NACA and Wright Field projects

[ucon]

Projects from TsAGI album, dated 1947
Who can identify them?

 

[ucon]

and more

 

[Orionblamblam]

I recognize the first ("65") as a supersonic passenger transport which got some minor publicity at the time. "Life" magazine had a spread on it, IIRC.

Page "67" shows a feller holding a model of "Tremulis Zero Fighter," a two-stage VTO rocket-boosted interceptor.

The design in upper-left page "68" looks like it has the cockpit in the tail. What does the caption say? Is it an atomic powered design?

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Question is: How did these concepts wind up at TsAGI?

 

[ucon]

))These are NOT TsAGI projects, they are FROM TsAGI ALBUM, dated 1947.

 

[Stargazer]

Question is: How did these concepts wind up at TsAGI?

Clippings from foreign magazines I guess. But I must say that most of these designs are new to me.

 

[fightingirish]

The V-Tail aircraft with the ventral intake on page -067 reminds very much of the Arsenal VG 70 from 1948.
The aircraft on page -069 looks like an artist impression of the Northrop F-89 concept. Maybe the artist misinterpret the fuel/ missiles pods at the wingtips as engines pods.

 

[Stargazer]

Two jet projects found in the Ryan Reporter, Vol. 13, No.5 (August 1, 1952).
They are described as NACA projects but to me they look pretty Lockheed-ish, like something halfway between F-90 and F-104 with glimpses of Suntan...

 

[Jemiba]

The V-Tail aircraft with the ventral intake on page -067 reminds very much of the Arsenal VG 70 from 1948.

To me the fuselage looks more like the SNCAC "Projet C" tailsitter ( http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,16064.msg154227.html#msg154227) ,
maybe a misinterpretation of a model or artist impression ?

 

[Clioman]

There appears to have been a concerted USAF effort in the late 1940s to garner support by releasing drawings of aircraft projects that, while seemingly modern or exotic to the general public, were already obsolete or made irrelevant by the rush of technical development that was ongoing--and needed constant fiscal replenishment to continue in a time of budget cuts. The five images below were published in the September 13, 1948 issue of Aviation Week, and the style of the artwork seems to be very consistent with some of the images above.

The article is titled, "USAF 'Unveils' Speed Designs," with the sub-title of "From These Designs Came Today's Planes." If my surmize is correct, then they're likely to have been studies done by AMC's internal design staff as a means of 'QCing' vendor submissions, or perhaps to inspire vendors to pursue ideas that AMC found interesting. Image 1 was labeled "Refinement for F-80;" Image 2 was said to be "an early design...culminated in the [XF-87]" -- note the nose turret; Image 3 was a "Ramjet Fighter." Image 4 was "another redesign of the basic Lockheed F-80" but including JATO; image 5 was described as "an early product of joint Air Force-NACA high speed bomber project representing 1945 aerodynamic and tactical thinking--since vastly improved."

 

[Orionblamblam]

the style of the artwork seems to be very consistent with some of the images above.

Also seems very Tremulis-y.

 

[hesham]

Hi,


the 067 was for Bell as I know,but I will check,and for 068,it probably for Convair
and 069 was for ram-jet fighter as I sent something like that here from here
before;


http://books.google.com.eg/books?id=nNwDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA133&lpg=PA133&dq=naca+ram+jet+fighter&source=bl&ots=FctqDl8Fgz&sig=mY0IB1sZWBF5PGIyizbuTjBHmPk&hl=ar&sa=X&ei=vZAUUPyyC8XNsgbLgoDoBQ&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=naca%20ram%20jet%20fighter&f=false

 

[hesham]

I get the first aircraft,the 066 was here;


http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2405.30.html
http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1946/1946%20-%201571.html


and for the 068,I think it was Bell proposal to compete Northrop XF-89.

 

[hesham]

Two jet projects found in the Ryan Reporter, Vol. 13, No.5 (August 1, 1952).
They are described as NACA projects but to me they look pretty Lockheed-ish, like something halfway between F-90 and F-104 with glimpses of Suntan...

My dear Skyblazer,


they are a NACA hypothetical aircraft,please see, page 20 and page 16;


http://books.google.com.au/books?id=3XUK_52VvmYC&printsec=frontcover&dq=flying+magazine+1952&hl=en&sa=X&ei=BXMVVN7HE4SGywOr_ICwDw&ved=0CDoQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=flying%20magazine%201952&f=false


http://books.google.com.au/books?id=UoGrm9YgAoEC&printsec=frontcover&dq=flying+magazine+1953&hl=en&sa=X&ei=LHQVVNyBDoOGywOzwoCACg&ved=0CCgQ6AEwATgK#v=onepage&q=flying%20magazine%201953&f=false

 

[hesham]

I recognize the first ("65") as a supersonic passenger transport which got some minor publicity at the time. "Life" magazine had a spread on it, IIRC.

My dear Scott,


also a more info about it from Flying magazine,page 17;


http://books.google.com.au/books?id=FOx8ZDZOPT4C&pg=PA17&dq=magazine+supersonic+transport&hl=en&sa=X&ei=4H4VVJ-gOMbJOfjJgZAD&ved=0CD8Q6AEwCTgK#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

[hesham]

Hi,


http://books.google.com.au/books?id=4z4Weh7XdswC&pg=PA37&dq=flying+magazine+1948&hl=en&sa=X&ei=SMtxVM6vL8GNaIyogqgE&ved=0CCoQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q&f=true

 

[Jemiba]

Looks like a Lockheed PV2 P2V Neptune model to me, but that not necessarily means, that
this system really was envisaged for that type, just that it was tested with that model.

 

[Stargazer]

Looks like a Lockheed PV2 Neptune model to me

The Neptune was the P2V. The PV-2 was the Harpoon.

 

[Jemiba]

Correct, of course, sorry. My main point was, that the type of aircraft doesn't matter
here. Not sure, but perhaps it could be regarded as kind of rescue device and be moved
to that thread. It seems to have intended to prevent a ditching behaviour like that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjadMxpXprk

 

[hesham]

From the book; Rocker Aircraft U.S.A. by Erik Bergaust,


here is a delta-wing hypothetical or notional design for future aircraft in NACA.

 

[sienar]

Tidy little jet fighter from just after the war and an early application of the submerged inlet.


The mention of folding wings makes me think this is perhaps linked to a proposal from outside NACA, but I can't imagine what.

 

[_Del_]

Looks quite a bit like a smaller P-80 with NACA inlets to me.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

http://archive.aviationweek.com/image/spread/19521020/9/2

 

[hesham]

Hi,

here is a NACA Lift-Fuselage Supersonic Interceptor Model.

http://archive.aviationweek.com/image/spread/19541122/25/2

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

The big turboprop makes me think of an advanced XF-12 variant.

The High-Lift model has some Skylancer traits to it.

 

[hesham]

The big turboprop makes me think of an advanced XF-12 variant.

Very similarly my dear XP67_Moonbat,but with high-wing.

 

[Mark Nankivil]

Good Day All -

The model in Hesham's posting regarding a hydro-flap equipped patrol bomber looks to be a P4M Mercator and not a P2V Neptune.

Enjoy the Day! Mark

 

[hesham]

Hi;

http://archive.aviationweek.com/image/spread/19580714/25/2

 

[hesham]

There appears to have been a concerted USAF effort in the late 1940s to garner support by releasing drawings of aircraft projects that, while seemingly modern or exotic to the general public, were already obsolete or made irrelevant by the rush of technical development that was ongoing--and needed constant fiscal replenishment to continue in a time of budget cuts. The five images below were published in the September 13, 1948 issue of Aviation Week, and the style of the artwork seems to be very consistent with some of the images above.

The article is titled, "USAF 'Unveils' Speed Designs," with the sub-title of "From These Designs Came Today's Planes." If my surmize is correct, then they're likely to have been studies done by AMC's internal design staff as a means of 'QCing' vendor submissions, or perhaps to inspire vendors to pursue ideas that AMC found interesting. Image 1 was labeled "Refinement for F-80;" Image 2 was said to be "an early design...culminated in the [XF-87]" -- note the nose turret; Image 3 was a "Ramjet Fighter." Image 4 was "another redesign of the basic Lockheed F-80" but including JATO; image 5 was described as "an early product of joint Air Force-NACA high speed bomber project representing 1945 aerodynamic and tactical thinking--since vastly improved."

From AW;

http://archive.aviationweek.com/image/spread/19480913/14/2

 

[sienar]

That jet bomber is posted elsewhere on this forum. I want to say its convair.

 

[hesham]

A strange concept from NACA;

http://archive.aviationweek.com/image/spread/19460218/8/2

 

[Vladimir]

and more

Oh, thanks ucon!

 

[hesham]

From Ailes 11/1950,

here is a NACA Research Supersonic concept,with anther Project called
RM-2,and as I understand from translate,maybe the designer was Mr.
Richard Worcester.

 

[Hood]

Richard Worcester was a British aviation journalist, 'consultant' and critic. I use inverted commas around consultant purely because he seems to have several axes to grind when it came to the British aircraft industry and his opinions were rather off beam.

 

[hesham]

OK my dear Hood.

 

[hesham]

I recognize the first ("65") as a supersonic passenger transport which got some minor publicity at the time. "Life" magazine had a spread on it, IIRC.

My dear Scott,


also a more info about it from Flying magazine,page 17;


http://books.google.com.au/books?id...fjJgZAD&ved=0CD8Q6AEwCTgK#v=onepage&q&f=false

From AIAA,Aeronautical Vehicles—1970 and Beyond

 

[hesham]

Hi,

Investigation of intake ducts for a high-speed subsonic jet-propelled airplane / By Herbert N. Cohen

 

[hesham]

Flying Magazine

books.google.com.au

From the same source.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

was there any drawings or pictures to Mr. R. T. Jones's works ?.

- Winged Wonders

Robert T. Jones - NASA

Robert T. “R. T.” Jones (1910 – 1999) independently identified the benefits of swept-back wings for high-speed aircraft, regarded as one of the most important

www.nasa.gov

 

[hesham]

From Flying 1953-2.