Hurel-Dubois Projects

[hesham]

Hallo,

Hurel-Dubois HD 45 a turbojet transport aircraft, and I read about it in a competition
I will remember it.

in some sites a number of unknown projects for example
www.airwarfareforum.com and http://www.acam.asso.fr/histo/premiers_equipements7.php?PHPSESSID=104390befd43a5c3c1f69293ea1a1405
such as Hurel-Dubois HD-37,HD-40,HD-41 and HD-160

any ideas please.

 

[Jemiba]

The HD.37 was a flying car ferry, based on the HD.31/32 series.
The HD.40 and 41 were forerunners to the HD.45, the Caravelle contender
The HD.45 was a contender in the competition, which saw the
SNCASE Caravelle as winner.
The HD.160 was an business turboprop/ light transport project of 1964/65,
totally untypical for Hurel-Dubois, as it had no high aspect ratio wing.

 

[Jemiba]

The HD-130 was a project for a light transport, designed around 1964, a high wing
aircraft carrying up to 17 passengers, quite similar to the Shorts Skyvan, but
with the typical Hurel-Dubois wing.

 

[TinWing]

Let's go back to the heavy transports...

Does the Hurel-Dubois HD34 series count as a "heavy transport?" Only 8 were produced, so while it wasn't an unbuilt project, it certainly might be described as "barely built."

 

[Jemiba]

Well, the HD-37, a HD-34 derivative intended as flying car ferry, perhaps could
have been used as a military transport. And the HD-321 even was used in a military
role during the Suez conflict, painted with yellow and black "Suez stripes" (something
for the modelers ?). A heavy transport ? That's a good question ! The HD-37 would
have had a payload of up to 8.500 kg, still in the "medium" class, I think. But is there
an exact definition ?

 

[amsci99]

Issue 63 of Air Enthusiast has an article on some of the projects. I wonder if Replic, Air Fan or Le Fana de le Avions had covered Hurel Dubois and his high aspect ratio aircraft. One of his designs the HD.34, formerly with the French Geographical Survey flies regularly at air shows in France. You can see it here at http://membres.lycos.fr/hurelduboishd34/

Personally, I wouldn't mind taking a ride on this whimsical but romantic prop aircraft.

 

[hesham]

Hurel-Dubois HD.332 assault transport project

Also from my dear Jemiba,

HD.35,HD.353 and HD.355 was twin engined ASM aircraft.

 

[Jemiba]

The HD 35 was an adation of the HD 321, powered by Wright 982 engines.
To improve take-off and attack speed, additional Marboré jet engines were
proposed, changing the designation to HD 353. For the envisaged Wright
engines, France would have had to pay in $, scarce during that time, so
"pure french" version was planned, with licence built Hercules engines and
two Marboré, too, changing designation again to HD 355. The basic HD.35
is shown in volume 2 of Cunys "Les Avion De Combar Francais". In the RAF
Flying Review .8.55 I've found a photo of a model of the HD 35, displayed
at the Paris Air Show, which has a different tail and obviously no radome.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

The Hurel-Dubois HD-70 was anther transport project but I have not
any details about it and the HD-109 was low wing twin engined light
transport project,powered by two 530 hp Astazou II engines.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

A small info about Hurel-Dubois HD.70,it was twin engined transport
aircraft project intended to compete Nord N.2600,it was accommodated
28-36 passengers and powered by two Dart engines,its estimated
speed was 310 mph.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

The Hurel-Duboid HD-150 was small version of HD-130 as a military
transport.

 

[Jemiba]

I only know the HD.151, IF the usual designation system was used
(that's not for ceratin, of course !), then it would have been a direct
derivative of the HD.150 and , in fact larger than the HD.130. The
HD.151 was designed as a tactical transport with two 930 hp Bastan
engines and boundary layer control, renouncing with the typical Hurel
Dubois wing with high aspect ratio, which still could be found in the
desig of hte HD.130, a lihgt civil transport.

 

[Jemiba]

Teamed with Sud Aviation Hurel-Dubois perhaps came quite near a
real production contract with the SAHD-120, as a contender for a
tactical transport, that eventually saw the Transall as the winner.

The SAHD 120 looks like a Transall with a typical HD-wing.

 

[AeroFranz]

The flight international archive has several good articles on one of the HD that made it into production, including a very nice cutaway.
I will find the link when i get off work and post it.

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear Boys and Girls, here is another French "Secret Project" for you; the Hurel-Dubois HD-37 which was a turboprop-powered car ferry variation on Maurice Hurel's standard theme. Note the Rolls Royce Dart engines and the upper deck passenger cabin abaft the wing......

Actually, it's not "secret", but it is a "project"......

The cutting is taken from the 25th July 1959 issue of Les Ailes......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[Triton]

Drawing of Hurel-Dubois HD.106 by Raymond E Vogler found on eBay.

URL: http://cgi.ebay.com/1950s-Hurel-Dubois-HD-106-Aircraft-Transport-8x10-Photo-/360195461154?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0

Seller's description:

Raymond Volger was lead illustrator for LTV Corp. in the 1950s-1960s

 

[Triton]

Drawing of Hurel-Dubois HD.37 by Raymond E Volger found on eBay.

URL: http://cgi.ebay.com/1950s-Hurel-Dubois-HD-37-Aircraft-Ferry-Transport-8x10-/360195462217?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0

Raymond Volger was lead illustrator for LTV Corp. in the 1950s.

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear Boys and Girls, here is a short article in French about the Société Anonyme de Construction des Avions Hurel-Dubois HD-151 STOL light military transport "project". The Hurel-Dubois HD.151 was one of the designs submitted for a 1960 Armée de l'Air competition for an army co-operation light transport; it featured wing-tip mounted Turboméca Autan III compressors to provide compressed air to blown flaps and ailerons. Note the fuselage-mounted ground-attack cannon in the illustration.....

The article comes from the 27th October 1961 issue of Les Ailes......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[toura]

Hi Caravellarella
The Hurel Dubois hd 151 by our friend JEMIBA

 

[toura]

and also the hd 150 from I don't remenber !

 

[Caravellarella]

Perfect; thank you Toura ;D

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear Boys and Girls, here is a two-page article in French announcing the Société Anonyme de Construction des Avions Hurel-Dubois HD-130 light turboprop utility transport "project".

Jemiba has better drawings than I do......

The article comes from the 21st April 1961 issue of Les Ailes......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[toura]

And , here something more
Bye Caravellarella

 

[Caravellarella]

And , here something more
Bye Caravellarella

Perfect, thank you Toura......

 

[Grey Havoc]

Does anyone know what aircraft, built or otherwise, was the French Navy order for a 100 H.D.35 ASW planes cancelled in favour of? Or was it just another victim of limited funds?

 

[Caravellarella]

Does anyone know what aircraft, built or otherwise, was the French Navy order for a 100 H.D.35 ASW planes cancelled in favour of? Or was it just another victim of limited funds?

Bréguet Br.1150 Atlantic?

 

[Grey Havoc]

Should have guessed. [Slaps forehead]

 

[Caravellarella]

Should have guessed. [Slaps forehead]

I don't know for sure Grey Havoc, the Bréguet Br.1150 Atlantic is a later multinational collaborative project from 1961......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[Grey Havoc]

Should have guessed. [Slaps forehead]

I don't know for sure Grey Havoc, the Bréguet Br.1150 Atlantic is a later multinational collaborative project from 1961......

Terry (Caravellarella)

And H.D.35 was from 1957/58 or thereabouts? Or was it earlier?

 

[Caravellarella]

Should have guessed. [Slaps forehead]

I don't know for sure Grey Havoc, the Bréguet Br.1150 Atlantic is a later multinational collaborative project from 1961......

Terry (Caravellarella)

And H.D.35 was from 1957/58 or thereabouts? Or was it earlier?

Page 2 of this topic implies 1955 for the HD-35, but I don't believe a real order for 100 aircraft ever actually existed......

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear Boys and Girls, here is a small piece in French about the Société Anonyme de Construction des Avions Hurel-Dubois HD-109 "project". It combined the fuselage of the Hurel-Dubois HD-130 "project" with a more conventional cantilever low wing of similar area but with a reduced span (to offer better performance) and was a competitor to the SIPA S.272 Présence "project"......

There is a drawing of the Hurel-Dubois HD-109 "project" here;
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1381.msg17445.html#msg17445

The Hurel-Dubois HD-130 "project" is here;
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1381.msg11478.html#msg11478

The SIPA S.272 Présence "project" is here;
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,12412.msg121737.html#msg121737

The piece comes from the 19th May 1961 issue of Les Ailes......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[hesham]

Hi,

here is a two concepts for Hurel Dubois airplanes,the last one is new for me.

http://www.avia-it.com/act/biblioteca/periodici/PDF%20Riviste/Alata/Alata%201950%2005.pdf

 

[Jemiba]

Again, I don't buy that this is actually a Hurel-Dubois design ! Perhaps it's just a design following the aerodynamic
layout featured by many Hurel-Dubois types and the article is about wings with a high span/chord ration,
not just about Hurel-Dunbois, which of course is one of the best known users of this layout. But for example,
the Miles HDM 106 wasn't a pure HD design, too.
(The caption says something like "transport aircraft of Hurel-Dubois formula", if I trust the online translation)
Please, if such points aren't clear, because of sources in a language not fully understood by the poster, I would
always recommend asking for help with a translations by a member knowledgable in that language, and I remind
to this thread http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,23344.0.html

It's just too easy to create "new types" via a wrong translation, something we should try hard to avoid !

 

[hesham]

My dear Jemiba,

the whole article is about Hurel studied,so it was cleared its his designs,if there was
something mystery in any anther article,of course I asked about it.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

the HD-36 was a maritime patrol variant Project of HD-31.

 

[hesham]

From Ailes 11/1952.

 

[cluttonfred]

The more things change....

http://www.boeing.com/features/2019/01/spreading-our-wings-01-19.page

 

[hesham]

Hi,

in post # 32 an article,which my dear Jemiba considered it just a design inspired by Hurel-Dubois,and I think he
was right,they wrote on it,Mr. Georeges Bruner ?.

Les Ailes : journal hebdomadaire de la locomotion aérienne / directeur, rédacteur en chef, Georges Houard | 1953-01-03 | Gallica

 

[fightingirish]

Right topic? The Sud Aviation SA-84M, a four-engined proposal for a tactical transport, that eventually later on saw the Transall C-160 as the winner.
Not mentioned in French Secret Projects 2.

Réponse : le Sud Aviation SA-84M, projet concurrent du Transall. Plusieurs configurations furent proposées - Deux ou quatre turbines - désignations allant de SA-80 à SA-85.

Twitter:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1148247507048251393

Edit: Attached pictures

 

[hesham]

From Icare 1961,

a good artist drawing to HD.130 Project.