US Navy 6th Gen Fighter - F/A-XX

Reddington777 said:
Who else but the current admin is trying to cancel it?
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Depends doesn't it. If they contract award then it might build some momentum from yearly congress top ups but if Congress are waiting for the current Administration to end then that will need another competition.

Caudle can only do so much...
warriormaven.com

Navy Chief Says Service Needs F/A-XX Immediately

Growing threats demand an immediate F/A-XX. The Navy CNO stresses the need for advanced carrier-based attack aircraft to counter future adversaries.
warriormaven.com warriormaven.com
 
Sferrin said:
(...) The USN has never had the F100, but they have operated the F110, and the F414 is too small. F110, F135, or smaller variant NGAP. Where they've already said they don't want NGAP ($$$) that leaves the F110 or F135. Unless they're making a smaller version of the F135, which there is zero evidence of, that leaves (unfortunately) the F110. Like powering a Tomcat with J75s.
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The USN in fact has (limited) experience with the P&W F100. Adversary Squadron F-16A and B (initially built for Pakistan iirc) had that engine.
The two X-47B that were tested successfully (talk about a lost opportunity) used a F100 without reheat.

I agree with what you wrote after, except that the current F110 production is far from the legacy 90's engines, with a lot of improvements coming from the F118, YF120, F414, CFM56 family and probably others.
The updated F110 may lack supercruise characteristics of the F119, but it shows better SFC at subsonic speed, and is significantly smaller and lighter than the F135. Not too bad IMHO. ;)

Training_Dummy said:
“Zero chance”

Huh. You must know something I don’t. GE has been whispering about expanded performance F414 variants for some time; they might have some interesting derivatives. I wouldn’t rule it out.
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The F414, even in higher thrust variant (discussed for two decades but never flown), won't suffice, unless you're going for more than two engines. The F/A-18E/F is already under-engined and under-performing. Now imagine an aircraft weighting several tons more equipped with those same engines, losing one immediately after take-off from the deck... Crew might not appreciate the experience.
 
I think f414 ehnanced engine variants are by far most likely for faxx. Ge marketed those at 116 kn like 15 years ago. In theory a variant on a faxx might even go over 120 kn.

Two such engines would have a decent thrust edge over the f35c at 25% more.

Plus its not just about the engine. We dont know what kind of wing might faxx have. What kind of lift it may create. What sort of drag the whole plane may generate.

Ultimately, what kind of envelope is expected from it. Just because past gen planes needed to be agile x and manuberable y, thst doesnt mean that the same or more is expected from the new plane. no one is really expecting the chinese j36 to be super agile, yet a usaf general labeled it as an air superiority plane.

The notion that faxx must be a mach 2 plane with much better acceleration than f18 or f35 might not apply. maybe it will simply be a large flying dorito with more range, more sensors and more munitions space than an f35c. Yet one that is not necessarily more agile, manueverable or faster than f35c.
Maybe the navy concluded that future combat, be it ground strikes or air combat, doesn't need anything more than that.
 
Reddington777 said:
In the worst case F/A-XX just needs to outlast this administration.

The marines could do well with a beefed up F-35

I hope im not gonna come back and regret this comment
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Because the military did not want to invest huge sums of money, and because the F-47 accounts for a large proportion of sixth-generation fighter jets, the military was unwilling to comply, and Congress "forced" it to.
 

Speaking to reporters, Caudle said that following several conversations with Deputy Secretary of Defense Steve Feinberg, the Pentagon and the Navy, the downselect would occur in August.

“I think you’re going to see a downselect on this in August. I think that’s the month that they have committed to making the decision on the program,” he told reporters Monday at the Sea Air Space 2026 conference.
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Boeing and Northrop Grumman are the two aviation contractors thought to be in the running for the F/A-XX that will eventually replace the Boeing F/A-18/E/F Super Hornet on the the Navy’s aircraft carriers in the 2030s. Boeing was selected last year to be the F-47 air superiority fighter for the Air Force while Northrop Grumman is building the B-21 Raider bomber, also for the Air Force.

Without naming a company, Caudle said one company was unable to meet the Navy’s timeline.

“One of the contractors who would make this plane for us is in a place where they really can’t deliver in the timeframe we need it. So there was a “check twice, cut once” kind of mentality here on this decision,” Caudle said.
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“One of the contractors who would make this plane for us is in a place where they really can’t deliver in the timeframe we need it. So there was a “check twice, cut once” kind of mentality here on this decision,” Caudle said.

Fascinating.

Any unobvious thoughts given both are currently scaling some ambitious projects with NG and B-21 and Boeing with F-47?
 
Training_Dummy said:
“One of the contractors who would make this plane for us is in a place where they really can’t deliver in the timeframe we need it. So there was a “check twice, cut once” kind of mentality here on this decision,” Caudle said.

Fascinating.

Any unobvious thoughts given both are currently scaling some ambitious projects with NG and B-21 and Boeing with F-47?
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Im still saying its NG, hasn't there been talks on being able to expand B-21 production? Sound like they're eager for more. Boeing is still building more spaces for the F-47 IIRC.
 
“I think you’re going to see a downselect on this in August. I think that’s the month that they have committed to making the decision on the program,” he told reporters Monday at the Sea Air Space 2026 conference.
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Perhaps I am a bit skeptical but I have heard this before...
 
Apparently its still happening. Not keen on seeking Boeing with a fighter jet monopoly though, especially considering their performance to date.

breakingdefense.com

F/A-XX fighter downselect coming in August: CNO - Breaking Defense

The competition for the Navy's sixth-generation fighter contract has narrowed to Northrop Grumman and Boeing.
breakingdefense.com breakingdefense.com
 
Adm Caudle:
Speaking to reporters, Caudle said that following several conversations with Deputy Secretary of Defense Steve Feinberg, the Pentagon and the Navy, the downselect would occur in August.
“I think you’re going to see a downselect on this in August. I think that’s the month that they have committed to making the decision on the program,” he told reporters Monday at the Sea Air Space 2026 conference.
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Boeing and Northrop Grumman are the two aviation contractors thought to be in the running for the F/A-XX that will eventually replace the Boeing F/A-18/E/F Super Hornet on the the Navy’s aircraft carriers in the 2030s. Boeing was selected last year to be the F-47 air superiority fighter for the Air Force while Northrop Grumman is building the B-21 Raider bomber, also for the Air Force.
Without naming a company, Caudle said one company was unable to meet the Navy’s timeline.
“One of the contractors who would make this plane for us is in a place where they really can’t deliver in the timeframe we need it. So there was a “check twice, cut once” kind of mentality here on this decision,” Caudle said.
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I've heard August too. One CEO (maybe both?) recently met with DEPSECDEF Feinberg and threatened to disband their standing team(s), which seems to have had the desired effect.
Can't shed any light on the CNO's "timeline" comment. But I can reaffirm that B will be the winner., as originally planned.
Like many, I won't be surprised if Feinberg comes up with another reason to delay the award once again.
 
I am familiar with FA-XX from the NG side. You can look at my post history for more clues about the NG FA-XX submission.

Just dropping by to say the renders released today (outside of being an airplane) look nothing like the real submission.
 

One F/A-XX Bidder 'Can’t Deliver' On Navy Schedule, CNO Says | Aviation Week Network

One of the two companies vying for the F/A-XX contract lacks the capacity to deliver the fighter on time, Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Daryl Caudle says.
aviationweek.com aviationweek.com

“One of the contractors who would make this plane for us is in a place where they really can’t deliver in the timeframe we need it,” Caudle said. “So there was, just, you know, 'check twice, cut once' kind of mentality here on this decision.”
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Caudle did not name which of the two remaining bidders for the F/A-XX program falls short of the required capacity. Boeing and Northrop Grumman executives have said they have the ability to meet the Navy’s schedule for the fighter. The Navy eliminated Lockheed Martin from the competition nearly two years ago.
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“I think you’re going to see a downselect on this in August,” Caudle said. “I think that’s the month that they have committed to making the decision on the program.”
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I wonder if he thinks they'll get it sooner by not making a decision.
 

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It's normal military tactic to keep people guessing till actually revealling to public, be it F-47 or F/A-XX.
It is hard to believe all the intakes on top for a fighter which may produce aerodynamic shadow at high AoA, stalling the engine.
This model looks like blended wing body, like mini-B-21, but compared to cockpit size the intakes & overall jet looks small, like just X-jet.
 

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I'm almost certain this is an AI-generated video based on a render. I don't think the aircraft design itself is AI-generated because it's too precise. But the video is. I can see this in the way the insignia is displayed. It's the typical distortion of the central star that all AI does. I do believe this video is based on renders created by NG. What those renders depict, who knows? Perhaps someone from the marketing department created some nice renders of what an FA-XX might look like, and the social media manager decided to make a video, probably using Google Flow.

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Low IQ Techie said:
It's normal military tactic to keep people guessing till actually revealling to public, be it F-47 or F/A-XX.
It is hard to believe all the intakes on top for a fighter which may produce aerodynamic shadow at high AoA, stalling the engine.
This model looks like blended wing body, like mini-B-21, but compared to cockpit size the intakes & overall jet looks small, like just X-jet.
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So they've given up on close-range air combat?
 
timmyjohn said:
I've heard August too. One CEO (maybe both?) recently met with DEPSECDEF Feinberg and threatened to disband their standing team(s), which seems to have had the desired effect.
Can't shed any light on the CNO's "timeline" comment. But I can reaffirm that B will be the winner., as originally planned.
Like many, I won't be surprised if Feinberg comes up with another reason to delay the award once again.
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Just adding to this - Having spoken/worked with someone who was familiar with both contractors' designs/progress (prior to the active source selections, so no restrictions on working with both), it seems that Boeing has been largely ahead most of the time. Primarily on schedule/maturity, unsure about design. Sentiments from program officials (from what I've been told second-hand) seem to reflect that same story. As always, grain of salt.

As much shit people give Boeing BDS and commercial sectors, Phantom Works is an entirely different entity and design team (and also doesn't fall under or reflect BDS). They truly are some of the best in the industry, with much of the talent (not management/execs) from McD still there. The F-47 win and potential F/A-XX win is a testament to that.
 
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wtna7 said:
So they've given up on close-range air combat?
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No at all. Enemy would have its own BVR tactics. After BVR AAMs get depleted, as per 6gen characteristics, in close combat, LOAL CCMs, MSDMs & DEW-CIWS would be used.
I think in era of digital media, these ads are just to tease citizens, produce suspense, excitement, chatter & publicity.
 

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