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Vought V-1000 International Fighter Aircraft

Thorvic

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Following on from Overscan's post on the Corsair for CAS i recently noted in Air Pictorial from March 1970 that LTV had proposed a land based development of the F-8 Crusader called the V-1000. The aircraft was propossed for the Low Cost US Fighter project fo replace the F-5 Freedom Fighter as a export design under the US Military Assistance Program.

Other proposals were Lockheeds CL-1200 which was the highwing Starfighter known as the Lancer, the Simpliified F-4E Phantom (similar to the original F-4E(F) proposal to Germany with no sparrow capability), and the Northrop F-5-21 (Think this was the F-5E).

LTV V-1000 model as shown in Air Pictorial Sept 1970

Geoff
 

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elmayerle

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If memory serves me correctly, this version was powered by a J79 rather than a J57 to reduce weight and improve performance.
 

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Boeing-Dassault Mirage IIIW ‘International Fighter Aircraft’ (IFA) proposal



In 1969 the US Government via the USAF put out a Request for Proposal (RfP) for a ‘Adavanced International Fighter’ (AIF) (this would latter become known as the International Fighter Aircraft’ (IFA) to be supplied to ‘favoured nations’ under the ‘Military Assistance Program’ (MAP). Potential customers would be those nations faced with threats from opponents operating late-generation MiG-21s.

The designs that were submitted to this Request for Proposal were-
• LTV (V-1000 ),
• Lockheed (CL-1200-1 / X27 Lancer),
• McDonnell Douglas (F-4EF Phantom II)

But the design that interests me in this compertition was the one put forward by Boeing with their (or should I say Dassault`s) Mirage IIIW.

Yes Boeing teamed with Dassault to submit a Rolls Royce Sprey turbofan engine powered variant of its famous and combat proven Mirage III, designated as the Mirage IIIW.

But I am not able to find anything on the Mirage IIIW design, apart from being powered by the Spey engine.

Does anyone have any information, design designations, pictures, artwork /drawings of the Mirage IIIW proposal?

The McDonnell Douglas F-4EF Phantom II proposal was a single-seat , lighter weight variant of the F-4E Phantom II
Does anyone have drawing, art work of the F-4EF??

Note- By the way the ‘International Fighter Aircraft’ (IFA) program was won by the Northrop (N-156F / F-5A-21) F-5E Tiger II


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Pioneer
 

TinWing

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This was not the first Spey engined Mirage III export proposal. Dassault teamed with Fairey and Rolls Royce for the West German fighter contract that was won by Lockheed with the F-104G.

I don't have any drawings of this Spey Mirage either.
 

elmayerle

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Second round for the Mirage IIIW, the first look at it was back in 1963 and it lost, then, to the F-5A. Other than that, though, I've no information.
 

Archibald

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Don't know more! Just that W stand for Wichita, Boeing plant...
 

elmayerle

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Archibald said:
Don't know more! Just that W stand for Wichita, Boeing plant...

Well, what little I know of this version comes from the 35-year old book on the Mirage by Jack Gee. The cover of the Italian soft-cover edition is especially striking.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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Super V-1000

1 x J79-GE-17 turbojet, 8120kgf
Span: 10.9m
Length: 16.7m
Height: 4.96m
Wing Area: 49.2 sq m
Empty Weight: 8200kg
Fuel: 2940kg
Warload: 2720kg
MTOW, intercept mission: 11790kg
Max Speed: Mach 1.7
Takeoff run: 600m
Ceiling: 18045m
Radius of action: 510km
Armament: 2 x 20 mm M39, 2 x AIM-9

Air Enthusiast June 1971
 

elider

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I got these from Vought Aircraft Heritage Foundation:
 

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elider

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More on V-1000
 

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elider

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And another
 

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sferrin

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One wonders why they didn't just promote the Crusader 3 where they'd already done so much work on it.
 

elmayerle

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sferrin said:
One wonders why they didn't just promote the Crusader 3 where they'd already done so much work on it.

Likely because it wasn't as adaptable as the basic Crusader and, I suspect, was rather more needy of maintenance. Definitely a factor to consider in an export aircraft.
 

flateric

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Vought V-1000 factory model
 

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Archibald

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Vought certainly lost a HUGE opportunity when not building the V-1000, particularly when one see the results of "basic" J-57 Crusaders in Vietnam war... :-[ :'(

A J-79 Crusader could have been a world-beater, "replacing" both F-104G and
F-5 A/E (of which 4400 were build)
 

elmayerle

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V-1000 competed with the F-5E for official USAF support and lost. I'm not sure how well it would've sold without that (cf. F-20A).
 

hesham

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Hi,

we known this Competition,IFA International Fighter Aircraft,and the contenders
were; Lockheed CL-1200,Vought V.1000,McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom derivative
and Northrop F-5 II Tiger,who know the MD proposal ?.
 

Antonio

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According to Jay Millers F-16 Aerograph 1, McDD IFA entry was a less complex and lightened F-4E version
 

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pometablava said:
According to Jay Millers F-16 Aerograph 1, McDD IFA entry was a less complex and lightened F-4E version

I second this pometablava!
It was to be a simpler single-seat variant of the Phantom II
With the single-seat arrangement, it was to have minimised its offensive capability (although the two-seat cockpit/canopy arrangement of the F-4 would remain - the rear cockpit being stripped of its seat and instruments!)
It was also to lack Aim-7 Sparrow capability - relying on M61 and Aim-9 Sidewinders for its primary air-to-air capability.

Either way that you look at it it would have been an expensive and technically maintenance difficult aircraft to maintain for many smaller country's that the IFA was aimed at!


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Pioneer
 

hesham

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Thank you very much my dears Pometablava and Pioneer.
 

Bill S

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It is interesting to note that in their briefing material the comparisons
are made between the V-1000 and F-8D. It might have been done
because there was a quantity of data about the F-8D.

In the F8U-3 argument, the F-8D baseline would be seen as not
as "complex" an aircraft as the Crusader III.
 

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elmayerle said:
V-1000 competed with the F-5E for official USAF support and lost. I'm not sure how well it would've sold without that (cf. F-20A).

It should be noted (and I will endeavour to find the source!!), that the V-1000 submission was the USAF's preferred choice to meet the U.S Governments IFA (International Fighter Aircraft) competition.
The USAF acting on behalf of the United States Government, wanted a fighter with expanded performance (over that of the Northrop F-5A/B Freedom Fighter!), able to fly airsuperiority missions against such aircraft as the MiG-21 'Fishbed'.
From what I can recall (I think it was from book the great book - 'Pentagon Paradox')- the USAF's choice of the V-1000 over that of the Northrop, McDonnell Douglas and Lockheed (Request for Proposal (RfP) went out to eight U.S manufacturers on 26 Feb 1970.) was stated over and over again -but for some unknown reason the then U.S Secretary of Defence overrode the USAF's choice and selected the Northrop F-5E Tiger II!

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Pioneer
 

Pioneer

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Hey I finally found it!!

I finally found some more of my paperwork from Vought Aircraft Industries (complements of Mr Dick Atkins), from back in 1997 (I've had and still got that much stuff in storage :mad:)

It's great to read back through this stuff ;D

It's regarding the International Fighter Aircraft - V-1000 Summery by Vought Aeronautics Division, LTV Aerospace Corporation 6 April 1970!
Some of the interesting information pertains to the following -

Performance improvement is attained by:
- 3,884 pound weight reduction.
- An increase in leading edge droop angle for maneuvering and cruise.
- (and of course) Changing to the J79 engine.

The resulting performance characteristics enable the V-1000 to:
- Exceed all mission requirements of RFP (International Fighter Aircraft - IFA)
- Exhibits clear superiority over threat aircraft (I'm assuming MiG-21 'Fishbed') in air-to-air combat (predicted win-loss ratio of 4:1 over threat '111')

A 15% reduction in DMMH/FH (thanks to a reduction and simplification of systems and avionics suit)

Initial operational capability attained by 1 Dec 1973 (one month earlier than required!)

The specified production rate of 10 aircraft per month will be achieved in Oct 1974.

The average fly-away cost of the 325 aircraft will be $1.51m

To enhance the demonstrated combat superiority of the F-8 (Crusader) over MiG-17 and MiG-21 aircraft, and to provide superior combat maneuverability, the V-1000 will differ from the F-8 in these significant areas:
- The J79-GE-17 engine replaces the J57 engine for an installed weight saving of 953 pounds and an improvement in specific fuel consumption.
- Two M39A3 20mm cannons replace four Mk 12 (20mm) cannons for an installed weight saving of 61 pounds.
- The F-8 avionics suit will be reduced to the RFP requirement, with an installed weight saving of 125 pounds.
- A total of 349 pounds of internal fuel will be deleted by removing six fuel cells.
- A three degree increase in leading edge maneuvering droop has provided an increase in high subsonic maneuverability capability.


All external magnesium skins will be replaced with aluminum to enhance corrosion resistance (important consideration when one considers the IFA being aimed at SEA countries/air forces!)

The aft section (fuselage) will be reinforced locally to withstand the higher cooling and ejector air pressure of the J79 engine.


More to follow.............

Regards
Pioneer
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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Lockheed's CL-1200 (X-27 Lancer) has its own topic here:

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,832.0.html
 

uk 75

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Found this picture of a model on a great German site picturing a whole variety of interesting
stuff
http://www.aeroscale.de/pages/p_m_26.htm

It is captioned "Precise Models South Vietnam Crusader".

Anyone know more?
 

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Pioneer

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UK 75, I am not aware of South Vietnam using F-8 Crusaders!
Nor have I ever read anything which pertained to the idea that it was ever proposed!


Sorry


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Pioneer
 

taildragger

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If there was an effort to supply the VNAF with F-8's, I don't think it got too far. I recall reading that there was an effort to equip them with B-57 jet bombers and that a class of VNAF pilots had begun transition training before the project was ended due to a lack of experience/skill by the students. My hunch is that the B-57 was a less demanding aircraft to fly than the F-8.
 

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The Philippine Air Force acquired ex-US Navy Crusaders in 1977, but it seems doubtful that they might have been made available to anybody else in the early 1970s.
 

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The US roundel on the fuselage indicates to me that it's a US plane, just in camo for operation in vietnam.
 

Bill S

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From the Vought Heritage Collection

V-1000 Model in South Vietnamese Air Force markings.


(mithril remember that the US marking and VNAF marking look the same with yellow replacing the white)

bill
 

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Pioneer

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Hey Bill S I didn't even think of the V-1000!
Makes sense as the V-1000 (a lighter weight and simplified derivative of the F-8 Crusader) was submitted to the same competition which delivered the winning Northrop F-5E Tiger II, which was intended to supply countries/air forces the likes of South Vietnam with a simple supersonic fighter with minimised offensive capability under the US Military Assistance Program!!

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Pioneer

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TinWing said:
Dassault teamed with Fairey and Rolls Royce [RR Spey engine] for the West German fighter contract that was won by Lockheed with the F-104G.

I would be very interesting to find out more about both this cooperation - Dassault/Fairey/Rolls Royce and the actual design study!!! I can't help wonder how much better and more exportable this modified Mirage III variant could have been!!!
Has anyone found any more to this partnership/proposal??
Does anyone in either France or Britain have access to Dassault or Fairey archives??????? ;)


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Mark Nankivil

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Good Day All -

On EPay - http://www.ebay.com/itm/Topping-Models-1-48-scale-Vought-V-1000-Desk-Display-Model-/231052013167?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35cbc5ee6f

Looks like a camo'd F-8.... Mark
 

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GTX

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Have seen almost identical but in RAAF markings:
 

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overscan (PaulMM)

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Merged with older topic about V-1000 and the International Fighter Aircraft. Basically, a 1970 competition for an F-5A replacement lightweight export fighter which was won by Northrop with the F-5E.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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http://libtreasures.utdallas.edu/xmlui/bitstream/handle/10735.1/2811/Guide%20to%20the%20Vought%20Aircraft%20Company%20Collection.html

Technical data for V-1000B. 1970 August 20 Report No. 2-77000/0R-4. Original VAHF identification number: 124-4.

International fighter aircraft V-1000, Volume I, Management Proposal. 1970 April 6 Report No. 2-55400/0R-50652. Original VAHF identification number: 124-5.

International fighter aircraft V-1000, Volume II, Technical Proposal. 1970 April 6 Report No. 2-55400/0R-50653. Original VAHF identification number: 124-5.

International fighter aircraft V-1000 highlight summary. 1970 April 6 Report No. 55400/0R-50652-A. Original VAHF identification number: 124-5.

V-1000 international fighter aircraft. Undated Original VAHF identification number: 124-8.

V-1000 two-seater report. Undated Original VAHF identification number: 47-1.
 

Mark Nankivil

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Greetings All -

From the Vought Archives, a drawing of the V-1000B.

Enjoy the day! Mark
 

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