Shin Meiwa project?

boxkite

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2006
Messages
862
Reaction score
222
I found this simple sketch in an aero 10/1962 article giving a perspective of the Japanese aviation industry. The description isn't clear, but I believe it's a Shin Meiwa project for a medium-range reconnaissance seaplane. Should it be (one of) the origin(s) for the later PS-1/SS-1/US-1?
 

Attachments

  • 214.GIF
    214.GIF
    29.6 KB · Views: 1,096
L

Lee

Guest
boxkite,
While I'm online, I just looked at your posted drawing and remembered last night at home I read that the Japanese redesigned an American WWII flying boat which looks almost like your drawing. This was in a past issue of Air International magazine, a British publication that's imported to the states where I live.
I'll try and remember to get the exact issue number and some of the other particulars of the aircraft by tomorrow.
 

boxkite

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2006
Messages
862
Reaction score
222
Thank you in advance, Lee.

Is this an aid(ing) air intake on the back of the fuselage (in front of the wings)?
 

Gannet

ACCESS: Restricted
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
42
Reaction score
8
According to Bill Yenne's book "Seaplanes and Flying Boats" copyright 1997 "In 1966, the Japanese government contracted with Shin Meiwa to build a new ASW flying boat to replace the Martin Marlins then in service. The result was the SS-2 (designated as PS-1 by the Japanese Marine Self Defense Force), a four engine aircraft whose hull and tail were quite similar to the Marlin."
 

EEP1A

ACCESS: Restricted
Joined
Nov 27, 2006
Messages
36
Reaction score
3
That is the ShinMaywa UF-XS experimental seaplane which first flew on December 1962. It was heavily converted from Grumman UF-1 and used to test many new technologies for the PS-1/US-1 seaplane.

http://www.shinmaywa.co.jp/english/guide/museum_flying_boats_n03.htm

The actual plane is now displayed at Kakamigahara Air Museum northwest of Nagoya city.

http://moriair1.hp.infoseek.co.jp/airMkaka16.htm

eep1a
 

Apophenia

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
2,892
Reaction score
1,567
boxkite said:
Is this an aid(ing) air intake on the back of the fuselage (in front of the wings)?

Boxkite,

On the UF-XS, the twin T58s supplied compressed air for boundary layer control (see below). But I do not think that your sketch shows the UF-XS.

The proportions are wrong even for that much-modified Albatross. I suspect that you were on the right track suggesting that this was an early view of the PS-1. Probably, an artist extrapolated from the UF-XS (which was flying by 1962) to envision the then-future ASW boat.

----------
from "Giant Amphibian" by Tim Wright, Air & Space magazine, Dec 2003

http://www.airspacemag.com/issues/2003/december-january/cit-wright.php?page=1

ShinMaywa experimented with an array of high-lift devices to enable the UF-XS to take off and land at slower speeds. The tailplane and outer sections of the wings had leading edge slats. Flaps on the inner sections of the wings’ trailing edges could be deflected as much as 80 degrees, and on the outer sections, as much as 60 degrees. Engineers augmented these movable surfaces with an experimental system for controlling the boundary layer...

As an aircraft approaches the low speeds associated with landing, the boundary layer flowing over the wing becomes increasingly turbulent and the wing loses lift. To retain smooth flow, and therefore lift, as long as possible at slower speeds, ShinMaywa devised a system to blow air over the flaps and the elevator to keep the airflow smooth, enabling the aircraft to maintain lift and control at low speed. The air was produced by a 1,250-hp General Electric T58 turboshaft engine mounted in the aircraft cabin.

The UF-XS research showed that aircraft with such a system for boundary layer control (BLC) - as well as improved hull designs - could operate in much rougher seas than had been possible before. ShinMaywa incorporated the high-lift devices developed for the research program into the design of the anti-submarine PS-1 and the US-1/US-1A rescue aircraft.

-------
 

frank

ACCESS: Top Secret
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
617
Reaction score
22
My thought was a modernized WWII H8K Emily, which I've read was quite advanced for its time. What's the correct English spelling? Meiwa or Maywa? I recall only seeing the former.


Apophenia said:
boxkite said:
Is this an aid(ing) air intake on the back of the fuselage (in front of the wings)?

Boxkite,

On the UF-XS, the twin T58s supplied compressed air for boundary layer control (see below). But I do not think that your sketch shows the UF-XS.

The proportions are wrong even for that much-modified Albatross. I suspect that you were on the right track suggesting that this was an early view of the PS-1. Probably, an artist extrapolated from the UF-XS (which was flying by 1962) to envision the then-future ASW boat.

----------
from "Giant Amphibian" by Tim Wright, Air & Space magazine, Dec 2003

http://www.airspacemag.com/issues/2003/december-january/cit-wright.php?page=1

ShinMaywa experimented with an array of high-lift devices to enable the UF-XS to take off and land at slower speeds. The tailplane and outer sections of the wings had leading edge slats. Flaps on the inner sections of the wings’ trailing edges could be deflected as much as 80 degrees, and on the outer sections, as much as 60 degrees. Engineers augmented these movable surfaces with an experimental system for controlling the boundary layer...

As an aircraft approaches the low speeds associated with landing, the boundary layer flowing over the wing becomes increasingly turbulent and the wing loses lift. To retain smooth flow, and therefore lift, as long as possible at slower speeds, ShinMaywa devised a system to blow air over the flaps and the elevator to keep the airflow smooth, enabling the aircraft to maintain lift and control at low speed. The air was produced by a 1,250-hp General Electric T58 turboshaft engine mounted in the aircraft cabin.

The UF-XS research showed that aircraft with such a system for boundary layer control (BLC) - as well as improved hull designs - could operate in much rougher seas than had been possible before. ShinMaywa incorporated the high-lift devices developed for the research program into the design of the anti-submarine PS-1 and the US-1/US-1A rescue aircraft.

-------
 
L

Lee

Guest
boxkite said:
Thank you in advance, Lee.

Okay, here's the magazine reference, thus,

Air International, Vol. 69, No. 5, pgs. 26-30

The other members would be correct in saying the Grumman UF-1 Albatross was heavily modified to add thing like more engines to the wing and a turboshaft along the fuselage centerline to provide STOL performance by innovative blowing of flaps and tailplane.
ShinMaywa US-2 specifications:

Powerplant: four 4,500shp Rolls-Royce AE 2100 turboprops driving Dowty R414 six-blade props
Performance:
Max. speed 300 knts (555km/hr)
Cruise Speed 229 knts (425km/hr)
Takeoff distance(water) 886 ft (270m)
" " " (runway) 1,608 " (490m)
Range (from water T-O) 5,000 nm (5000km)
( " runway " ) 2,062 nm (3815km)
Weights: (empty) 56,504 lbs (25639kg)
Max " (from water) 94,797 lbs(43000kg)
" ( " runway) 99,200 lbs (45000kg)
Dimensions: length 109'9" (33.46m)
wingspan 108'9" (33.15m)
height 32'2" (9.8m)
wing area 1,462 sq.ft. (135.82m^2)
Passengers: 20 people sitting or 12 on stretchers

(This was quoted from the magazine.)
 

Apophenia

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
2,892
Reaction score
1,567
frank said:
My thought was a modernized WWII H8K Emily, which I've read was quite advanced for its time. What's the correct English spelling? Meiwa or Maywa? I recall only seeing the former.

It was Shin Meiwa Industries when these aircraft were designed, but it's ShinMaywa now.

There is an Emily tie-in. Kawanishi Aircraft Company Limited became Shin Meiwa Industries Ltd in 1949. Shin Meiwa became ShinMaywa in 1992.
 

hesham

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
May 26, 2006
Messages
28,551
Reaction score
6,289
Hi,

http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1966/1966%20-%201181.html?search=shin%20meiwa%20aircraft%20project
 

Attachments

  • PS-X.JPG
    PS-X.JPG
    36.9 KB · Views: 966

Jemiba

Moderator
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2006
Messages
8,361
Reaction score
1,599
The details fit quite well to the UF-XS, just the size not. I think,
it's a kind of artit impression based on an enlarged UF-XS. The question
then is :Is it a Shin Meiwa drawing, or was it made by an artist from the
aero magazine?
 

Attachments

  • Shin_Meiwa_UF-XS.jpg
    Shin_Meiwa_UF-XS.jpg
    26.6 KB · Views: 1,016

boxkite

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2006
Messages
862
Reaction score
222
Is it a Shin Meiwa drawing, or was it made by an artist from the
aero magazine?

The publisher has forgotten to give the credits :( .

Thanks to all for your help.
 

Grey Havoc

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
16,999
Reaction score
6,634
From the blog Surveillance to Go Nowhere, a nice photo of a US-1 flying in formation with three US-2s:​


[IMAGE CREDIT: Surveillance to Go Nowhere/JMSDF]​
 

Attachments

  • photo_US2_JMSDF_01.png
    photo_US2_JMSDF_01.png
    69.8 KB · Views: 805

Grey Havoc

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
16,999
Reaction score
6,634
Thought this would be the best place to put this; Via Hush-Kit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh8mn0DeKSs&feature=player_embedded
 

blackkite

Don't laugh, don't cry, don't even curse, but.....
Joined
May 31, 2007
Messages
8,081
Reaction score
4,272
Hi! Wind tunnel test model of UF-XS. You can see airintake for BLC(boundary layer control) engines at the top of the aircraft.(GE T-58)
And PS-1 concept.
 

Attachments

  • UFXS_KASM001.jpg
    UFXS_KASM001.jpg
    135.6 KB · Views: 66
  • UF-XS DATA 2.jpg
    UF-XS DATA 2.jpg
    108.3 KB · Views: 61
  • PS-1.png
    PS-1.png
    973 KB · Views: 83
  • UF-XS WIND TUNNEL TEST MODEL 1 by 24 SCALE.jpg
    UF-XS WIND TUNNEL TEST MODEL 1 by 24 SCALE.jpg
    56.4 KB · Views: 427

blackkite

Don't laugh, don't cry, don't even curse, but.....
Joined
May 31, 2007
Messages
8,081
Reaction score
4,272
What if? Passengers are very hard in STOL mode. ;D
http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=1926.0

http://www.shinmaywa.co.jp/english/movie/
 

Attachments

  • PS-1.jpg
    PS-1.jpg
    136.3 KB · Views: 129
  • BLC.jpg
    BLC.jpg
    236.6 KB · Views: 479
  • img_420863_37901955_2.png
    img_420863_37901955_2.png
    246.2 KB · Views: 548
  • img_420863_37901955_1.png
    img_420863_37901955_1.png
    267.5 KB · Views: 585
  • 244e7bec.jpg
    244e7bec.jpg
    27.9 KB · Views: 601
  • 508398.gif
    508398.gif
    1.4 MB · Views: 917
  • SM_SS-2_PASS_01_zps3078b840.png
    SM_SS-2_PASS_01_zps3078b840.png
    39.3 KB · Views: 645

blackkite

Don't laugh, don't cry, don't even curse, but.....
Joined
May 31, 2007
Messages
8,081
Reaction score
4,272
Hi!
source:ISBN978-4-89319-188-5
 

Attachments

  • PX-S plan in May 1962.jpg
    PX-S plan in May 1962.jpg
    842.6 KB · Views: 183
  • 51-L+j8LnrL__SL500_AA300_.jpg
    51-L+j8LnrL__SL500_AA300_.jpg
    22.4 KB · Views: 115
  • UF-XS 3 SIDE VIEW.jpg
    UF-XS 3 SIDE VIEW.jpg
    416.5 KB · Views: 140
  • BLC SYSTEM.jpg
    BLC SYSTEM.jpg
    327.4 KB · Views: 129

Jemiba

Moderator
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2006
Messages
8,361
Reaction score
1,599
Thanks for sharing !

Reminds me of a revived Kawanishi H8K Emily ! ;)
 

Pioneer

Seek out and close with the enemy
Senior Member
Joined
May 22, 2006
Messages
2,153
Reaction score
688
I believe that an American aerospace company came to an agreement to licence-produce the US-1A (or equivalent) in the United States for civilian use?
Am I correct in thinking this? and if so, does anyone know the American manufacture and the time period of this agreement?

Regards
Pioneer
 

GTX

All hail the God of Frustration!!!
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2006
Messages
3,817
Reaction score
2,348
Website
beyondthesprues.com
Pioneer said:
I believe that an American aerospace company came to an agreement to licence-produce the US-1A (or equivalent) in the United States for civilian use?
Am I correct in thinking this? and if so, does anyone know the American manufacture and the time period of this agreement?

The company involved may have been Grumman. According to Wikipedia the spinoff landplane designs were Design #487 and Design #487C, part of a joint program of the 1970s with Grumman. Design #487 was aimed at a US Military STOL transport requirement, while Design #487C was a 90-seat commercial STOL airliner version aimed in particular at American Airlines.
 

Grey Havoc

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
16,999
Reaction score
6,634
Skyblazer said:
Design #487: PX-2 land-plane transport derivatives of Shin Meiwa under consideration by American Airlines; used basic wing, empennage and powerplants of PS-1 with two new fuselages; the commercial version (487C) could accommodate up to 90 passengers (circa 1970).

More on the PX-2: http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,10149.0
More on Grumman STOL designs: http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,10544.0

index.php
 

Grey Havoc

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
16,999
Reaction score
6,634
Hood said:
Shin Meiwa US-1
Flight Refuelling Ltd. made a study at the request of the Japanese Navy to fit tanker and receiver equipment to the US-1. It could use the vice-versa system developed in 1966 to refuel a stranded flying boat. The hose drum unit would be mounted in the tailcone along with the drogue and a ram-air turbine would be fitted to the base of the fin in a small blister. A retractable fuel probe would be mounted fitted.
 

Similar threads

Top