• Hi Guest! Forum rules have been updated. All users please read here.

Soviet MFI/I-90 designs

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
Well, we all know the 1.44 demonstrator. But how did Mikoyan arrive at this configuration? What was the design evolution? What might the production 1.42 look like?

What about the Sukhoi and Yakovlev designs?

First- from Yefim Gordon's Nowe Su i MiG published in Polish by PKL, a TsAGI originated diagram showing a notional "conventional fighter" and two new designs, which appear somewhat like Mikoyan and Sukhoi's MFI designs.
 

Attachments

  • TsAGI.gif
    TsAGI.gif
    155.2 KB · Views: 2,438

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
What seems to be a (CGI?) illustration of an MFI test model, somewhat like a Soviet "HIMAT".

DM5.12 MODEL

DM-512.jpg

Weight range480-520 kg
Altitude range500-7000 m
Speed range40-150 m/sec
Experiment duration150 sec
Number of recorded parameters128

  • Pneumatic control surfaces actuators;
  • Start from a Mi-8MT carrier helicopter;
  • Landing with a triple-canopy parachute cluster and airbag shock absorber.
The operations were conducted during 1986-1992.

The models had the modular design concept. The versions of aerodynamic layout permitting to realize controlled high-angle-of-attack flight under the full airflow breakaway were completed with these models. The problems of aerodynamic and gas-dynamic control methods combination, control system structure and laws were investigated during the flight tests at supercritical angles of attack, under the stall and spin conditions.

The obtained research results allowed to receive a series of advanced aerodynamic layouts for high manoeuvering aircraft.

From http://www.khai.edu/niipfm/english/dm512-en.htm (link now dead)

Pictures showing the SLM-22 first test model for the Sukhoi Berkut. It looks like the inlet design is significantly different.


SLM-22 MODEL

SLM22-lux.jpg SLM22-Mel.jpg 400.jpg

Weight950 kg
Altitude range1500-5000 m
Speed range40-120 m/sec
Experiment duration600 sec
Number of recorded parameters128

  • Hydraulic control surfaces actuators;
  • Start from a Mi-8MT carrier helicopter;
  • Landing with the parachute and hydraulic shock absorber.
The model was created in period from 1986 to 1990 and tested in 1991-92.

The following research programs were performed with the model:
  • Research of stability, controllability, stall, spin and methods of spin recovery for an aircraft with the forward-swept wing and different control laws also;
  • Research of pressure distribution, air vortexes trajectories and airflow over the surfaces of plane units visualization;
  • Research of air consumption through the engine gas flow duct effect to the stability and controllability characteristics.
From http://www.khai.edu/niipfm/english/slm22-en.htm (link now dead)

SLM-32 MODEL

SLM32-2.jpg SLM32-river.jpg SLM32-2open.jpg


Weight1200 kg
Altitude range500-5000 m
Speed range40-200 m/sec
Experiment duration600 sec
Number of recorded parameters128

  • Power plant - M-601M turbojet;
  • Hydraulic control surfaces actuators;
  • Start from a Mi-8MT carrier helicopter;
  • Landing with the parachute and hydraulic shock absorber.

SLM-32

The model was created in period from 1988 to 1992 and tested till 1999.

The model was the further development of SLM-22 model. It was equipped with turbojet engine.

The following research programs were performed with the model:

  • Research of stability, controllability, stall, spin and methods of spin recovery for an aircraft with the forward-swept wing and different control laws also;
  • Research of effect of power plant operation mode to the streamlining, stability, controllability, stall and spin characteristics.

(link now dead)
 
Last edited:

Matej

Multiuniversal creator
Joined
Feb 13, 2006
Messages
2,614
Reaction score
147
Website
www.hitechweb.genezis.eu
Alex (paralay) has got a good answer:

PS: Look at the trailing edge technical solution ;)
 

Attachments

  • 05.gif
    05.gif
    58.1 KB · Views: 601
  • 04.gif
    04.gif
    52.6 KB · Views: 679

Matej

Multiuniversal creator
Joined
Feb 13, 2006
Messages
2,614
Reaction score
147
Website
www.hitechweb.genezis.eu
Yakovlev design is described in Jefim Gordon´s Sukhoi S-37 and Mikojan MFI book at pages 9 and 10 (I have it in my language mutation, so this can differ). Refused because its one engine configuration.
 

Attachments

  • JakMFI.jpg
    JakMFI.jpg
    50.8 KB · Views: 595
  • image006.jpg
    image006.jpg
    18.8 KB · Views: 387

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
More SLM-32 pics, these from Paralay, and final one from Piotr Butowski.
 

Attachments

  • S-32 model.JPG
    S-32 model.JPG
    77.8 KB · Views: 1,134
  • 410.jpg
    410.jpg
    13.3 KB · Views: 400
  • 420.jpg
    420.jpg
    6.8 KB · Views: 386
  • 430.jpg
    430.jpg
    5.5 KB · Views: 340

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
More pics of Yak MFI.

I'm not convinced your drawing is accurate in this case, Matej.

Source:
  • Yefim Gordon, Sukhoi S-37 and Mikoyan MFI, Red Star Volume 1, Midland Publishing 2001
 

Attachments

  • Yakovlev MFI-d.jpg
    Yakovlev MFI-d.jpg
    35.3 KB · Views: 266
  • Yakovlev MFI-c.jpg
    Yakovlev MFI-c.jpg
    38.2 KB · Views: 258
  • Yakovlev MFI-b.jpg
    Yakovlev MFI-b.jpg
    41.2 KB · Views: 252
  • Yakovlev MFI-a.jpg
    Yakovlev MFI-a.jpg
    40.4 KB · Views: 249

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
Nice inlet view.

Source:
  • Yefim Gordon, Nowe Su i MiG, PKL, 2001
 

Attachments

  • Yakovlev MFI-f.jpg
    Yakovlev MFI-f.jpg
    26.1 KB · Views: 321

Matej

Multiuniversal creator
Joined
Feb 13, 2006
Messages
2,614
Reaction score
147
Website
www.hitechweb.genezis.eu
overscan said:
I'm not convinced your drawing is accurate in this case, Matej.

The best what I can do without any proven dimensions and only with photos from different angles. The same like with my MiG izdelije 33 drawing.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
I'm not criticising, it just doesn't quite "feel" correct compared to the photos.
 

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
Matej said:
Alex (paralay) has got a good answer:

PS: Look at the trailing edge technical solution ;)

That's in fact illustrations from TI TzaGI reprinted from AIAA paper No.74-970
AN ANALYSIS OF THE EFFECTS OF INTERNALLY BLOWN
JET FLAPS ON AN ADVANCED FIGHTER AIRCRAFT DESIGN
J. L. PARKER and L T . R . F. BALL
Air Force Flight Dynamics Laboratory
Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, Ohio

Regarding 'interesting techincal solution' - he mean, in fact, bunch of dozen aerodynamic control surfaces, but I'm not sure - may be, 1.42 would have all that novel jet flaps.
 

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
C.37 aeroelastic test model and assembly pics
 

Attachments

  • IMG_2592s.jpg
    IMG_2592s.jpg
    103.3 KB · Views: 394
  • IMG_2594s.jpg
    IMG_2594s.jpg
    92.6 KB · Views: 290
  • IMG_2593s.jpg
    IMG_2593s.jpg
    84.4 KB · Views: 288
  • IMG_2586s.jpg
    IMG_2586s.jpg
    71.3 KB · Views: 248

Matej

Multiuniversal creator
Joined
Feb 13, 2006
Messages
2,614
Reaction score
147
Website
www.hitechweb.genezis.eu
overscan said:
I'm not criticising, it just doesn't quite "feel" correct compared to the photos.

Do not hesitate to do that. Any constructive criticising is welcome. Where do you see differencies? Maybe i can redraw it.

Regarding to production version of MiG MFI (1.42), it is known that it should have double delta wing, refueling probe, wedged air intakes, rounded dielectric radome, some communication antenas, FLIR and a bit redesigned bomb bay. But the question is, if it is enough. These expectations are based only on two test flights. Maybe if the test program goes well, there should be a lot of another improvements.
 

Attachments

  • MiG.jpg
    MiG.jpg
    29.1 KB · Views: 572

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
These pictures (from Paralay's site) appear to show the TsAGI test model which was seen by visiting French engineers and others in the early 90s and which generated the first speculative 3 views of S-32.
 

Attachments

  • s32b.jpg
    s32b.jpg
    69.5 KB · Views: 281
  • s32c.jpg
    s32c.jpg
    51.5 KB · Views: 262

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
Matej said:
Maybe if the test program goes well, there should be a lot of another improvements.

Over here modelers are awaiting 1.44 to be loaned to Monino nearest time to count all rivets.
Test program went nowhere. Last thing I remember Saturn returned AL-41F from MiG as MiG could not pay for them.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
Or another example. Before the design/projection with all of known today aircraft with the sweepforward Of s-37 golden eagle "(in the working drawings it was named Su-27KM, which by itself about the much tells), was executed project with the complete (!) set of the working documentation of experimental single-engine aircraft with the wing with the sweepforward S-22. I on one of the solemn conferences (apropos some of anniversary) chief designer Mikhail Petrovich Simonov, enumerating achievements OKB during the accounting period, said exactly the following: "it's completely finished design with the release of the trash bin working documentation* of the supersonic aircraft, equipped with the forward swept wing. These works made it possible to collect experience and they make it possible for us to go further "


*trash bin working documentation - kinda of brain training exericise with zero metal cut in result, for designers to not stop their minds working
 

Sundog

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2006
Messages
2,863
Reaction score
329
Matej said:
Just imagine the engine that they were going to use. Sojuz R-179-300 with 200,1 kN of thrust!! More thant JSF powerplant.

That really isn't saying anything regarding engine performance. There are alot of engines more powerful than other engines. The real metrics are the thrust to weight ratio of the engines, the thrust levels they can operate at for a given amount of time, and their life cycles and efficiency. The Russians build good engines, but they still don't have anywhere near the life cycles of the U.S. engines. I'm sure they're getting better, though, as that is one of the major drawbacks to Russian combat aircraft on the market, even considering their much lower prices.

I'm just looking forward to seeing what the T-50 will <i>actually</i> look like and what MiG's MiG-29 replacement is going to look like, since they are once again going with a high/low mix, in terms of size; i.e. the T-50 is replacing the Flanker (fighter variant) and the new MiG will replace the Fulcrum. I have to wonder if they will look at making a medium bomber out of the T-50 or if that is something that won't happen for another twenty years since the Su-34's are just now going into limited production.
 

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
Famous shot, but here it goes in much better quality than before.
 

Attachments

  • mfi-s.jpg
    mfi-s.jpg
    453.2 KB · Views: 1,053

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
1.44 air drop model for aerodynamic testing.
 

Attachments

  • 1.44-freefall.jpg
    1.44-freefall.jpg
    27.5 KB · Views: 837

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
with high level of probability, 1.44 instrument panel screenshot
 

Attachments

  • 1.44-1.jpg
    1.44-1.jpg
    25 KB · Views: 729

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
I thought that at least we had enough money for more than one 15-inch LCD display on 5th generation fighter, Sasha...
 

paralay

ACCESS: Confidential
Joined
Mar 2, 2006
Messages
154
Reaction score
59
To me it the person told seeing breadboard model of a cabin - one big LCD display.
 

Trident

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
May 8, 2006
Messages
1,057
Reaction score
349
Paralay beat me to it - I was also going to point out that this purpoted 1.44 panel looks a lot like the Su-27SM cockpit...
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,670
Reaction score
4,285
It we are talking about 1.44, that makes a lot of sense. You wouldn't expect a full glass cockpit in that demonstrator at that point in time.
 

flanker

ACCESS: Top Secret
Joined
Mar 20, 2008
Messages
892
Reaction score
121
Awesome pictures Flateric. Does anyone know the faith of MiG-1.44? Where is it now?
 

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
Trident said:
Paralay beat me to it - I was also going to point out that this purpoted 1.44 panel looks a lot like the Su-27SM cockpit...

Well, hapiness was so possible...anyway, it was shown in middle of 1.44 maiden flight video footage. Hope one day we will see the real one.
 

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
This MiG LIIDB hangar in Zhukovsky was the place where 1.44 was in storage from 1994 to at least end of 2000. With a high level of probability, it's still there.

in winter of 1999, 1.44 was rolled out of hangar for a several hours for video footage, made by Wings of Russia stidio and photographers - you can see fingerprint building and trees behind the aircraft, with giant hangar at the portside. Not clear, if this event was prior, during or after official 1.44 presentation.
 

Attachments

  • 144_5.jpg
    144_5.jpg
    48.5 KB · Views: 658
  • 224580227884.jpg
    224580227884.jpg
    27.6 KB · Views: 647
  • 3b8cc519bf1e.jpg
    3b8cc519bf1e.jpg
    60.6 KB · Views: 616
  • MiG_Hangar.jpg
    MiG_Hangar.jpg
    151.9 KB · Views: 667
  • MiG_Hangar_.jpg
    MiG_Hangar_.jpg
    209.5 KB · Views: 698

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
To note is a cavity at the bottom of fuselage for *conformal* carriage of missiles pallete, details of MLG well, and rarely seen aircraft HUD.

Also goes Yuri Vorotnikov, 1.44 chief designer
 

Attachments

  • 91c84433d7d8.jpg
    91c84433d7d8.jpg
    17.3 KB · Views: 220
  • cb6e0ad213c4.jpg
    cb6e0ad213c4.jpg
    79.8 KB · Views: 215
  • 89f511fe571a.jpg
    89f511fe571a.jpg
    71.2 KB · Views: 193
  • 435822a5f2ae.jpg
    435822a5f2ae.jpg
    59 KB · Views: 250
  • 4088a5c75365.jpg
    4088a5c75365.jpg
    50.4 KB · Views: 241
  • yuri_vorotnikov.jpg
    yuri_vorotnikov.jpg
    35.3 KB · Views: 139

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
we have shoot some today as well...
 

Attachments

  • Clipboard02.jpg
    Clipboard02.jpg
    127.5 KB · Views: 319
  • Clipboard01.jpg
    Clipboard01.jpg
    170.8 KB · Views: 229

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
sic transit gloria mundi...

please do not re-post at outer internet

f34b06ebc654t.jpg


maden with a kind help from Miroslav Gyrosi
 
Last edited by a moderator:

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,106
Reaction score
1,093
to my knowledge, the only MFI ad that was ever published (Military Parade, #5/1999)

caption says "MFI - This Is A Step Into XXIth Century"
 

Attachments

  • MFI_AD_1999.jpg
    MFI_AD_1999.jpg
    107.9 KB · Views: 238

Similar threads

Top