondly, I have a limited time, let's say, so if I gave it in 1 post it would be too much.
So, I'm starting part three.
G) T-70/45
Probably a regular T-70. link

RESERVE OFFICERS TRAINING COURSE | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

H) Western tanks.
They were for testing and training. This information is available above in the posts. This is Drawsko Pomorskie, Jablonna, and in the arrival new tanks report. If I'm not mistaken.
I) T-26(?) these tanks were smaller than the T 34, had 2 machine guns and 1 small cannon. https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp82-00457r008900520005-6
J) Unidentified amphibious tanks.
I read the description of this vehicle and found it did not fit the PT-76. https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80t00246a039200270001-7 and here https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80t00246a039900210001-6 .
In addition to them, other vehicles are described in these reports.
Tanks for training I have already written everything.
These are now experimental and prototype vehicles.
https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a006700290006-4

MILITARY UNITS AND INSTALLATIONS IN OPOLE (OPPELN) | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

1. POLISH TROOPS AND POLICE OFFICES IN STOLP 2. MILITARY RESTRICTED AREA AT STOLPMUENDE | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

1. POLISH ENGINEER EXERCISE NEAR GOLSCHWITZ AND POLISH ENGINEER TROOPS IN GRIEG 2. FORMER NUERASSIER KASERNE IN DEUTSCH-EYLAU | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

MILITARY INFORMATION FROM GLEIWITZ | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

JOSEPH STALIN PLANT AT LABEDY | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

1. ARMY TANKS AND TANK EQUIPMENT 2. EQUIPMENT OF MISCELLANEOUS UNITS | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

TANK PRODUCTION AT THE J. STALIN MECHANICAL WORKS IN LABEDY | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

There are tanks based on the T-34 and some T-34 with a suspension or a long barrel, and a T 34/100 prototype, and information about the T 34/88, I think a tank destroyer.
other prototypes

J. STALIN STEEL PLANT IN LABEDY | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

LABEDY (LABAND) FOUNDRY | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

rare 152 mm gun on ISU-122 chassis https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp82-00046r000400390008-7
SPG with 10 cm gun https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a003900660011-5
SPG german type https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a004900120005-3
another SPG https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a003000650001-6
Made by HSW 1954 https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a004100930001-3
T-54 prototype https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80t00246a039600270001-3

PHOTOGRAPHIC INTELLIGENCE BRIEF RE LABEDY STEEL PLANT 'JOSEPH STALIN', LABEDY, POLAND | CIA FOIA (foia.cia.gov)

www.cia.gov

I close the first part. Later I will write about the tanks of the army of the East from 1943-1945, and about the KBW vehicles, i.e. the Internal Security Corps. If I forgot about something, I will add it in later posts, possibly.
As for the panther, this is how it was used to learn weir and for training in cognition, the photo was taken in the 1950s, and more precisely in the late 1950s.

 

[riggerrob]

General knowledge: American M4 Sherman tanks were built with 3 different sizes of guns during WW2. The bulk of Shermans got medium-length 75 mm guns based upon a French pattern.
M4A2E8 got longer barrel 76 mm guns. See the recent movie entitled "Fury."
A few more Shermans got 105 mm howitzers, but they were primarily intended for bunker-busting.

Meanwhile, early pattern Russian T-34 tanks got 76 mm guns while later versions got larger turrets containing 85 mm guns. T-34-85 could punch through most German armor.

 

[USSEssex]

I know that the M4 Sherman had 3 guns, I think more about the M4A1 Sherman 76 W, the M4A2 with a 76 mm gun, or the M4A3 with a 76 mm gun, the Poles in the west used the M4 Sherman with a 76 mm gun, the Sherman IIA designation, during the communism Poles could get Shermans at least from Korea, or ex Soviet Shermans after the end of the war, it depends on when Poles could get these tanks, whether it was during the Korean war or earlier, I don't know. I read that the report writes something about the SPG apart from these 2 types of tanks, and some 126 mm howitzer was also mentioned. And with this howitzer, I have no idea what was written about.
Of course I forgot to add any CIA reports. So I add. https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a005400030005-7 , https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp82-00457r010900050007-3, https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp82-00457r014300120008-6, https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a004900820005-6 , https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a002700950011-6 , https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00809a000600040167-3.
This is now part two. Polish army in the east 1943 1945 and KBW equipment.
The Polish Army in the East used KV tanks for training, unfortunately I do not have any photos of KV tanks in the Polish service.
SU-152. The Poles had 2 or 3 SU-152s, they were used for training and were in Polish service until 1949.

In addition, the Poles in the east used the SU-57, and the M17 MGMC and Universal carrier.
and 2 photos Sherman tanks


There is no known photo of the M4 tank in the Polish service in the East.
Both photos were taken in the spring of 1944 and show the M4A2 tanks of the Soviet 8KPancGw, which from April to July 1944 was operationally subordinate to the 1st Polish Army. Hence the presence of Polish soldiers and the M4 in the photos. The same corps and the same tanks later fought together with the Poles for Warsaw-Praga (September 1944) and Gdańsk (March 1945). Source https://forum.odkrywca.pl/topic/312918-szukaja-czolgu/page/3/ .
German tanks in polish service
5th anti-tank artillery squadron
Originally, the squadron was to be armed with SU-76 guns, but the Russians did not fulfill their obligations. In order not to deprive the entire Division of anti-tank support, captured German equipment (renovated by the 24 Repair Battalion) was adopted: one Panzer IV Ausf.J, three Stug.III Ausf.G (Stug 40), three Jagdpanzer 38 (t) "Hetzer" and Sd kfz.251 and EPA (Marder III) transporters.

The captured equipment was used from spring (March / April) until late autumn (October / November) 1945. Then it was transferred to the 3rd Tank Training Regiment.

and Pz.IV ausf.J photo


Sdkfz 251 Stummel in polish army, east front, probably 1945 year, maybe after war.

Sdkfz 250/10 of the 13th Self-Propelled Artillery Regiment

Of course, the Poles in the East got more sdkfz vehicles, but I don't have all the photos of them.
Polish panther ausf G.


Stug III, captured by the 4th Jan Kiliński Infantry Division, March 1945

Tiger I number 323 captured by 3rd Infantry Regiment, 1st Infantry Division, Berlin 1945, vehicle was abandoned.


Another polish tiger I

And a pearl.
Polish Tiger II
A damaged / abandoned Tiger II somewhere in Poland in 1945, the description of the photo says that it was taken on the Odra river, but the location is unknown.
There are Polish soldiers of the LWP on the tank, the tank itself is not destroyed, but more damaged or abandoned, so it is very possible that it fell prey to Polish soldiers and was captured, it is very likely.
Additionally, I can say that this tank probably has the tactical number 115.

KBW vechicles
Sdkfz 251

3 lub 2 Marder II and Panzerkampfwagen II ausf?
The army in the east, or rather the LWP because more precisely it is Legnica, 1946 1947, and the equipment includes the Students of the Officers' School of the Internal Security Corps(KBW)


And one more photo is also interesting. Legnica, park at the Municipal Stadium, this equipment may also belong to the KBW

There was also the TOSU-76 transporter, built in 100 copies on the basis of the SU-76 self-propelled guns and introduced into the armament of the units of the Internal Security Corps, followed by Internal Defense Forces. TOSU in photo.

I close this part, the next part will concern the Polish army until 1939 and in France.
I am waiting for comments about these tanks in this post, there are also welcome comments about the tanks in previous posts.

 

[riggerrob]

"I know that the M4 Sherman had 3 guns, I think more about the M4A1 Sherman 76 W, the M4A2 with a 76 mm gun, or the M4A3 with a 76 mm gun, the Poles in the west used the M4 Sherman with a 76 mm gun, the Sherman IIA designation, during the communism Poles could get Shermans at least from Korea, or ex Soviet Shermans after the end of the war, it depends on when Poles could get these tanks, whether it was during the Korean war or earlier, I don't know. ... "

Please avoid "over-thinking" the issue of when Poles received Shermans.
Most of them came from Lend-Lease. On the Western Front, Poles got Lend-Lease Shermans via the U.K.
In the East, they got Lend-Lease Shermans via the USSR.

I sincerely doubt if any Korean War Shermans were shipped to Poland during the 1950s. Most were worn out from simply driving up and down Korean hills. Most of the vehicles that fought in Korea were simply "driven into the ground" and scrapped in situ.

One anecdote (circa 1951) has Canadian infantry encountering Canadian-made Universal Carriers and Canadian-mad Bren guns in the hands of Chinese communist troops fighting in Korea. The Canadians were enraged and burned the booty into rubble! The burning suggests that that Lend-Lease equipment was too badly worn to be re-used by Canadian soldiers ... many of whom were WW2 veterans.

As an aside, I have seen Sherman pistons that were over-hauled in Korea or Japan. Piston heads were stamped with the Korean or (more likely) Japanese kanji. Post Korean War, a few of those pistons returned to North America. These pistons were from a civilian logging crane based upon a war-surplus Sherman chassis. These logging cranes were popular along the West Coast of North America for many years.

 

[USSEssex]

Hi, I know there was supposed to be a post about 1939 and France vehicles, but those plans have changed a bit, recently I found some pictures but I will focus on one.
Below is a photo

Source https://archiwum.allegro.pl/oferta/duze-zdjecie-ludowe-wojsko-polskie-4-i5880769750.html
The original photo was small 175x175, so I took a screenshot and cropped it to the photo, this way I got a bigger photo, there are Poles in the photo, you can recognize them even by their berets, and I date the photo to the 1980s.

Legend
Tanks marked with numbers from 1 to 5 that are lined up in a row, tank number 6 is the one with the soldiers next to it, tanks marked in red are tanks of Soviet construction T 54 / T 55, just like tank number 6, vehicles marked in green are some experimental vehicles.
Vehicle description number 2

Vehicle number 2 is a half-track anti-aircraft vehicle, there are tracks at the rear of the vehicle, with 4 or 5 road wheels that may be on the bars, at the front of the vehicle there are tires, one on each side. The vehicle has a rotating turret at the rear, which is interesting, the turret resembles the turret of the T 34/76 tank, it is especially visible on the sides.
In the photo, the turret is turned to its side, the front of the turret has a slot for 2 guns, the guns are placed on the sides, similar to Ostwind II, Wirbelwind, or ZSU 57 2.
The photo shows where there is a place for the guns, just follow the traces of the gun position towards the turret, from the side of the turret you can see something black in the front, this is the place for the vehicle's guns.
The side of the turret is visible in white / gray.
The guns of the vehicle are short compared to the ZSU 57 2, in my eyes the caliber of the guns is somewhere between 37 mm and 85 mm.
In front of the vehicle turret, 2 open visors are visible which are located in front of this vehicle, between the turret and the hood of the vehicle you can see something in black in the place where the visors are located, this is the place where the visors close and open.
The visors themselves are located more or less at the top in the center in front of the hood and the turret.
In the photo, the front of the vehicle is not fully visible, a part of the front and side of the vehicle is obscured by the gun of tank No. 6.
The hood of the vehicle in which the engine is located is inclined compared to the M3 Halftrack, for example, but compared to the Sdkfz 251 it is wider and has a rectangular shape but it is inclined.
It's like putting together the hood of the M3 Halftrack family and the Sdkfz 251.
This vehicle is visible between tanks number 1 and 3.
Vehicle description number 4

This tank is next to tank number 3.
The turret of this tank is not fully visible, you can see part of the side of the turret and the mantle of the gun, because the turret of this tank is hidden behind the side of the turret of tank number 3.
The barrel of tank number 3 crosses the turret of this tank, in short, the barrel covers the turret of this tank because the barrel is raised up.
This tank has a spherical / round or ellipse-shaped or similar gun mantlet, the infrared reflector (probably this is it) is located in front of the gun mantlet, this is the top of the turret, not next to the barrel as it is in the Soviet tanks from T 54.
The visible reflector is in front of the barrel of tank number 3, which in the photo intersects the turret of this tank, i.e. if you have the turret of this tank, and the barrel is just overlapping the forehead, a reflector is visible in front of the barrel, it is a circle on the turret.
The caliber of this tank is somewhere between 100 and 122 mm, or possibly a long 76 mm gun.
The gun of this tank is 100% longer than the tank number 3 next to it, it is possible that the gun of this tank ends at tank number 5, as is the tower of the last tank, there is something blacker above that blends into the background of the trees, and currently I take it for the end of the cannon of this tank covered like in tank number 1 and 3 or the muzzle brake.


Below is a reconstruction of the turret of this tank, the view from the side together with the gun mantlet, the end of the turret is presumed, while the gun mantlet is not accurate, but I have drawn it more or less.


The above comparison is with the drawing of the side of the tank turret, in black I marked the contours for orientation, green arrows mark the sides of the turret angles on the side drawn in the drawing, and red for indicative place where the reflector of tank number 3 is located, which is white, and blends into the side of the tank turret, covering the side of the turret that goes to the left.
I will describe this turret of tank number 4 this way

From the gun yoke, the side of the turret is slightly rounded / diagonally, or it goes straight, then down and then to the side, creating something like a rectangle, then the side is angled, this is the line that goes diagonally that connects the side from the side of the gun yoke, then where the slant is, the side joins and then the turret side of this tank is straight which goes to the left from the slant.
As I am not sure what the side of the yoke is, I have drawn both versions of the side in the picture.


Above I marked where on the sides the gun mantlet starts, can you see this black thing, where is the rounding of the side of the turret? Yes, this is the mantle of the tank gun.
Legend, the side of the gun mantlet is blue, the gun cover is marked in black, it is white on black, while the pink color shows a thicker line in the middle, and in my opinion this is the place where the tank's gun is located.
It is not perfectly outlined, but you know what I am writing about.
below I will give a comparison of the field gun cover.





The above guns are similar to those on the tank and are marked in black.
I noticed that at the top of the yoke, the tank has 2 lines by the headlight, they are set diagonally, that is, one goes one way and the other goes opposite to the first one. This is where the top of the side of this tank turret is, at first I thought it was some part of the turret roof, something like the T 34 in the top of the turret near the yoke as you can see in my drawing, but nevertheless I figured it was there may be the top of this cover on the yoke, that is these 2 rectangular shaped patches, this is what I marked in black.

Someone will probably ask such a question
okay but how does it raise and lower the gun?

I'll answer right away
What is between these 2 honeycombs is, in my opinion, the place where the tank gun is placed (pink), and because these honeycombs (black color), due to their size, cannot, in my opinion, move with the gun when the tank lower the or raises, but here the gun of this tank is not in the 0 position, it has the gun raised up by an eye between plus 2 and plus 6 degrees, and if this is the case, it means in my opinion that where the gun is located, it is in between 2 plasters, this is what moves the gun, thanks to which the tank can lower and raise the cannon.
So I suppose this tank gun depression is something like plus 13 / minus 7 degrees, because for this tank to have better performance in this range the tank would have to be bigger, it's not a Centurion, Sherman and so on, it's just like that. because the tank is just small compared to the above-mentioned tanks.
Apart from that, you cannot see the original photo well, but what I have marked in pink is where the action starts, i.e. at some point it stops, it is caused by the poor quality of the photo and you cannot see where the gun is located, and the gun is only visible from the yoke is working, and the gun is heading towards what I showed in pink, so the thesis seems to be correct.

In yellow I marked black something that is close to the turret, in my opinion the side of the tank is hardly visible, in the photo I can see that it is summer / spring and the sun is shining, it is possible that it is the shadow cast by the turret, which makes the side of the tank near the turret hardly visible, to others the explanation is that maybe it is the rear of the tank something like in the Leopard 1 or M48 Patton, if so, it would indicate that the tank has a high power engine or gas turbine, which necessitates a redesign of the rear of the tank, and it would be something like Leopard 1 style for the rear of the tank.
From other curiosities I will add that the tank is not flush with the tank next to the tower, the tank is farther from the tank next to it, it is hidden behind it, which means that its first road wheel should be located more or less at the 2nd or 3rd road wheel of the next tank, if the tank stood flush with the hull of the tank next to it, it would turn out that the tower of this tank would be more forward than the tower of the tank next to it, and the tank next to it would have to drive up to match it with the turret.
What does this show?
about the fact that if the tank were of the same size as in the T 54 or T 55, the turret and hull would be almost flush with the vehicle next to it, because the T 54 and the T 55 differ mainly in the fact that the T 55 is a bit wider than the T 54, the design was basically the same.
The less interesting thing is that the fender of this tank is smaller than the T 55 and T 54, the fender is small and narrow.
the tank plate may be different too, but he is not sure about that.




Next to the tank number 4 there is another tank number 5.
Tank number 5 has 6 large road wheels, 3 of them are in the front of the tank which are visible, another fourth is next to it, and 5 and 6 are faintly visible and are located at the back of the tank, the back of the tank looks like it has a gas turbine.
In short, the tower looks as if someone had crushed the Leopard 1 and Patton.
This is the only way I can describe him for now.

 

[USSEssex]

another interesting photos that I found recently.
I posted one of them in the above post, now the rest.
Source https://archiwum.allegro.pl/oferta/lwp-czolgi-i-czolgisci-10-szt-i10447578084.html
Photo

In the last photo below, which you can see in the distance, the tank is most likely a heavy tank, in the front it has a sloped and angled front plate of the hull, if you download this photo from the source, you can enlarge this photo on your computer and you will see that there is a gun yoke next to the boy , which resembles the style of German tanks such as Lowe, and the gun itself is very long, even this tank has a silent muzzle brake as in the D 25T with IS 2, even the A 19 cannon may turn out to be too short, the gun probably has a gun purge or something that resembles it, even it's not the 115 mm U 5TS cannon, I promise you that it's something of a German caliber from 8.8 cm to 12.8 cm, maybe other people on this forum will help determine the caliber of the gun or what it is the gun is there. The tank has 6 or 7 road wheels in the T 54 or T 34 85 style, the tank is so large and long that the entire side of the tank cannot be seen, and the fuel tanks are placed more in front of the tank.
The tank was probably built in the 1950s, the CIA wrote that in 1954, tracks for a tank weighing 80 to 90 tons were created at the Ursus factory, in the same year, three tanks of unknown types were built at the factory in Łabędy, something like that, because I remember it, and I think the tank in question right now is the 80 to 90 ton tank mentioned by the CIA.
I am currently working on a rough illustration of this tank in the form of a drawing. Here is Report CIA https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80-00810a004900820005-6, and here https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp82-00046r000400320002-0
And why am I writing about German guns, including anti-aircraft and foreign guns?
And because at the l polygon ground in Zielonka, there were many such guns in 1952, and the information contained therein about anti-tank guns, i.e. from which country, including Italian, may help in finding the gun that this tank has. report is here https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp82-00457r014300120008-6
And another photo https://allegro.pl/oferta/lwp-1973-poligon-czolg-pow-12148324031
The first 3 tanks visible in the photo are the T 55, and the fourth one in the distance, it is possible that it is T 62 number 1253, because you can see the barrel blower on the barrel, May 14, 1973.
the next post will be about tanks from 1918 to 1939 and in France, as I wrote earlier.

 

[Andrei_bt]

What is the vehicle behid the tank ? https://archiwum.allegro.pl/oferta/4-generalow-i-czolg-3-i9961758524.html

 

[Apophenia]

What is the vehicle behid the tank ? https://archiwum.allegro.pl/oferta/4-generalow-i-czolg-3-i9961758524.html

'Defrocked' ISU-152?

 

[Andrei_bt]

no, looks like thin armor

 

[RazNaRok]

Hi, I know there was supposed to be a post about 1939 and France vehicles, but those plans have changed a bit, recently I found some pictures but I will focus on one. ...

Some typical polish T-54, T-55 and ZSU-57-2, and probably Polish "Opfor" from communist era.
T-34-85 modified to look like bundeswehr vehicles. Leopard-1, and Kanonenjagdpanzer (?) on the background. In the 1980s.
The troops of the Warsaw Pact often took part in exercises in the event of an attack by NATO troops.
The role of enemy units was played by typical T-34 or T-54 covered with plywood so that their silhouettes
resembled the units of a potential enemy.

 

[RazNaRok]

What is the vehicle behid the tank ? https://archiwum.allegro.pl/oferta/4-generalow-i-czolg-3-i9961758524.html

Armored tractor CZ-IS

 

[RazNaRok]

the tank is most likely a heavy tank... and the fuel tanks are placed more in front of the tank...

1. Poland had received two IS-3 for training purposes, You got photos of them...

At the turn of 1946/1947, Poland bought two IS-3 tanks (serial numbers: 703.604A81 and 703.605A58).
There were some plans to equip the Polish army with those. However, those plans were quickly abandoned.
Those Mainly were only an attraction of the military parades organized in Warsaw.
Eventually, one of them was sent to the training ground in Orzysz, where it served as a training target.
In the 90s, the wreck was renovated. Currently, it is presented at the Museum of Polish Military Technology in Warsaw.
The second one went to the Technical Officers School of Armored and Mechanized Forces in Giżycko in 1951.
Currently, it is exhibited at the Armored Weapons Museum in Poznań.

2. Nothing fancy on this photos, a T-34,T-54 and T-55's. or show please to which one You are referring to.
Also when we talk about a vehicle with forward shifted fuel tanks, please note that the T-55 of Polish production
received such in the AM2 Merida modernization package.

 

[RazNaRok]

Vehicle number 2 is a half-track anti-aircraft vehicle

Just a normal T-54 or T-55 under a tarpaulin cover over the front...

 

[RazNaRok]

a1) This is the first one, the T-62 tank was marked under this photo

a2)
Second photo.
T-62 tank in my opinion in this photo is a tank number 1845

Thats just T-54, easily recognizable by the mushroom like Fan Blower cover on the turret roof right side...

Also looking at the a1) the engine compartment and road wheels scheme are typical for T-54, a T-62 would have two wheels moved to the back and the characteristic semicircular armored cover of the radiator fan under the engine compartment

 

[RazNaRok]

a) T-62
I heard that Poland was supposed to use these tanks, if I remember in Czechoslovakia, I don't remember where I heard it because it was a long time ago, I think this version is unlikely, I do not exclude the fact that Poland could have had such tanks.
The first information I found about these tanks in Poland is the CIA report from 1977.

Cut out of context to fit the theory ... Meanwhile, the report is inaccurate, the author themselves adds in parentheses: T-62 (T-54/55 or T-62)

J) Unidentified amphibious tanks.
I read the description of this vehicle and found it did not fit the PT-76. https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80t00246a039200270001-7 and here https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp80t00246a039900210001-6 .

TOPAS, TOPAS-2AP, PTS, PTS-M, BMP-1...

 

[RazNaRok]

B) IS-3.

IS-3 from Training Center No. 2




IS-3, Poznań