• Hi Guest! Forum rules have been updated. All users please read here.

Argentinian Unbuilt Projects

raravia

ACCESS: Confidential
Joined
Jan 29, 2006
Messages
90
Reaction score
5
Hi folks

I've reading about a number of non-built projects during the end of the 40's, the 50's and even the 60's, as IA-39 designed by Kurt Tank, IA-47, IA-48 a delta wing fighter, two projects called Pallavicino 1 and 2 for sure based on the Gloster Meteor, and others without number like the Horten wing fighter or IA Condor etc.

If anyone had illustrations, 3 views or something about it, please let me know.

there's a website wich have little views of some of this projects

http://www.portalaviacion.com/articulos/pulqui.html


Saludos

Fabián
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,351
Reaction score
3,375
Another article, this one on the Horten brothers' work in Argentina.

http://www.cmargentinos.com.ar/secciones/Aviones/Horten/horten.htm
http://www.cmargentinos.com.ar/secciones/Aviones/Horten/ia-34_y_ia-41.htm
http://www.cmargentinos.com.ar/secciones/Aviones/Horten/ia-37_e_ia-48.htm
 

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
I know relatively little envelope the non built projects of my own country and
I am so lazy that I have not even gone to the "Museum of the Industry" that is enough near my home to see the prototype of the PulquiII that there conserve.
On the other hand the conservation of the historical legacy of the Argentinean aeronautical industry is usually very bad or null. They have commented me
repeated times that the prototype of the Pucará Charlie is thrown being oxidized in a fallow land
A couple of projects of possible interest:

SAIA90 : http://www.hangardigital.com.ar/saia90.html

Pucará "Delta": http://www.hangardigital.com.ar/a58.htm
 

lark

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2006
Messages
1,805
Reaction score
70
Hello Fabian,

The Pallavicino 1 and 2 are based - April 1949 - on the
I.Aé.30 Ñamcu.
Both were to be powered by the R.R "Derwent V" powerplants of 1585kg(3.500lb)
static thrust at sea level.

Source : AeroFan-April/June 1997.No.61

Regards.

Paul.
 

TinWing

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
888
Reaction score
49
lark said:
The Pallavicino 1 and 2 are based - April 1949 - on the
I.Aé.30 Ñamcu.
Both were to be powered by the R.R "Derwent V" powerplants of 1585kg(3.500lb)
static thrust at sea level.

In retrospect, 1949 seems to be a bit late for a Derwent powered project.

Similarly, it is amazing the Pulqui II was still powered by the Nene, long after most every contemporary British project had moved on to the axial flow Avon.

I do have to wonder if Argentina had full access to the latest British engine technology in this period?
 

elmayerle

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2006
Messages
1,344
Reaction score
116
Dronte said:
I know relatively little envelope the non built projects of my own country and
I am so lazy that I have not even gone to the "Museum of the Industry" that is enough near my home to see the prototype of the PulquiII that there conserve.
On the other hand the conservation of the historical legacy of the Argentinean aeronautical industry is usually very bad or null. They have commented me
repeated times that the prototype of the Pucará Charlie is thrown being oxidized in a fallow land
A couple of projects of possible interest:

SAIA90 : http://www.hangardigital.com.ar/saia90.html

Pucará "Delta": http://www.hangardigital.com.ar/a58.htm

The Pucara "Delta" article was interesting, it could be the "little brother" of Grumman's AX entry.

Would you happen to have some good drawings and dimensions on the Martin Pescador? I've been wanting to model an Argentinean aircraft carrying this missile but information is not easy to come by, even online.
 

TinWing

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
888
Reaction score
49
elmayerle said:
Would you happen to have some good drawings and dimensions on the Martin Pescador? I've been wanting to model an Argentinean aircraft carrying this missile but information is not easy to come by, even online.

Martin Pescador ASM, 1979

Length: 2940mm
Diameter: 218.5mm
Span: 730mm

Weight: 140kg
Warhead: 40kg

Maximum Speed: Mach 2.3
Maximum Range: 9km
 

Attachments

  • martinpescador.jpg
    martinpescador.jpg
    7.4 KB · Views: 1,743

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
Basically I have the same data that TinWing:

Technical data of the Martín Pescador

Weigh to the launching: 140kg

Warhead weigh: 40 kg

Longitude: 2,94 meters

Span: 0.73 meters

Diameter: 0.29 meters

Reach: between 2.5 and 9 kilometers (it depends on the launching platform)

Speed to the impact around Mach 1

Source: (data and profile of the missile) "Aeroespacio" (magazine of the Argentinean air force)

I also attach a schematic cut of a Super Etendard that includes the drawing of a Martín Pescador next to the container of guide's system that I suppose it will be you useful as reference of the proportions of the device.
I have in some place a picture of this missile installed in a helicopter Agusta 109 but I have not been able to find it.
 

Attachments

  • Martin Pescador.jpg
    Martin Pescador.jpg
    7.1 KB · Views: 1,647
  • Super Etendard_MartinPescador.jpg
    Super Etendard_MartinPescador.jpg
    272 KB · Views: 1,898

TinWing

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
888
Reaction score
49
The Martin Pescador is roughly comparable in size to the training round version of the American Bullpup missile.
 

elmayerle

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2006
Messages
1,344
Reaction score
116
TinWing said:
The Martin Pescador is roughly comparable in size to the training round version of the American Bullpup missile.

Thanks, I'd pretty much gathered that and other reading indicated that, also like the Bullpup, it needed a datalink pod for proper guidance.

Still, all quite useful information. My thanks to all who provided it.
 

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
Finally I found the image of the version guided by wire of the Martín Pescador presented in "Armas '91".
 

Attachments

  • wireMartinPescador.jpg
    wireMartinPescador.jpg
    106.6 KB · Views: 1,688

rousseau

ACCESS: Secret
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
315
Reaction score
9
FMA Pulqui Ⅲ is only one I think.
If you have more, please tell me.
The I.A.43 is prelayout of HF-24 according to what I known.
 

Attachments

  • FMA Pulqui Ⅲ .jpg
    FMA Pulqui Ⅲ .jpg
    31 KB · Views: 1,851

Archibald

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2006
Messages
4,190
Reaction score
1,729
Iae 27 Pulqui was a straight wing fighter powered by a Derwent V. It was conceived by emile Dewoitine, well-known french aircraft designer which had been an active collaborator to the Nazi and Vichy regime.
Article about the Pulqui in October 2006 edition of Le Fana de l'Aviation :eek:
Later, in 1950, the Iae 33 Pulqui II was drawn by Kurt tank but ended in failure. This same person went to India after the fall of Peron in 1954.
 

elmayerle

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2006
Messages
1,344
Reaction score
116
The picture rousseau posted appears to be a step between the Pulqui II and what became the HF-24. As I understand it, one of hte problems with the Pulqui II was that Kurt Tank raised the wing, relative to where it was on the Ta-183 (shoulder -mounded wing as opposed to the mid-wing configuration of the Ta-183) and this increased drag to teh steriment of performance.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,351
Reaction score
3,375
Merged with existing thread. Rousseau, please search for existing threads before creating new ones.
 

hesham

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
26,668
Reaction score
3,462
Hallo,

FMA IA-60 was a Pucara airframe but fitted by two turbofan engines.
FMA IA-62 was two seat primary trainer ,powered by one 440 kw
(950 shp) Turbomeca Astazou XIVR turboprop engine.
FMA IA-59 was a pilotless aircraft.
 

Antonio

ACCESS: Top Secret
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2006
Messages
3,452
Reaction score
184
Don't miss Argentinian unbuilt projects on Le Fana de L'Aviation 443 (October 2006)!!!!
 

Archibald

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2006
Messages
4,190
Reaction score
1,729
:D Buy it some hours ago. There's the well-known Pulquis, but also plenties of fascinating stuff, including Horten mach 2 fighter!
 

smurf

ACCESS: Top Secret
Joined
Sep 6, 2006
Messages
547
Reaction score
26
Le Fana de L'Aviation 443 (October 2006)
Please tell me how to get this
 

Antonio

ACCESS: Top Secret
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2006
Messages
3,452
Reaction score
184
You can contact them here:

georgie.murat@editions-lariviere.fr
 

hesham

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
26,668
Reaction score
3,462
Hi,

some Argentina little known aircraft:


FMA IA-25 assault glider.
,, IA-28 twin engined fighter based on IA-24 with Rolls-Royce Merlin engines.
,, IA-31 and IA-32 two seat trainer aircraft.
,, IA-54 Carancho sailplane.
 

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
It is a shame that the Argentinean of the forum does not contribute anything, so...

Horten's first fighter proposal to Argentinian Air Force:
 

Attachments

  • Ho arg_4.jpg
    Ho arg_4.jpg
    79.8 KB · Views: 908
  • Ho arg_3.jpg
    Ho arg_3.jpg
    95.2 KB · Views: 806
  • Ho arg_2.jpg
    Ho arg_2.jpg
    51 KB · Views: 822
  • Ho arg_1.jpg
    Ho arg_1.jpg
    152.9 KB · Views: 992

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
The more advanced IA 37 in its two configurations and one projected all weather version of the Pulqui II
 

Attachments

  • All weather Pulqui2.jpg
    All weather Pulqui2.jpg
    233 KB · Views: 486
  • IA37windtunel_model.jpg
    IA37windtunel_model.jpg
    61 KB · Views: 389
  • IA37configurations.jpg
    IA37configurations.jpg
    33.3 KB · Views: 503
  • ia37.jpg
    ia37.jpg
    162.1 KB · Views: 820

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
The IA48

-Wind tunel models

-Original planes of a launchable model

-Artistic concept
 

Attachments

  • ia48_model.jpg
    ia48_model.jpg
    146.6 KB · Views: 211
  • ia48_model_2.jpg
    ia48_model_2.jpg
    104.1 KB · Views: 242
  • IA48_planos modelo lanzable.jpg
    IA48_planos modelo lanzable.jpg
    123.3 KB · Views: 324
  • ia48.jpg
    ia48.jpg
    104.8 KB · Views: 410

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
Kurt Tank's IAe36 Condor II fast transport 31/36 pass. 5 RR Nene II engines:

-Original planes

-Wind tunnel model with the original tail configuration
 

Attachments

  • CondorII_windtunnel model.jpg
    CondorII_windtunnel model.jpg
    83.9 KB · Views: 335
  • Condor2_planos originales.jpg
    Condor2_planos originales.jpg
    293.9 KB · Views: 455

Dronte

Argentinean ugly bird
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Messages
96
Reaction score
17
IAe36 Condor II with the final tail configuration resultant of the experience with the Pulqui II

(source of all pics "Las Alas de Perón" de R. Burzaco ed.1995 -sold out-)
 

Attachments

  • CondorII.jpg
    CondorII.jpg
    97.2 KB · Views: 429
  • Tank's_CondorII.jpg
    Tank's_CondorII.jpg
    216.7 KB · Views: 544

Archibald

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2006
Messages
4,190
Reaction score
1,729
Dronte those pics are superb! Very interesting... It would be nice to model this mach-2 argentinian fighter...
 

Antonio

ACCESS: Top Secret
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2006
Messages
3,452
Reaction score
184
¡Qué bueno Dronte!, Mil Gracias :eek:
 

Archibald

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2006
Messages
4,190
Reaction score
1,729
Good basis, the B-58 looks quite similar to a (much) scaled-down B-58.

what scale is your model ?
 

Kim Margosein

ACCESS: Confidential
Joined
Feb 10, 2007
Messages
103
Reaction score
5
Good basis, the B-58 looks quite similar to a (much) scaled-down B-58.

what scale is your model ?

1/72. As soon as I get a bit more comfortable with this forum, I'll post the pictures of it. I also have a 1/72 G10N.

Kim Margosein
 

reynald.d.chatillon

ACCESS: Restricted
Joined
Sep 26, 2007
Messages
5
Reaction score
1
The Pulqui II was a "built" plane, even if only prototypes. Find attached some renders I did in three versions:

1st. Preliminary 3D model with proper livery
2nd. Preliminary 3D model with the colors used later by the Argentinean Sabres
3rd. and 4th. Final 3D model with the livery of the acrobatic (originally Sabre) squadron.

some of these renders were already published in the lwg3d forum.

Cheers.

p.d.: this is the proper thread/forum for the renders?
 

Attachments

  • ia3305_045.jpg
    ia3305_045.jpg
    463.5 KB · Views: 756
  • ia3305_006.jpg
    ia3305_006.jpg
    279.8 KB · Views: 680
  • ia3305_121.jpg
    ia3305_121.jpg
    436.1 KB · Views: 609
  • ia3305_118s.jpg
    ia3305_118s.jpg
    248.9 KB · Views: 583

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,043
Reaction score
865
I think that if this corresponds to thread subject and 'real' unbuilt/built secret project, CGI can posted here. For photos of unofficial models, drawings and CGI images we have Scale Modelling, Fan Art & Profiles section. Good work, BTW!
 

boxkite

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2006
Messages
847
Reaction score
146
The Czech aviation magazine Letectvi + Kosmonautika # 23/1990 reported on a Argentinian helicopter projected by the company Fabrica Argentina de Materials Aeroespaciales.

Who of you knows more on it?
 

Petrus

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2006
Messages
602
Reaction score
234
Top