Have you seen the video of a kitten facing her image in a mirror and after several attempts to communicate with her look behind the mirror to see where the trick is?An ET civilization with FTL technology sends ships to Earth and then loses them in accidents for intelligence officers to retrieve and then tell everyone? I prefer the story of the beaver.Translation: we found a beaver sitting on the floating log of clearly non-human origin (no human have teeth like that). After long and tedious battle, the beaver retreated, and partially preserved log was recovered by secret specialists and put into secret laboratory.
Intelligence Officials Say U.S. Has Retrieved Craft of Non-Human Origin - The Debrief
In a Debrief exclusive, Ralph Blumenthal and Leslie Kean report that a former official says the U.S. has retrieved craft of non-human origin.thedebrief.org
Works for me.
No one has actually told anyone anything. A pea is hidden under three cups, which are moved around, and then you have to guess which cup hides the pea. In this case, the same thing happens except the pea mysteriously disappears while the cups are being moved around. I've watched this happen over the last 40+ years.
Intelligence officials say United States has retrieved craft of non-human origin
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Dilandu
I'm dissatisfied, which means, I exist.
It's irrelevant. If aliens took extreme efforts to NOT be noticed, they would clearly track every probe entering Earth atmosphere, and would have both multiple redundant self-destruct systems on it, and recovery procedures, which would made capturing it by Earth personnel next thing to impossible.
It's not an argument at all. Aliens capable of not only crossing interstellar distances, but doing it in such way that humanity could not notie at all (i.e. not only producing enormous energies, but somehow completely hiding them from observation!), would be able to synthetise any food they could possibly require from basic molecules.
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I tend to stay away from these threads because, a bit like with SAPs, the people that know don't talk (and rightly so), and the people that talk (usually) don't know.
But just as a thought experiment...If I were an alien, in my attempt to monitor and develop predictive pattern of behavior of the subjects I needed to study, I would have more than one reason to intentionally disseminate some of the technology already available to my civilization to see what the subjects of the study would do with it.
For example, crash land a few UFOs here and there on the planet, so that they won't suspect this as an intentional act.
What would the locals do with them? Keep them a secret? Share the news far and wide with everyone? Come together with other nations to study the vehicles? Would they be able to reverse engineer the tech? And how would they use it?
That said I highly doubt we will ever get an answer if we have been or are being visited by extraterrestrial, albeit it's undoubtedly clear, given the expanse of the Universe, that there are other life forms out there.
Personally, given what I've seen, I'd be more than inclined to believe that we have though. But that's just my opinion and, luckily, I don't have to convince anyone.
But just as a thought experiment...If I were an alien, in my attempt to monitor and develop predictive pattern of behavior of the subjects I needed to study, I would have more than one reason to intentionally disseminate some of the technology already available to my civilization to see what the subjects of the study would do with it.
For example, crash land a few UFOs here and there on the planet, so that they won't suspect this as an intentional act.
What would the locals do with them? Keep them a secret? Share the news far and wide with everyone? Come together with other nations to study the vehicles? Would they be able to reverse engineer the tech? And how would they use it?
That said I highly doubt we will ever get an answer if we have been or are being visited by extraterrestrial, albeit it's undoubtedly clear, given the expanse of the Universe, that there are other life forms out there.
Personally, given what I've seen, I'd be more than inclined to believe that we have though. But that's just my opinion and, luckily, I don't have to convince anyone.
Dilandu
I'm dissatisfied, which means, I exist.
Objection: it would severly disrup the observation. Unless, of course, the goal of experiment is to observe, how subjects would react on the proof of alien existence.
My personal opinion is that the most interesting thing about our planet is the enormous variety of life forms. Think of an ET scientist who is only interested in collecting different types of DNA and considers the presence of an intelligent species a nuisance to his research.
Voltzz
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Its very convenient that these Aliens always turn up in bad photographs and unconfirmed rumors and never in the publicly available data of some billion dollar radio-telescope. Now ofc those aliens have the technology to stay hidden, in spite of all the physics that we know, for their interstellar journey to our planet, but as soon as they touch the atmosphere all their technology fails and some hillbilly in Texas or a fighter pilot over the pacific can spot them with the naked eye. And conveniently they only ever visit the US the UK and Australia because the citizens of Alpha-Centauri are famously anglophiles.
All the trouble that UFO lovers go through to rationalize their faith in the extraterrestrials kinda reminds me of US creationist explaining away the fossil evidence of evolution as a hidden in the earth by Satan to deceive humanity. If your believe rest on all evidence being manipulated by Aliens or the Government, maybe your reasons for believing in it have nothing to do with the evidence.
For me the more interesting question, is why the US-Military is deliberately stoking UFO rumors. And here i find it far more likely that its their own activity they are trying to cover and not some Chinese incursions.
All the trouble that UFO lovers go through to rationalize their faith in the extraterrestrials kinda reminds me of US creationist explaining away the fossil evidence of evolution as a hidden in the earth by Satan to deceive humanity. If your believe rest on all evidence being manipulated by Aliens or the Government, maybe your reasons for believing in it have nothing to do with the evidence.
For me the more interesting question, is why the US-Military is deliberately stoking UFO rumors. And here i find it far more likely that its their own activity they are trying to cover and not some Chinese incursions.
*Clearly* the aliens are intentionally dropping off bits of technology for us to study. But what they're giving us isn't the obsolete stuff or the trash... they're giving us the stuff that they think is promising but that they just can't quite get to work, hoping the weird little hairless monkeys will bang the rocks together just right to make the transmogrifying encabulatortron. Sure, their attempt to get us to perfect their android tech failed when we turned it into the Kardashians, but who knows? Maybe we'll produce results.
I can confidently guarantee that like similar events in the past where the U.S. government or USAF promised to disclose something ended up disclosing nothing. Like the official University of Colorado UFO study funded by the USAF in 1966. The Condon Report was released in 1968, and it included photos. Its conclusion was that science would not be advanced by further study. That gave the USAF an academic reason to leave the field. I bought the paperback version at just over 1,000 pages in January 1969. It contained little in the way of science and during the process, Doctor Condon voiced his predetermined opinion that nothing would come of this - no answers. In that sense, the report delivered as promised.
This has nothing to do with the US military. This is happening in Congress, under oath, in hearings with something called the Gillibrand Amendment set up specifically to allow whistleblowers in the military to come forth in regards to UAP/SAP. It’s in Congress because the military would never speak out.
People here comment in a way that is dismissive or making fun. As an American maybe I understand the gravity of this but is being approached very seriously from a standpoint of unexplained objects in regards to national defense and most importantly, from a constitutional law standpoint where there are SAPs that are operating outside of the knowledge of most then with an intersection of private defense contractors.
This isn’t a public information office. It’s been ongoing Congressional Hearings with many credible people with high ranking positions in the military for 30+ years, that are testifying in Intelligence Commitee hearings. They are speaking out as the feel it’s their duty to their country to say that something is fundamentally wrong and illegal.
This isnt necessarily about UFOs. It’s intentionally obfuscating information or technology buried in SAP/SCI that may be considered treason.
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The answer may be simple......
www.bbc.co.uk
BBC Radio 4 - The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy - Mice
Douglas Adams' sci-fi comedy following the misadventures of hapless human Arthur Dent.
As an American, I am hoping for factual information but expect to hear nothing. Having looked through documents from the 1950s, espionage was mentioned if anything was revealed. This isn't the first time Congressional hearings that included mention of UFOs occurred. The fallback position was and will be, national security. The "enemy," whoever that might be, has no need to know. Secret USAF projects are secret for a reason. My goal is not to be dismissive or make fun, but this stretches back to 1947 at least.
I understand. I’m just saying. Look into what has been happing today or this year or currently. Not in the past.
I have no reason to believe that this time will be any different. Committees are formed and quietly disappear. It's a news item today, only to be forgotten a short time later. By the way, if this turns out to be an SAP/SCI situation and something were to be revealed and the technology is U.S., then it will only be revealed to intimidate any enemies.
And speaking hypothetically, if it were highly advanced aliens, I'd go to sleep that night knowing that instead of blowing up the world with beam weapons, nothing happened for decades.
And speaking hypothetically, if it were highly advanced aliens, I'd go to sleep that night knowing that instead of blowing up the world with beam weapons, nothing happened for decades.
I think you’re still missing the scope and point but no problem!
martinbayer
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Which scientist on any planet at all would regard an intelligent species a "nuisance" to DNA research, instead of the crown of their collection, and consequently why *wouldn't* said ET scientist be interested in the full spectrum of available DNA samples, including that of the presumed apex species we call homo sapiens, collected say on a cloudless New Moon night on a low traffic lone dark desert straight and level two-lane road in the US Southwest, i.e. Hello Probie? Oh wait - I think I got that mixed up with the movie poster of Strange Encounters of the Third Kind...
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martinbayer
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You, Sir, are in my best estimation onto at least a major part of the psychological explanation of this whole pseudo phenomenon. Mass psychology/hysteria is in my best understanding a, if not the, major driver here. In the interest of not getting a toddler timeout from moderators, I will dutifully refrain from drawing any political analogies here...
martinbayer
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Could/would you please elaborate on any concrete documented instances/examples of the behavior alleged above?
martinbayer
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Nah, my money is on rats - they'll outdo mice every time.The answer may be simple......
BBC Radio 4 - The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy - Mice
Douglas Adams' sci-fi comedy following the misadventures of hapless human Arthur Dent.
martinbayer
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As a card carrying resident alien looking in (from the inside
), I think it's high time for the people of the United States of America to return to their *democratic* grass roots and demand, nay, enforce by existing law, political accountability and transparency across the whole spectrum.
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Small problem: the American voters keep voting for politicians they *know* to be corrupt. of course Americans aren't unique in that, but you get what you enable.
martinbayer
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You *do* know that we are living in 2023, and that legitimate objective IQ tests are colour blind, right? Being classified as a Caucasian myself, I'm aware of way more idiot whites than nonwhites...Nope! That very much so was the rethoric used until 1965 when LBJ enacted The Voting Rights Act that outlawed discriminatory voting practices adopted in many southern states after the Civil War, including literacy tests as a prerequisite to voting.So you actually believe that Coloured voters are objectively less smart than Noncoloured ones? Interesting...Eerily similar to laws pertaining to Black voters in the US for generations.Accepting your premise, assumptions, and recommendations, I hear you
Rhinocrates
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It's not one self-proclaimed whistleblower without evidence that would convince me. There should be many, with evidence, and with stories that correlate.
This study looks at the probability of everyone keeping their lips sealed for long.
journals.plos.org
TL;DR: https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2016-01-26-too-many-minions-spoil-plot
He then looked at the maximum number of people who could take part in an intrigue in order to maintain it. For a plot to last five years, the maximum was 2521 people. To keep a scheme operating undetected for more than a decade, fewer than 1000 people can be involved. A century-long deception should ideally include fewer than 125 collaborators. Even a straightforward cover-up of a single event, requiring no more complex machinations than everyone keeping their mouth shut, is likely to be blown if more than 650 people are accomplices.
This study looks at the probability of everyone keeping their lips sealed for long.
On the Viability of Conspiratorial Beliefs
Conspiratorial ideation is the tendency of individuals to believe that events and power relations are secretly manipulated by certain clandestine groups and organisations. Many of these ostensibly explanatory conjectures are non-falsifiable, lacking in evidence or demonstrably false, yet public...
TL;DR: https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2016-01-26-too-many-minions-spoil-plot
He then looked at the maximum number of people who could take part in an intrigue in order to maintain it. For a plot to last five years, the maximum was 2521 people. To keep a scheme operating undetected for more than a decade, fewer than 1000 people can be involved. A century-long deception should ideally include fewer than 125 collaborators. Even a straightforward cover-up of a single event, requiring no more complex machinations than everyone keeping their mouth shut, is likely to be blown if more than 650 people are accomplices.
Dilandu
I'm dissatisfied, which means, I exist.
They vote not for those politicians - but against those who they dislike even more.
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It's not one self-proclaimed whistleblower without evidence that would convince me. There should be many, with evidence, and with stories that correlate.
This study looks at the probability of everyone keeping their lips sealed for long.
On the Viability of Conspiratorial Beliefs
Conspiratorial ideation is the tendency of individuals to believe that events and power relations are secretly manipulated by certain clandestine groups and organisations. Many of these ostensibly explanatory conjectures are non-falsifiable, lacking in evidence or demonstrably false, yet public...
TL;DR: https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2016-01-26-too-many-minions-spoil-plot
He then looked at the maximum number of people who could take part in an intrigue in order to maintain it. For a plot to last five years, the maximum was 2521 people. To keep a scheme operating undetected for more than a decade, fewer than 1000 people can be involved. A century-long deception should ideally include fewer than 125 collaborators. Even a straightforward cover-up of a single event, requiring no more complex machinations than everyone keeping their mouth shut, is likely to be blown if more than 650 people are accomplices.
Or as the old saying goes, "Any three people can keep a secret, provided two of them are dead."
I'm sure that some really big classified programs have a specialized counter intelligence operation attached to them. This certainly seems like a case of those folks doing their job a little too well. Lue elizondo firmly believed the same thing. Certainly the spurious sausage is coming from the same source.
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I would assume it's in order to create a cover story for some secret programs in order to distract people who would otherwise be spying on the program and give them some false "wonder story" of aliens that they would likely chase after for years after that, spreading it amongst themselves, all the while doing the US government's work of hiding the program by spreading false information for them. It has been done before, and I would be surprised if it isn't done in the present.
Those of us who have lived in dictatorships know how to value the parasitic existence of politicians, whatever their ideology or their ability to govern, everything is forgiven because they are invaluable in preventing a military leader or a religious leader from sitting in the highest chair.
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Also, as @Rhinocrates rightfully pointed out, we shouldn't base all our information off of one single whistleblower who, by chance worked for the US government in the past, and may 1) be crazy, or 2) be paid to spread false info as a cover. I'm certain he's not the only one, I've seen shows on US channels when I was over there in which people who are intelligent (or at least, claim to be), and have had careers in the DoD, NASA and USAF, go out into the desert to find the truth about some mystical being/legend which supposedly lives out there. In doing so, they dumb themselves down to the point of looking like nutcases in order to either appeal to the audience or simply as a cover.
I also find it interesting that:
1) They all seem to be experts in their fields and have been involved with the US Government at some point or another during their careers
2) All these crazy things seem to happen in the Western Deserts of the USA, which also may be home to large test ranges used to test out emerging (and often, highly classified) tech.
3) Most sightings seem to happen around military bases and test ranges, the majority of them being in the Anglosphere, (where there seems to be a bigger UFO culture than in other areas of the world)
I also find it hard to believe that most, if not all alien sightings have similar characteristics to each other, as if there is a preconceived notion of what aliens would look like. In reality, nobody knows what an alien would look like, as they may be able to survive conditions which may not be considered habitable to humans.
I also find it interesting that:
1) They all seem to be experts in their fields and have been involved with the US Government at some point or another during their careers
2) All these crazy things seem to happen in the Western Deserts of the USA, which also may be home to large test ranges used to test out emerging (and often, highly classified) tech.
3) Most sightings seem to happen around military bases and test ranges, the majority of them being in the Anglosphere, (where there seems to be a bigger UFO culture than in other areas of the world)
I also find it hard to believe that most, if not all alien sightings have similar characteristics to each other, as if there is a preconceived notion of what aliens would look like. In reality, nobody knows what an alien would look like, as they may be able to survive conditions which may not be considered habitable to humans.
Voltzz
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I generally agree with you, however i would add/specify that it seems unlikely that any adversary spy-agency would be fooled by that. Therefore such disinformation campaigns seem not to be directly targeted at foreign governments, but at the domestic population. For example at enthusiast who spend days or weeks camping near military bases hoping to get a good photo of some new secret project. Such non-malicious leak of information can through the internet very quickly reach adversaries and the "infection" of part of this enthusiast community with the UFO-Fever could be a very efficient way to split, discredit, disorganize and misinform it.
Members of the Armed Forces who participate at the edges of a secret project without being "in the know" also would be likely targets of such a counterintelligence effort.
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Forgive me, as I didn't write what I intended to. What I meant was what you said now, these actions were done in order to fool enthusiasts from uncovering secret projects and lead them on a wild goose chase.
Perhaps it is a political question of money, in my opinion the budget of the space force should be increased.
It isn't for the adversaries. Their vast cyber operations don't care about aliens. Its for the American people. After decades of "UFO fatigue" the American people are pre-programmed to ignore reports of interesting sightings. This way if an "oopsie" happens, it will all work itself out. Stephenville is the perfect example.
shedofdread
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Maybe it's an engineer thing but I tend to look at things as simply as possible. IF aliens are coming to the Earth, What on Earth (or any other planet...) is going on with their maintenance / servicing regimes for their craft??? IF they are crashing in the numbers that Quest / the History channel suggests, then they are far less reliable than our humble aeroplanes...
Hmmmm.....
Hmmmm.....
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Very true indeed
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The US national was a missionary wanting to force locals to convert to kristianty. The got po'd and he got brown bread. Hooda thunkit?
They should have licked the dirt he walked on...........
They should have licked the dirt he walked on...........
Counterpoint: Illinois, and more specifically Chicago. Effectively single-party machine elections.
So far as I'm aware, nobody is suggesting *IQ* tests for voting. But who can legitimately argue that being ignorant of basic civics is a good thing... or that having a basic civics understanding should be a requirement to vote? If you have to pass a background check to buy a gun, then passing a basic "background check" in how the government works would make sense for voting.
"Name the Vice President." "What are the three branches of government?" "Name your state Governor." "What's bigger, the debt or the deficit?" Etc.
How can we hope to have a populace that could deal with "oh, look, space aliens" if we can't have a population expected to take even a *minimum* effort to know what the frak they're voting for?
southwestforests
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The way my brain initially read the thread title makes what would be a quite interesting story,
United States has retired craft of non-human origin
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