ATF: speculation and disinformation from the 1980s

[flateric]

Sferrin, I hardly doubt Adobe Systems even existed then=) This is colour transparent film as I think.

 

[Sferrin]

Sferrin, I hardly doubt Adobe Systems even existed then=) This is colour transparent film as I think.

Dude, I'm talkin' about the F-35 shot on the right. Actually I guess it would help if I posted the picture I was referring to eh?

 

[flateric]

Well, Syd Mead's creature even did it way into Lockheed AIAA papers in 1989!

AIAA 1989-1407
ELEVATED TEMPERATURE ALUMINUM ALLOYS FOR ADVANCED FIGHTER AIRCRAFT
J. C. Ekvall, R. A. Rainenn, and D. J. Chellman
Lockheed Aeronautical Systems Company, Burbank, California
R. R. Flora
Air Force Wright Aeronautical Laboratory
Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, Ohio
M. J. Gerbach
Lockheed Aeronautical Systems Company,
Marietta, Georgia

 

[Sferrin]

That wasn't the Syd Meade design but a different one. Check the canard position on that one with the S.M. one.

 

[flateric]

well, a*slightly* modified S.M. one)

 

[Sundog]

Isn't that design, shown in the paper, the one illustrated in the first two pics on page one of your post in this thread, as is shown on the Wings cover?

 

[flateric]

No, that one with high-mounted canards, 'classic' Syd Mead's ATF

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Renamed topic to remove typo

 

[Hammer Birchgrove]

From October, 1993 Air International - I could not withstand...

 

[Triton]

An artist's impression identified as a Lockheed ATF contender released in 1985 shows a chined nose similar to the SR-71, a fairly orthodox delta wing with canard foreplanes, and vectoring engine nozzles.

Source: Richardson, Doug. Stealth Warplanes Salamander Books Ltd. 2001.

 

[flateric]

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1165.msg10545.html#msg10545

Stuff is claimed to be - of course - F-22. Interesting if this a pure speculation or another Lockheed's(?) desinformation CGIs

Confirmed as 'official' Lockheed speculation

 

[Triton]

Artist's impression of Advanced Tactical Fighter by Attila Hejja appearing in December 1987 issue of Popular Mechanics.

Source: Cole, Tim. "Airpower 2000" Popular Mechanics December 1987 p. 72.

 

[airman]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Tactical_Fighter

there are also diagram of concept aircraft submitted by aircraft corporations!

 

[Nico]

Hi boys,
digging in my 'Stealth' folder I found those two interesting pictures, dated November 1990 but surely dating back to previous years. One depicts an all-red windtunnel model, during visualization of air flow patterns. Lockheed said that the YF-22 Advanced Tactical Fighter required more than 24,000 hours of wind-tunnell testing. The model seems to me a very early shape of the project.
I found also another pic with an engineer working with Cadam; also with a magnifying glas it's impossible to read the words on the screens; the configuration seems an evolved one, with canard wings.


Nico

 

[flateric]

much thanks!

 

[flateric]

Historical Nov.6, 1986 'Lockheed STAR' issue

 

[fightingirish]

An image of a Lockheed YF-22A concept from the René Francillon Photo Archive at SDASM Archives.Source:

https://flic.kr/p/wU9Fdv

View: https://www.flickr.com/photos/sdasmarchives/20280853649/in/album-72157651530128190/

 

[Sferrin]

By none other than Syd Mead.

 

[Sundog]

I still have the poster of the bottom one. There's also another one with that design, where it's in a near vertical climb.

 

[flateric]

...

 

[hesham]

...

As I know from this period,that was a mock-up actually built ?.

 

[archipeppe]

...

Such image payed surely something to the Firefox movie....

 

[Vladimir]

Hi,

 

[flateric]

...

 

[Airplane]

I found this on the DVIC site, on the first page of a search on 'ATF'. I haven't seen this design before; does anyone have more information?

This from a circa 1982 or 1983 publication of Popular Science. It was a USAF "design" intended to portray the concepts of the new fighter, namely 2D thrust vectoring, LO inlets, supercruise aerodynamics (then though needed to be tailless), and internal weapons.

If you actually look at, it is basically the F-22 minus the tail, right down to the one piece canopy. Lockmart gave the USAF exactly what they wanted.

 

[hesham]

Also from; Advanced fighter technology
Bill Sweetman's drawing

 

[LowObservable]

Jebus on a Vespa, that looks oddly familiar.

 

[Sferrin]

Jebus on a Vespa, that looks oddly familiar.

 

[hesham]

From; Warplanes of the 21st Century,

in picture No13,was it a mock-up for it or what ?.

 

[Sferrin]

From; Warplanes of the 21st Century,

in picture No13,was it a mock-up for it or what ?.

No, that's artwork not a photo. Hadn't seen #12 before.

 

[hesham]

Thanks.

 

[flateric]

When 3D printing was called stereolithography...
http://www.drrgb.com

 

[Dynoman]

Lockheed Steathly ATF

 

[flateric]

This is not ATF. ASTOVL

 

[hesham]

From Jarel Aircraft Design & Engineering.

 

[Dynoman]

Thank you Flateric, I had it mis-labled in my ATF file.

 

[flateric]

...

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Interesting stills of scientist looking at what everybody (mostly, Soviet spies) should consider Lockheed ATF from Lockheed promo documentary, showing how far they went into not-showing how their real ATF would look like.

Third picture (ATF manufacturing) remembers me Khruchev's phrase of making rockets on conveyor like a sausages

Oddly seems to be exactly the same artwork only flipped. From Encylopedia of Modern Military Aircraft by Michael Taylor (Gallery Books/Bison Books 1987)

 

[Dew]

from Lockheed Horizons #21 Sept '86

 

[Forest Green]

An image of a Lockheed YF-22A concept from the René Francillon Photo Archive at SDASM Archives.Source:

https://flic.kr/p/wU9Fdv

View: https://www.flickr.com/photos/sdasmarchives/20280853649/in/album-72157651530128190/

Serious aero question. Can such a design with the intakes inline, below and rear of the canards actually work well?