Ideally yes, but historically than hasn't always been the case, cf HMS Jervis Bay vs Admiral Scheer, and MV Ondina and HMIS Bengal vs Hokoku and Aikoku Maru. And while the operations in the Bab el Mandeb technically aren't convoy operations the Western warships there have often been acting independently of each other.
That's not the point, the point is the engagement geometry in the Bab el Mandeb is pretty much exactly that we'd see for an escort protecting a convoy against a pop-up missile attack. Sometimes the geometry will work for you, sometimes it won't.
Do you have any actual source for NAVSEA “continuously changing the design over 5 years?” I glanced through the March 2025 GAO report and can’t find anything suggesting that to be the case.
To start I think people get too caught in the meaningless classifications like destroyer or frigate.
The problem is that the modern ASW threat includes things like Oscars and Yasens. Plus Type 095s from the PLAN and Type 75 Alpha/Type 77s from the Indians.
Just to clarify the nomenclature, the torpedo boat in torpedo boat destroyer does not refer to MTBs/PTs/PTGs, but to Victorian/WWI/WWII era ocean-going torpedo boats, which were a form of small destroyer (or rather, TBDs were form of large torpedo boat). All the German 'destroyers' at Jutland were actually hochseetorpedoboote (high seas torpedo boats), with the first significant German 'destroyer' class not really appearing until the 1918(Mob) Type, and even they were Grossestorpedoboote, not Zerstorer. The WWII German Type 1939 Flottentorpedoboot (aka Elbings) came in at 1,200t.
No, the torpedo boat in torpedo boat destroyer was not specifically about ocean going torpedo boats. Besides ocean going torpedo boats of the late 1890s were still extremely small. The US’s first torpedo boats even ocean going were roughly 80-100ft in length. A Higgins PT boat was 78’ ft long. Not like the difference is massive in size. Displacement might be massively different considering steel/iron construction vs wooden construction.
In modern times All ships can be multimission.
Most of the time, when people say "multimission ship" they're talking about AAW or ASW or ASuW, the primary threat the ship is intended to face. Not what the ship is supposed to be doing at a higher level, or how much help it's supposed to have while doing that job. Not "this ship is intended to be off by itself so it needs greater fuel, stores and spares capacity than a ship that is intended to be operating as part of a fleet with a supply ship right there."
Yeah about that, not everybody uses the ship they classify as frigates for " for operations mostly off by itself, commerce protection, anti-piracy, convoy escorting, etc."
The Type 23s were actually designed around independent ASW operations in the GIUK Gap.
What you consider them is 100% irrelevant because you’re no body.
Terms like small, are very subjective though, and your system is still primarily reliant on size of the ship.
The Pyotr Velekiy/Admiral Nakhimov (I dunno which one is currently active) is arguably the only proper cruiser currently active. The future Japanese ASEVs may be considered cruisers.
Big. Big-big.
That they're deliberately designed to act as large, high endurance, ABM platforms. I wouldn't be surprised if they had dedicated flag facilities to coordinate sea and land based missile defense efforts.
There isn’t even standardized definitions in most navies for their own ships afaik.
My use of "small" is supposed to be subjective.
That may not be a bad argument.
It definitely isn’t a bad argument.
Modern merchies cruise at 20+ knots, though.
Did see for 2018 vehicle carriers were the fastest merchant ships averaging at 14.95 knots, second container ships 14.2 knots, anyone have more up to date figures.
According to wiki china’s type 094 can do 30kts submerged….
And can't hear a damn thing at that speed.
If they're scattered, any given aircraft or skimmer will only engage one merchie.
Convoy escort has an interesting future, it might benefit from USVs more than the surface action groups. Could see a convoy being escorted by a single frigate or destroyer but with six, eight or more USVs both with and ranging ahead and wide of the convoy. Should have sufficient sensors and munitions available to protect the cargo and if combined with buoy or dipping sonar deploying UAVs they should provide great sub surface protection.
Once you know where they are you don’t need to hear them constantly. Without escorts no reason not to sprint for an hour or two, slow for a listen, sprint, etc.
I think the biggest threat would be loitering munitions.
Don’t need to destroy them necessarily. Cause fire, burn the cargo, force the crew to abandon the ship.
Been in the military and defense space online for a very long time and never heard of that site. Is that your own personal blog?
I think the current experimentation done by the USN to date shows that USVs should be able to comfortably meet the range requirements of convoy escort. These vessels also wouldn't necessarily be required to transit the whole duration with the convoy but be passed off to the next unit with gas stations positioned at strategic points along the transit routes to support.
Personal opinion but transits of cargo ships above 20knts is completely unrealistic.
It is a small sample but indicative of what is far more likely to be possible.
Ah no thanks. Just a short read indicates the analysis is off...
Only if the SSK is already in front of where the container ships are going.
Do me a favor, see how long it takes to get ahead of a 20kt contact detected at 30nmi directly ahead of you. Assume that you can sprint at 35kts, and the contact is more-or-less paralleling your course. Your attack position needs to be at least 5nmi ahead of the target.
Yes, that's a potential problem.
Oops, they just zigged away while you were going fast and you lost them.
All radar does is slightly increase your visual detection bubble, and it has a higher chance of detection when a ship is superstructure down over the horizon versus the Mk1 eyeball. (for the non-sailors, when only the masts are visible above the horizon)
