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DoD Temporary Designations for Soviet / Chinese Aircraft based on airfield

overscan (PaulMM)

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RAM-G - Yakovlev Yak-38
RAM-H - Tupolev Tu-144D
RAM-J - Sukhoi Su-25
RAM-K - Sukhoi Su-27
RAM-L - Mikoyan MiG-29
RAM-M - Myasishchev M-17 Mystic
RAM-N - Ilyushin Il-102
RAM-Q - Usenet postings referring to RAM-Q have been made, no idea what it might refer to.
RAM-P - Tupolev Tu-160
RAM-R - Buran space shuttle orbiter prototype
RAM-R1 - Buran prototype in glider configuration
RAM-R2 - Buran prototype with 4 jet engines for atmospheric flight tests
RAM-T - Yakovlev Yak-41
 

Maveric

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Hi,

RAM-M Mjassischtschew M.17
RAM-H also for Tupolew Tu.144D
RAM-J Suchoi T.8/Su.25
RAM-K Suchoi T.10/Su.27

( Source: Gunston The Osprey Encyclopedia of Russian Aircraft )

Servus Maveric
 

DIMMI

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sorry for may be not very interesting question but... where I can read about US designation system based on satellites photos of soviets airfields?

RAM
NOVO
TAG
and others...

If it can - with all letters of ABC... thank you
 

flateric

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http://www.designation-systems.net/non-us/soviet.html#_DOD_Location_Aircraft

List of codes for Soviet locations:

CASP - Caspian Sea
KAZ - Kazan
NOVO - GAZ-153 factory airfield (Novosibirsk)
RAM - Ramenskoye (Moskow)
SIB - SibNIA Research Facility (Novosibirsk)
TAG - Taganrog (Black Sea)
 

DIMMI

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flateric said:
http://www.designation-systems.net/non-us/soviet.html#_DOD_Location_Aircraft

List of codes for Soviet locations:

thank you, flateric
but this tables I know some years ago
I dreamed about more)))))

Have you access to US DoD designation of soviet aircrafts with satellite pics for designation? joke)))
I think - if they have NOVO-C name that they have NOVO-C photo... ))) You haven't access to this?
 

flateric

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you have NOVO-C photo = you know satellite camera resolution
you disclose first thing, you disclose the second

meantime, it would not be satellite picture, but HUMINT photo like it was with Tu-160

anyway, you are desclosing country's abilities to gather information at specific place, technical characteristics of intelligence gathering hardware, possible HUMINT source, and information that national intelligence has on subject - and very soon, FBI comes, and you are going to jail for a long-long time

PS Ildar Betretdinov is working on T-4MS book. Hope that '200' derivatives will be there as well
 

Pioneer

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So has U.S. Intelligence stopped using the RAM designation, since the demise of the Soviet Union?Did the Sukhoi T-50 have a RAM designation? RegardsPioneer
 

Pioneer

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Sorry gents, but does anyone know if the Ilyushin Il-102 (competitor to the Sukhoi T-8/Su-25) had a NATO code name designated to itRegardsPioneer
 

Thorvic

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Pioneer said:
So has U.S. Intelligence stopped using the RAM designation, since the demise of the Soviet Union?Did the Sukhoi T-50 have a RAM designation? RegardsPioneer

I Think the RAM designation stands for Ramenskoye Airfield the Soviet tsting facility and the airfcraft spotted there using Spy Satellites or Spy Planes. Now there is no need as information is more readily available from source to give a more correct designation based on manufacturer.
 

Disclosure

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I don't believe we can assume that US intelligence has stopped assigning tempoary designators. After all, these deignators are classified, and are very rarely released. The most recently released temporary designator was the KN-08 missile, DPRK's road mobile ICBM paraded in April 2012.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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However, RAM- designations are no longer needed because


A) We know that the airfield is called zhukovsky
B) There are no new planes of unknown origin being flown there.


North Korea is a whole different situation, as a second's rational thought would tell you.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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RAM-A Unidentified as of 1974
RAM-B Unidentified as of 1974
RAM-C: Yak-36 FREEHAND
RAM-D: 'Observed only once - similar to E-166'
RAM-E Twin engine delta wing fighter (presumably Sukhoi T-6-1)
RAM-F: T-6-2IG / Su-24 FENCER

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78T04759A010400010167-8.pdf
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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VLAD A - MiG-25 FOXBAT
NOVO A - Unidentified as of 1974
NOVO B - Su-15 FLAGON
ARSEN A - Mi-24 HIND A
TAG A (Unknown in 1974 - Beriev/Bartini VVA-14)

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78T04759A010400010167-8.pdf
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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NOTE: RAM-H is described as a 'large delta-wing aircraft'. It seems unlikely its really Tu-144D as listed above - the Tu-144 was well known in 1974 so you'd think it would have been recognised and described as a CHARGER variant. Possibly its actually the T-4?
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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RAM-Q revealed...

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP83T00574R000100670001-2.pdf
 

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overscan (PaulMM)

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Interesting USENET post on RAM-Q

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!search/SOVIET$20RAM-Q/rec.aviation.military/LHsljVZ5VEo/ymnGaVhn49QJ


At the time of the Ram Q imagery, we figured the Commies were setting
us up by assembling a decoy airframe and then conveniently
"forgetting" to put it completely under cover during 'high oblique
passes'. As far as I recall, there was never a full image of the
creature - one pass would show the forward fuselage, the next a little
more, without ever showing the whole thing. Then it went away,
leaving us with a designation and a couple blurry photos and nothing
more.

In conversations with other people in my career field at the time, we
couldn't narrow it down to anything beyond, "Possibly a new Sukhoi or
IL." In later years, I've started to wonder if it wasn't a mockup of
the IL-102. Yes, this critter was *that* ugly.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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China

Harb-A Harbin SH-5

Nan-A unknown cargo transport
Nan-B Nanchang J-12

Xian-A Shenyang J-8 FINBACK (referred to as "Hsian-A" in early CIA documents)
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78B03817A000600010009-9.pdf

RAM-A - Delta wing
RAM-B - Twin Engine swept wing
RAM-C - VSTOL
RAM-D - Single engine delta wing
RAM-E - twin engine delta wing

VLAD-A - twin engine delta wing
NOVO-A - twin engine delta wing
 

Nagumo

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Ram Q must be Il-102 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP90T00784R000100080003-4.pdf

Ram E = Novo B = Su-15 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP84T00864R000100610014-1.pdf

Ram A = Tu-123 drone https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP83T00574R000103060001-6.pdf

Ram N = Tu-22M fuselage https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP84T00171R000200250001-3.pdf

Ram B is probably Yak-28-64 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78T05929A002700050001-6.pdf

Nan A is probably Nanchang JingGangShan-4
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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SIB-A located!

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78B03817A000600010009-9.pdf
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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Off to bed but this is really useful - https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78T05929A002700050001-6.pdf

RAM-B is Yak-28-64
RAM-D is probably Ye-150
 

Nagumo

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Tom B = Mi-28 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP84T00171R000300450001-0.pdf

Tag C = Kaps B = Orlyonok https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78T05698A000100010077-2.pdf

Kiyev B = An-124 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP90T00784R000200520006-1.pdf

Kiyev A = An-72 Coaler A https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP79T01184A000100030001-6.pdf page 486

Chech A a Chech B = aerohydrodynamic research vehicle https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP79T01184A000100040001-5.pdf page 42

Chuck A ???? https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP79T01184A000100030001-6.pdf page 12
 

hesham

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Nice work,thank you my dear Paul,and thank you Nagumo.
 

Nagumo

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Kiyev C = ? https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP87T00076R000102090001-3.pdf page 22

Sino A = Q-5 Fantan
 

Nagumo

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Luk A = ? https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78B07179A000200020001-5.pdf page 19
 

Nagumo

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Ram S https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP85T00840R000200090001-7.pdf page 18
Chuck B, C a D https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP79T01184A000100010001-8.pdf page 15 and 16
Luk A = Ram J = Su-25 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP79T01184A000100010001-8.pdf page 21
 

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Tag B, Chech A and B a Chuck A to D are ekranoplans https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP79T01184A000100040001-5.pdf (page 417 and 418)
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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ARSEN - Arsen'yev
ARSEN-A Mi-24 HIND A

CHECH - ??
Chech-A Ekranoplan
Chech-B Ekranoplan

CHUCK - ??
Chuck-A Ekranoplan
Chuck-B Ekranoplan
Chuck-C Ekranoplan
Chuck-D Ekranoplan

KASP - Kaspiysk
Kasp-A KM 'Caspian Sea Monster'
Kasp-B A-90 Orlyonok (also TAG-C)

Kiyev - Antonov
Kiyev-A An-72 COALER
Kiyev-B An-124 CONDOR
Kiyev-C An-74 MADCAP?

LUK-A Sukhoi Su-25 FROGFOOT (Also RAM-J)

NOVO - GAZ-153 factory airfield (Novosibirsk)
NOVO-A (Possibly Tu-22 with outer wings removed)
NOVO-B Su-15 FLAGON (or T-6-1?)
NOVO-C Possibly T-60 related item?

RAM - Zhukovsky / "Ramenskoye"
RAM-A Tu-123 drone
RAM-B Yak-28-64
RAM-C Yak-36 FREEHAND
RAM-D Ye-150?
RAM-E Sukhoi T-6-1 (Fixed Wing Su-24)
RAM-F Sukhoi T-6-2IG (Su-24 FENCER)
RAM-G Yakovlev Yak-36MP/38 FORGER
RAM-H Sukhoi T-4
RAM-I (omitted)
RAM-J Sukhoi T-8 (Su-25 FROGFOOT)
RAM-K Sukhoi T-10 (Su-27 FLANKER)
RAM-L Mikoyan 9-12 / (MiG-29 FULCRUM)
RAM-M Myasishchev M-17 MYSTIC
RAM-N Tu-22M fuselage
RAM-O (Omitted)
RAM-P Tu-160 BLACKJACK
RAM-Q Il-102
RAM-R Buran
RAM-S Possibly Yak-38M? Mentioned in report alongside FORGER-A
RAM-T Yak-41 FREESTYLE

SIB - SIBNIA
SIB-A Aerodynamic test vehicle, 1.42 related?

TAG - Taganrog
TAG-A Beriev/Bartini VVA-14
TAG-B ?
TAG-C A-90 Orlyonok
TAG-D Beriev A-40 MERMAID

TOM - Tomilino (Mil OKB)
TOM-A Mi-26 HALO?
TOM-B Mi-28 HAVOC

VLAD - Akhtubinsk/'Vladimirovka'

VLAD A - MiG-25 FOXBAT
 

SOC

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BLACKJACK was RAM-P.
 

Nagumo

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Ram E https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81T00618R000100040001-4.pdf page 6

Kerch B https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP78B07179A000100560001-7.pdf page 11
 

Nagumo

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Novo C is probably captured F-14 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP88T01079R000200090001-9.pdf page 14
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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INTERESTING!

RAM-H is NOT Tu-144D but Sukhoi T-4 as I speculated, based on the description in that article.

(https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP81T00618R000100040001-4.pdf)
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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Nagumo said:
Novo C is probably captured F-14 https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP88T01079R000200090001-9.pdf page 14

Disagree. The quote says that US Embassy officers saw a twin-engined aircraft with moveable wings and twin vertical tails flying near Irkutsk, which might be the NOVO-C possible Fencer followon.

This implies NOVO-C had already been observed at Novisibirsk prior to August 1987 and might be the aircraft seen.

This implies NOVO-C looked like a FENCER followon, appeared to have moveable wings, twin engines and twin vertical tails (in order to make sense of this report).

Sounds consistent with an Su-24BM mockup....
 

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Nagumo

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Sib-A https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP83T00574R000102160001-6.pdf
 

Nagumo

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Miel-A = PZL I-22 Iryda https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP92T01321R000200310006-4.pdf
 

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