Sukhoi S-70 Okhotnik UAV

[tequilashooter]

Apparently this is a 57 mm cannon ...

Forward looking camera most likely. Look at the photos with Fedotow and screen image at 4:19. From the postition you can guess that camera is placed low and off-center to the right.

I think he is being sarcastic? Was it also confirmed that the t-50-3 was using this camera over the IRST it usually haves?

 

[LMFS]

Apparently this is a 57 mm cannon ...

Indeed, with the advantage that the pilot can aim, fire and load it personally from the cockpit, like in the good old times. Max reliability guaranteed

 

[Josh_TN]

The camera appears fixed. I wonder what a narrow field of view like that could be used for.

 

[mkellytx]

The camera appears fixed. I wonder what a narrow field of view like that could be used for.

Since these are test articles it makes me wonder if they are some kind of special instrumentation meant to capture test results. Maybe the Russians don't paint their SI orange like us.

 

[Scar]

Forward looking camera most likely.

He's joking...most likely.))

 

[QuadroFX]

Even blind man will see that this is not a 57mm cannon, but a 30mm one.

 

[tequilashooter]

Even blind man will see that this is not a 57mm cannon, but a 30mm one.

He is joking, No one thinks there is a gun because there is no blast shielded metal around the muzzle and the rear model further back I identified above is a small pod and does not have the length to be an actual gun.

Sort of read the mood here.

 

[QuadroFX]

It was a subtle joke. I've never been good at this )

 

[tequilashooter]

https://iz.ru/1145514/anton-lavrov-...e-minoborony-v-poiske-protivolodochnogo-drona
"]Packing weapons: the Ministry of Defense in search of an anti-submarine drone

Heavy drones will work together to detect and hit submarines

The Ministry of Defense is working on a project to create a special unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) and a control system for it to combat submarines. For this task, existing unmanned systems can be adapted or new ones developed. It is planned that such drones will be able to operate in a "flock" using elements of artificial intelligence. To accommodate the necessary equipment and weapons will require a model with a large payload, such as the C-70 Okhotnik, experts say.

Single network
To combat submarines, the Ministry of Defense is preparing a new concept. For this task, in the future, it is planned to use heavy drones equipped with submarine detection equipment and anti-submarine weapons. Several flying "hunters" united in a single network will be able to search for the enemy at the same time. Potential platforms for the creation of such an apparatus are now being studied, sources in the defense department told Izvestia.

Hunter drones can be launched from ground airfields or ships. They are planned to be controlled from both ship and air command posts, with the active use of automation capabilities and elements of artificial intelligence. UAVs will be able to either independently hit targets, or direct them to the strikes of anti-submarine weapons from other carriers."

 

[Acatomic]

Four APR-3ME air launched torpedoes could fit inside one S-70:

It's length is 3250mm, caliber is 350mm and weight is 470kg

https://www.navyrecognition.com/ind...nveils-apr-3me-grif-air-launched-torpedo.html
Other S-70 could carry and deploy just sonobuoys, in racks, like the one below just shorter:

 

[tequilashooter]

https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/11138619
First Deputy Chairman of the Board of the Military-Industrial Complex Andrey Yelchaninov stressed that in the near future, the ability to control several drones from the Su-57 cockpit will be implemented.

MOSCOW, April 13. /TASS/. Deliveries to the troops of the Okhotnik heavy unmanned strike system are scheduled to begin in 2024. This was announced by the first deputy chairman of the Board of the Military-Industrial Commission (MIC) Andrey Yelchaninov.

"It is planned to start delivering Okhotnik to the troops as early as 2024," Yelchaninov said in an interview."Rossiyskaya Gazeta".

He recalled that the drones are capable of operating under the control of a pilot piloting the Su-57 aviation complex. "These planes and drones can interact not only with each other, but also in different types of battle formations," Yelchaninov said.

He stressed that "in the near future, it will be possible to control several Okhotnik drones from the Su-57 cockpit. "The function of target distribution between these aircraft is being worked out. The group use of guided aircraft and unmanned aerial systems is just around the corner. And the first flights confirm this, " explained the first deputy chairman of the Board of the Military-Industrial Complex.

"In the future, it is planned that when used together, the Okhotnik UAV under the control of the leading manned vehicle will solve any tasks for air and ground targets. In this connection, we see great prospects for building up the combat potential of the Russian Aerospace Forces, " he concluded.

 

[Trident]

Shoigu being shown round NAPO, including the next S-70 prototype under assembly:

https://tvzvezda.ru/news/2021851154-rxe9v.html
Looks much the same as the first in some respects (inlet, air data booms), though it might have fewer excrescences (no apertures visible for mounting most that were present on the previous airframe). It also *seems* as though the nozzle could be the integrated rather than axisymmetric type, as the outer mold line is smooth, without a bulge for the (non-functional) reheat plenum.

 

[aonestudio]

Zvezda - Звезда : Sukhoi S-70 Okhotnik Part 1

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0f4CeOGPBA

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

excellent - live premiere! Watching....

 

[totoro]

At 31:33 into the video - what missile is that mockup of?

 

[Josh_TN]

Zircon?

 

[flateric]

At 31:33 into the video - what missile is that mockup of?

X-51A

 

[Forest Green]

https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/12564767

 

[bobbymike]

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...sias-s-70-unmanned-combat-air-vehicle-to-date

 

[Scar]

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...sias-s-70-unmanned-combat-air-vehicle-to-date

Too many village experts in radiophysics in TheDrive comments section, as always.

 

[Saber]

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...sias-s-70-unmanned-combat-air-vehicle-to-date

Too many village experts in radiophysics in TheDrive comments section, as always.

Written for and by as they say...

Reading over it, the author reiterates common talking points for the sake of it, not actually considering if they are true or not.

 

[torginus]

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...sias-s-70-unmanned-combat-air-vehicle-to-date

Too many village experts in radiophysics in TheDrive comments section, as always.

Written for and by as they say...

Reading over it, the author reiterates common talking points for the sake of it, not actually considering if they are true or not.

I do have a few questions regarding stealth and panel gaps, and I might as well post them here, since they come up in this article like clockwork.
It is generally asserted in Western media, that panel gaps kill stealth, and Russians are incapable of making cover panels without gaps.
With regards to the second point, I remember a documentary about the Su-33 from the early 90s, where an engineer boasted about how they achieved micrometer tolerances on the folding mechanism of the wings, and the planes wings when folded down certainly don't look like they have any visible gaps.
Is there any particular reason why payload bay door gaps would be a more challenging engineering issue?

Which leads to my other question. Just how important are panel gaps anyway? My physical intuition would say, that panel gaps smaller than the radar wavelength (~10cm) would probably lead to the radar waves diffracting and scattering on them, rather than straight reflection. Bay doors are visible only from a very narrow cone on the front which means that only their frontal profile matters.
Probably diffraction is not good anyway, but it happens on other material discontinuities as well, and probably can be dealt with by some methods.

Edit:
Sorry I dun goofed, X-band radar has more like 3cm wavelength.

 

[stealthflanker]

Which leads to my other question. Just how important are panel gaps anyway? My physical intuition would say, that panel gaps smaller than the radar wavelength (~10cm) would probably lead to the radar waves diffracting and scattering on them, rather than straight reflection. Bay doors are visible only from a very narrow cone on the front which means that only their frontal profile matters.
Probably diffraction is not good anyway, but it happens on other material discontinuities as well, and probably can be dealt with by some methods.

The concern is perhaps the diffracted wave from the gaps will interact with each other. This may create a constructive interference which will strengthen the wave. But there is also destructive one. It's lobe orientation however might be difficult to control thus closing or minimizing the gaps is desired.

This can be achieved by that tight tolerance or manufacturing parts as one big continuous piece, or by some form of adhesive or paint which to equalize and ensure continuities of the electrical properties in the gap. Or to actually break the diffraction into smaller less harmful lobes.

 

[Evgeniy]

View: https://youtu.be/wnjhf0dc8kE

 

[LMFS]

English version

 

[fightingirish]

Zvezda - Звезда : Sukhoi S-70 Okhotnik Part 2

View: https://youtu.be/Nr5nNVje7Bc

 

[Saber]

Impressive production tech for the automated dry carbon fibre tape laying, IIRC this technology was actually pioneered for the MS-21, resulting in slightly lower weight but more importantly vastly lower cost. Wouldn't be surprised to see this used for LTS in order to achieve their claimed price and performance figures.

Also very impressed with that large exhaust channel also being 3D printed. It's a large piece, with what looks to be a wire laying 3D printer, I'm willing to guess that the reason they didn't show it being printed was because the company behind it doesn't want to be associated with Russian MIC, which could result in sanctions against them. But you can put two and two together from this statement.

https://www.smtu.ru/ru/viewnews/4722/
This is a news post from the mechanical engineering department at St Petersburg State University, which has a company of it's own that produces 3D printers for Russian clients. This post talks about a delivery to UEC UMPO, which is the company charged with construction of the engine and exhaust channels for the S-70.

Below are a few videos of their printer(they have several models and are working on more).

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dr-wNCHEjlg

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Which leads to my other question. Just how important are panel gaps anyway? My physical intuition would say, that panel gaps smaller than the radar wavelength (~10cm) would probably lead to the radar waves diffracting and scattering on them, rather than straight reflection. Bay doors are visible only from a very narrow cone on the front which means that only their frontal profile matters.
Probably diffraction is not good anyway, but it happens on other material discontinuities as well, and probably can be dealt with by some methods.

Edit:
Sorry I dun goofed, X-band radar has more like 3cm wavelength.

Physical intuition isn't the best tool to analyse radar cross section.

For example, frontal radar cross-section is strongly influenced by trailing-edge geometry. Dan Raymer recounts how his 1979 Rockwell 'stealth flying wing' had a big 'spike' in frontal RCS caused by the trailing edge of the wing, which was a straight line. It was some years later he realised why.

Creeping waves occur when radar hits a target at a shallow angle, like the top and bottom of the S-70 when illuminated from the front for example. The waves travel along the surface and any discontinuity of surface like panel gaps can result in the wave being diffracted and an appreciable portion of the radar signal is sent back to the illuminating radar, much like from the trailing edge of Raymer's flying wing.

The main tools for addressing this are

1) Planform alignment of all doors and panels to the leading edge. This doesn't stop the radar return but ensures it generally points in the same direction as the main 'lobes' of the design as opposed to straight ahead.
2) Surface treatments like conductive tape across gaps to avoid electrical discontinuities.
3) Tight tolerances to minimise gap size.

Weapons bay and landing gear doors need special attention as they need to open in flight. You can cover up access panel edges with conductive tape or even spray RAM all over them, but landing gear doors are open at takeoff by definition and weapons bay doors will be opened in flight.

 

[tequilashooter]

That fact that these photos circulated online but have not reached this forum doesnt do it justice.



Appearance wise this is the assumption of radar being used for nose.



In other words the air to air missiles the drone would be using is definetly short range. Still cool I guess that you can send a stealth drone that can go target aerial targets by itself besides getting targetting assistance from a Su-57. Thought we were getting close in having drones target current military aircrafts. Cant wait to see the after production costs and if the drone can carry Larva missiles as well as the cherry on top.

 

[Anduriel]

used for nose.

Considering the size of the S-70(it's as big as Su-57), main aperture may be much larger.

 

[Sferrin]

used for nose.

Considering the size of the S-70(it's as big as Su-57), main aperture may be much larger.

It'd be interesting to see a comparison of its nose size to the F-22s (which is tiny).

 

[tequilashooter]

already found out from old sources of costs https://iz.ru/1019435/2020-06-03/nazvana-stoimost-tiazhelykh-udarnykh-bespilotnikov-s-70-okhotnik. I guess it is more convenient to have stealth drones with internal hypersonic air to ground missiles and a long combat radius for situations such as Turkey purchasing alot of S-400 systems they than get serious to target your troops in Syria and without the trouble of making it look like you are firing nukes from Europe's BMD system you fire it at them or move the drones closer to strike in the middle east as well.

Dont want to push my luck yet on deciding if it can go toe to toe with 4th gen or 4th gen+ aircrafts(unless we go with western stealth estimates) on aerial engagements. But dont see any other purpose for these drones (designed to engage long range advance air defenses) unless they have bad relations with Turkey, Israel, Saudi arabia, etc, countries that have a very low amount of nukes along with being isolated by not being close to other allies against a country with a growing BMD with newer ground radars, S-500s and A-235s. Targetting Europe which is not isolated or U.S. is not going to work well with a great amount of F-35s and such. Turkey although NATO state has some serious bad relations right now. Great drones for major surprise attacks and giving other countries less reaction time.

 

[QuadroFX]

4K photos of S-70 and T-50 lab by "Zvezda" TV:

 

[Scar]

4K photos of S-70 and T-50 lab by "Zvezda" TV:

She's fkn huge! Combat radius should be not less than 2000km.

 

[Egor Zverev]

2 new photo

 

[tequilashooter]

Engine of Su-70 with new nozzle.

Heard engines will get mass produced with this. https://www.argusmedia.com/en/news/2173177-russia-to-advance-additive-manufacturing-in-2021

Metal powders — typically alloys of aluminium, titanium, steel and copper, as well as nickel and cobalt in powder form — are increasingly being used in complex industrial applications to customise intricate components, reduce the weight of parts and streamline the production process.

The development of metal powders available on the global 3D printing market accelerated in 2020 and processes are needed for their integration into production and supply chains in Russia, said Mikhail Turundaev, general director of Rusatom Additive Technologies (RusAT). For example, German additive manufacturing company EOS has about 100 3D printing systems operating in Russia and plans to add more in future.

RusAT — a subsidiary of TVEL Fuel Company, which is part of Russian state-owned nuclear firm Rosatom — has opened its first Centre for Additive Technologies (Cat) at the site of the Moscow Polymetal Plant. The plant has installed 3D printers for producing metal powders, post-processing equipment and a product research lab to develop additive manufacturing technologies and demonstrate the possibilities of using additive technologies in industrial enterprises.

The centre plans to have a full additive manufacturing production cycle in place by the end of 2021 to cover the needs of RusAT's customers, Turundaev said. A second stage of development will add advanced equipment to the facility using selective laser sintering and stereolithography technologies, and will expand the range of testing and auxiliary equipment. The company expects the centre's revenue after the second stage to reach 300mn roubles ($4.05mn) by 2030.

Now whats needed after cheap mass production are targets to try the toys with.

 

[Cannonfodder43]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1470651355962527744

View: https://twitter.com/KomissarWhipla/status/1470651355962527744
5

https://twitter.com/x/status/1470649664928108545

View: https://twitter.com/HaoGao12/status/1470649664928108545

So much for those op-eds and "analysis" takes that repeat that the "the Russian's don't have as much experience" with LO design.

 

[Scar]

And still, it looks not stealth for me. Landing gear wheels are not hexagonal.

Sry, moderators, couldn't help myself.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

So much for those op-eds and "analysis" takes that repeat that the "the Russian's don't have as much experience" with LO design.

They don't?

Doesn't mean they can't learn though.

 

[Cannonfodder43]

So much for those op-eds and "analysis" takes that repeat that the "the Russian's don't have as much experience" with LO design.

They don't?

Doesn't mean they can't learn though.

I probably could have worded it better in saying, they understand the physics and principles of stealth* just like us.

Just that Westerners seem to dismiss their designs and efforts without looking at Russian thinking or at Russian language sources that we at SP have. We Westeners tend to fall back on stereotypes instead of hard headed analysis with proper context.

*Although to be honest, most Western reporting on stealth seems too shallow and simplistic as well.