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Author Topic: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's  (Read 27894 times)

Offline covert_shores

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #30 on: November 21, 2014, 03:11:58 pm »
to clarify, I was responding specifically to the image posted re 2014 submarine scare.


re 'tracked' submersibles in 1980s, I must confess I wasn't aware of clarity regarding terminology. For sure people interpreted as tracked like a tank,and that is a possibility.  Tunandar at one point proposed that it as NR-1 although we was not aware a the time that NR-1's wheels were in tandem. The main reason, as I understand it, for NR-1 to have wheels was because they wanted to survey the seabed visually so it was much easier than trying to 'fly' that close. Other submersibles designed for finding thins on the bottom didn't have any wheels or anything however. A lot of submersibles, including Russian ones, have skids or frames on the bottom which would leave track marks. Maybe one day we will know for sure but in the meantime there's a lot of mud in the water. :D
« Last Edit: November 21, 2014, 03:18:00 pm by covert_shores »
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Offline Grey Havoc

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #31 on: October 26, 2015, 04:44:40 am »
« Last Edit: October 26, 2015, 04:47:28 am by Grey Havoc »
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Offline phil gollin

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #32 on: October 26, 2015, 04:51:35 am »
.


Is this the same USA which has admitted to tapping into underseas cables in the past ?

Offline TomS

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #33 on: October 26, 2015, 05:45:46 am »
Sure.  If the Soviets had known what we were up to with the cables, they'd have been concerned too. 

Offline Grey Havoc

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #34 on: October 28, 2015, 04:30:39 am »
Sure.  If the Soviets had known what we were up to with the cables, they'd have been concerned too.

They did find out eventually, thanks to some very well placed spies.
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Offline Grey Havoc

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The sole imperative of a government, once instituted, is to survive.

Offline Mr London 24/7

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #36 on: June 21, 2016, 02:40:47 pm »
http://www.larouchepub.com/eiw/public/1983/eirv10n19-19830517/eirv10n19-19830517_039-submarine_warfare_in_scandinavia.pdf

Quote
On April 26, the Swedish Submarine Defense Commission completed a report on Swedish defense capabilities against alien submarines, and the nature of a series of submarine invasions which occurred in heavy density during October 1981. Excerpts from the report follow.

Quote
Tracks on the sea floor have been found in the area around Hors Bay-Mysingen Bay:
In Hors Bay, i.e., in Djupviken and Maersgam and in the strait between Huvudholmen and Alvasta LaanghQlm.
Tracks have been found outside of Danziger Gatt.
Tracks have been found in the northern part of Mysingen Bay.
As is shown by the video-photographic material [accom­panying the report], these tracks indicate two different vari­eties of sea floor tracks, both coming from mini-submarines and, on top of this, tracks from a sea-floor-parked conven­tional submarine.
The documented tracks indicate two different types of mini-submarines. At certain locations tracks have been found indicating a caterpillar tread vehicle, while other tracks in­dicate keel scratches on the sea floor by another type of mini­ submarine.
At one location outside of Malsten (just outside the magnetic tripwire) a large number of tracks have been found, tracks of both types of mini-submarines as well as sea floor scratches of a conventional submarine thought to have been functioning as the "mother ship".
A careful evaluation of the information from the sea floor shows that the mini-submarines have been manned, and that they can travel "floating" under water, propelled by a pro­peller or driven by caterpillar treads on the sea floor
« Last Edit: June 21, 2016, 02:43:16 pm by Mr London 24/7 »

Offline TomS

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #37 on: June 21, 2016, 08:27:18 pm »
I would be very skeptical of anything published by Lyndon Larouch's organization, especially in the EIR, which famously accused Queen Elizabeth II of running an international drug trafficking ring and claimed that the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing was orchestrated by the British government as part of a plot to take over the United States.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Intelligence_Review#Criticism

Offline Mr London 24/7

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #38 on: June 21, 2016, 08:33:50 pm »
Indeed, both wacko theories no doubt... but my interest was the embedded quote taken from the the Swedish Submarine Defense Commission.

For me anything from Wikipedia also *not great*...

Offline TomS

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #39 on: June 21, 2016, 08:38:51 pm »
Larouche's wackiness is easily confirmed from other places.  Wiki just happens to be a convenient summary.

My concern would be that the excerpts may have been taken very selectively.  Without the original to compare against, you can't even be sure it hasn't be altered. 
« Last Edit: June 22, 2016, 05:38:52 am by TomS »

Offline covert_shores

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #40 on: June 23, 2016, 02:59:27 am »
I've seen some good stuff on this recently from level-headed Nordic defense observers  - will share when I find the links :)
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Offline covert_shores

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Re: 'Tracked' Mini Submarines in Swedish waters - 1980's
« Reply #41 on: September 08, 2016, 01:59:34 pm »
Seems like a good place to post this. Not a tracked mini-sub, but a very little known Soviet mini-sub used in the Baltic in the 1980s. And not saying that there is any evidence that these were the culprits for any of the incursions. Project 1015 SPLC. Roughly equivalent to an X-Craft.

main write up http://www.hisutton.com/Russian%20X-Craft%20SPLT.html


Quote
Very little is known about the nine X-Craft built by the Soviet Union in the 1970s, and operated through the 1980s. The Project 1015 SPLC type was analogous to the British X-Craft midget submarine and appears to have had similar capabilities. SPLC stands for Special-purpose submarines (СПЛЦ - Специальные подводные лодки-цели), although the boats are also described as SPLT and SPLTS. The 9 SPLCs were distributed across all fleets: 2 in the Northern, 2 in the Pacific, 2 in the Baltic, 2 n the Black Sea and 1 in the Caspian. At least one was converted to an uncrewed craft and known as the Haddock.


After World War Two the Russians became interested in naval Special Forces capabilities and paid particular attention to British wartime exploits and equipment. It is natural therefore that they might seek to emulate the X-Craft, which was still in service throughout the 1960s. The Italian CB Class and German Seehund may also have been influences.

The SPLC is about the same size as an X-Craft but likely smaller on the inside thanks to its double-hull construction. In line with post war design philosophy, the bow was more rounded than on the original X-craft, which would have optimized the SPLC for submerged performance. It retained the short fixed snort mast similar to postwar X-craft however, allowing her to run on the surface on just below, while running on her diesel engine. Combined with the dry interior, this would have increased range considerably over similar sized all-electric SDVs. In the Baltic, Black Sea and Caspian Sea this would have translated into a shore-to-shore capability without the need for a mother ship. For longer missions he SPLC could be towed like X-Craft were, and there is evidence of towing attachments on some examples.

The craft had two access hatches in the sail which suggests that one of them, likely the aft one, provided a diver lock-out capability. Although it is not confirmed, there is no other obvious explanation for having two hatches on such a small craft. This capability would be in line with the British X-Craft and Italian CA Class.

In service these midget subs kept out of the public eye and are rarely even listed among Soviet submarine classes. They were likely employed for testing harbor defenses, acting as inshore anti-submarine warfare (ASW) targets and for equipment trials.
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« Last Edit: September 08, 2016, 02:03:46 pm by covert_shores »
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