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US Supersonic Transport (SST) Program 1960-1971

flateric

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Zillion thanks!!
 

hesham

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Hi,

the Lockheed arrow wing SST airliner aircraft.
http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1979/1979%20-%204333.html
 

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flateric

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Found it on my HDD - L-2000 mock-up...and cool flight attendants (of course, woman stays on the 'No Step' area, what one could expect from her? ;D
 

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Antonio

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Their uniforms are really cool. Thanks for sharing.
 

Caravellarella

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Dear Pometablava, those "cool" uniforms are genuine Braniff International Airways stewardess uniforms; the ones with the repeating pattern are the the second uniform designed by noted Italian designer Emilio Pucci for 1967. The clear plastic "space helmets" are from his first 1966 collection for Braniff.


All best, Terry, (Caravellarella).
 

Antonio

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Terry,

thanks to your post I found more about Emilio Pucci's collection for Braniff at the following links:


https://flic.kr/p/fvCvk
 

Skybolt

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Nice document from Boeing's here:
http://www.emotionreports.com/downloads/pdfs/boeing.pdf

There is surprisingly few on the -300 technically-side. Also of interest is the neat 3-views detailing the "public" evolution (no hint to the 1968 studies that led to the delta configuration), where you can find the rarely seen early-VG 2707 canard configuration.
 

flateric

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Skybolt, you made my day!
 

flateric

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Lockheed SST evolution to Phase IA (CL-823 and early L-2000 configurations). Source: Lockheed Horizons Vol.1, Spring 1965
 

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Mark Nankivil

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Good stuff Flateric - thanks! Mark
 

Skybolt

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Lockheed did research on behalf of NASA on practical configurations for SST. This was pre-competitive and Lockheed did internal competitive research as well, but the cross-breeding was natural. Configurations studied were based on SCAT-4, -15, -16 and -17 for SST with a cruise speed of Mach 3 built with titanium, and a SCAT-17 derivative for a cruise speed of Mach 2.2 built with aluminium. Boeing did the same (or so). Will post later. BTW, SCAT-17 and SCAT-17 Aluminium were posted here by Scott some time ago. I repost them for completeness of view.
 

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Skybolt

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Corresponding Boeing studies based on generic SCAT designs. Only difference was that Boeing did the Mach 2.2 cruise design built with aluminium using the SCAT-16 VG base. Differences in interpretations are apparaent. Unfortunately, I have only plan views of the Boeing designs (for now).
 

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flateric

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Skybolt, thanks for adding these!
 

Skybolt

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The Boeing Model 1080 iterations posted by Scott some time ago were some of the configurations (all under the Model 1080 blanket) proposed by the Seattle company answering the 1991 NASA RFP for a High Speed Commercial Transport (HSCT). So (like mine SCAT-derived design, answering the AST/SCAR 1972 NASA RFP) do not strictly pertain to this thread. I suggest the moderator to split the topic and reorganize it in at least two: one for the first SST program, ended in 1971, and one for subsequent efforts.
 

flateric

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It's a real Gordian Knot to do, but I'll try...should really SCAT efforts be separated from the *first* US SST effort? I'm going to create AST and HSCT threads as well ...
 

Skybolt

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Gregory, SCAT configurations (and SCAT-derived, like the 15F) were used up to circa 1973. In effect, the B-2707-300 wasn't strictly SCAT based but derived from internal efforts started at least in late 1967. Later the NASA efforts (and at least the Lockheed internal ones) concentrated on the arrow wing config. Boeing did a secret internal research on arrow wing configuration for the Transportation Department in 1967 when the VG config chosen run into problems. As it is evident, the SST program history has yet to be written. The HCST in 1988 started from a clean sheet, no SCAT there. :p
 

hesham

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Sorry,

I don't remember if we display this North American VG SST aircraft
before or not .
http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1963/1963%20-%200936.html?search=propeller%20aircraft%20project
 

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Apteryx

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Orionblamblam said:
The Convair design:

http://www.up-ship.com/apr/extras/58-9/58-9.htm
I wonder if you've seen this photo. My college roommate found it taped to the back of a file cabinet he was moving at the University of Florida in 1981.
 

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Skybolt

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Well, not exactly "this" photo, but that's the notorious SST derivative of the B-58.. Thanx!
 

Skybolt

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I could be wrong, but I don't remember having ever seen this. It is the stretched configuration (read probably: production) of the Boeing Model 733-197, the original (Jan 1964) Boeing bid for the Commercial Supersonic Transport competition. The stretched versions were actually two, one for domestic (transcontinental) and the other for intercontinental (transatlantic) service, but they were externally identical. Dimensions and weight are in the image.
This come from one of the proposal document that is available online, here http://handle.dtic.mil/100.2/AD803509. Beware, 22 MB, but enjoy !
 

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flateric

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Another great find, Skybolt, thanks!
And this is last Phase I VG Boeing submission - 3-view from 2707-300 paper from your previous pdf link plus artist's renderinf from March, 25 1965 Flight International.
 

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Skybolt

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Mmmm, Gregory, I think that 1965 is too early for the last VG submission. The 1966 winning proposal was the 2707-100. Probably the art is from a transition configurations between 733-197 and 2707-100. I have the designation somewhere. I seem to remember that there wa a last ditch attempt at the end of 1967 to "save" the VG, that is probably the not-integrated wing-tail config from the previous PDF. I think I'll have some first answer in a couple of weeks, and a definitive one in the spring.
 

flateric

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You are right, let's call it 'last submission as of March 1965'...did some SST phase end around this timeframe?
 

Johnbr

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How far did get in the making of the prototype.
 

Skybolt

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Some structural element.
 

Skybolt

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did some SST phase end around this timeframe?
Actually they were betweek Phase 2A and PHase IIB (June 1965), so that would be Boeing design submitted to the Phase IIB review.
Forgot to mention that all documents of Phase IIA (Nov 1964)and Phase IIB (June 1965) are not available in PDF form but only in hardcopy (printout from microfilm, I think). So it will take some time to have them.
 

Skybolt

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Just to give some chronological sense:
the images below are a freeze frame of what was the status of the SST program in November 1965, review at end of Phase 2-C. Model 733 without dash number is the preproduction aircraft (experimental prototype), Model 733-390 is the production version with Ge engine, Model 733-394 is the production one with P&W engines.
 

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LowObservable

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Air Force One based on a B-58....

We could repeal the 22nd Amendment.
 

hesham

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Hi,

the SCAT from Flightglobal;
http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1963/1963%20-%201986.html
 

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KJ_Lesnick

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What kind of technology in regards to fly-by-wire, engine-control-systems, autopilots did the Lockheed and Boeing SST's possess?

Also, does anybody have a picture, drawing or diagram of what the L-2000's cockpit looked like since I've NEVER seen one.


KJ_Lesnick
 
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