Sukhoi Su-57 flight testing and development

[Null]

Look at picture above with table. Su-57 row, column #5 is amount, #6 is price of avionics from KRET for Russian GOZ (military procurement) for this amount, Column #11 denotes that this price is advanced payment. Column #7 is a price for foreign customer, and #8 is a ratio between export price and Russian one.
Thus with simple math, 198.95/12*100/15 will get you 110.5M USD price of avionics for a single Su-57 airframe. Full packaged airframe is likely at least 1.5 times more (engines, airframe itself, other things not sourced by KRET).

are we talking domestic or export? Exports get sold higher than Domestic like a deal India made with France suggested they paid over 100 million dollars per Rafale.

 

[Life of Tyo]

couple of more pics i had

View attachment 786787
View attachment 786788

Lucky I saved link video RCS T-50 KNS test in Tula

https://www.vokrug.tv/video/show/685217297b9563f886dc4d7efcbfa155_voennaya_priemka_voennovozdushnaya_akademiya_100_let_nauki_i_poleta/

 

[Squirrel]

Look at picture above with table. Su-57 row, column #5 is amount, #6 is price of avionics from KRET for Russian GOZ (military procurement) for this amount, Column #11 denotes that this price is advanced payment. Column #7 is a price for foreign customer, and #8 is a ratio between export price and Russian one.
Thus with simple math, 198.95/12*100/15 will get you 110.5M USD price of avionics for a single Su-57 airframe. Full packaged airframe is likely at least 1.5 times more (engines, airframe itself, other things not sourced by KRET).

On 27 June 2019 ( during ''Army 2019'') ,Ru MoD and UAC signed state contract for the serial production and delivery of 76 Su-57's for the RuA&SF.Contract was worth 170 billion rubles.Production unit cost was than estimated between 2 and 2.5 billion rubles (about 30 mil.$).

 

[EmoBirb]

Algeria getting 12 Su-57s? That is news to me JetBrain. As well as that add on 14 Su-34s.

How is that news? This has been rumored for years now, even with alleged footage of a Su-57 demo flight in Algeria

 

[paralay]

So for Russian AF one Su-57 costs 110,5M USD One Su-35 costs 28.8M EUR or 33.8M USD.

the 2019 contract
76 Su-57 for 170 billion rubles or 2.24 billion rubles / piece or 34.4 million. $ per piece

 

[alberchico]

Assuming that photo is genuine, anybody find it odd that the Algerian airframes are painted in a full camouflage scheme when no other Western air force that operates 5th generation fighters bothers with that ? Even the Israelis abandoned their iconic desert paint scheme with the F-35s. Would the SU-57 in those colors give it any meaningful advantage in a combat situation?

 

[Bounce]

Assuming that photo is genuine, anybody find it odd that the Algerian airframes are painted in a full camouflage scheme when no other Western air force that operates 5th generation fighters bothers with that ? Even the Israelis abandoned their iconic desert paint scheme with the F-35s. Would the SU-57 in those colors give it any meaningful advantage in a combat situation?

It's a bad photoshop of an old photo, there's actually a whole set of them from ages ago.

 

[Squirrel]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1973098802279031176

View: https://x.com/HEMemarian/status/1973098802279031176

Sequence is from this video (from 17:35)

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WA2pewYPA8s


Note: ARM type Kh-58UShK(TP) can be only attached on the UVKU-50U ( max 750kg) not L ( max 250kg) .

 

[Squirrel]

are we talking domestic or export? Exports get sold higher than Domestic like a deal India made with France suggested they paid over 100 million dollars per Rafale.

Su-57E (clean aircraft) could have estimated price about 120mil $ as some Russian military expert/analysts said (Igor Korotchenko,Victor Murakhovsky e.g.)

Lucky I saved link video RCS T-50 KNS test in Tula

https://www.vokrug.tv/video/show/685217297b9563f886dc4d7efcbfa155_voennaya_priemka_voennovozdushnaya_akademiya_100_let_nauki_i_poleta/

That was in Voronezh friend.

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/sukhoi-su-57-flight-testing-development-operations-2012-current.15626/page-40

RCS tests of the NATO aircraft is done in the Tver test range ( by the own radars) and in the Voronezh, they test RCS of the own aircraft ( by ''western radars'' ,not the real of course ).

 

[Life of Tyo]

RCS tests of the NATO aircraft is done in the Tver test range ( by the own radars) and in the Voronezh, they test RCS of the own aircraft ( by ''western radars'' ,not the real of course ).

yeah Tver city huuh I'm senile now

 

[Squirrel]

View attachment 786677
at Page 84 of piotrs su57 book in 2021, in the last paragraph, there is a mention for a towed decoy system for Su-57, are there any updates for it?

Beside that towed decoy system ( if it really exists,was developed etc. ) ,there is one more interestingd detail or 'solution'.

Several years ago on the MCM there were comments about some sphere which produces some kind of plasma effect. If I remember well,exact sequence from the pic was in fact from one episode of the 'Udarnaya Sila' made 15-20 years ago.

What is interesting is this ,citation from the lower right corner: Designed to break AIM-120 AMRAAM lock-on.




'Eric-1' RCS test range is in fact : эталонный радиолокационный измерительный комплекс «ЭРИК-1» or
ERIK-1 reference radar measuring complex and is part of the ЦНИИ ВВКО ( Central Scientific and Research Institute of the Aerospace Defense Forces (TsNII VVKO) in the vicinity of the city of Tver.

Военная приемка. ЦНИИ ВВКО. Насквозь смотрящие. /2018 г./​

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbXRa6x28lY


Now the question is,what we can see marked with the red arrow? Luneberg lenses as they thought or maybe something else?

 

[Fibonacci]

Lucky I saved link video RCS T-50 KNS test in Tula

https://www.vokrug.tv/video/show/685217297b9563f886dc4d7efcbfa155_voennaya_priemka_voennovozdushnaya_akademiya_100_let_nauki_i_poleta/

Thank you for sharing this link...!

 

[Scar]

Now the question is,what we can see marked with the red arrow? Luneberg lenses as they thought or maybe something else?

cameras

 

[Squirrel]

cameras

They also has this container ...

 

[noister]

Now the question is,what we can see marked with the red arrow? Luneberg lenses as they thought or maybe something else?

They look like cameras for me, for weapon testing.

 

[flateric]

Now the question is,what we can see marked with the red arrow? Luneberg lenses as they thought or maybe something else?

View attachment 786971

You was asking the same question this spring and got the answer.

 

[noister]

I.e. i would personally expect active decoys on su-57(and j-20), rather than towed decoy.

There was also mention of "Programmable ECM transmitter cartridges" Similar to britecloud, launched from UV-50-01 countermeasure dispensing systems, do we have any info on these cartridges?

 

[Squirrel]

You was asking the same question this spring and got the answer.

Yes ,I know and remember that. For me ,those 'balls' did not look like some cameras.

 

[flateric]

Sure, they are three gimballed Lunenerg lenses hanging on pylon for reliability of detection. That's how we do things in aerospace. Systems redundancy!

 

[alpinelol]

Has russia finally got their AL51s in serial production or will the all the 76 su57s run with the al41 and be upgraded much later?

 

[EmoBirb]

Has russia finally got their AL51s in serial production or will the all the 76 su57s run with the al41 and be upgraded much later?

As far as I understood it the AL-51 will be introduced with the Su-57M and the Su-57S won't be retrofitted with the new engine

 

[alpinelol]

As far as I understood it the AL-51 will be introduced with the Su-57M and the Su-57S won't be retrofitted with the new engine

do we know when? Ive also been hearing a lot about the su57M1? do they solve the IR stealth issue that they've been having with the su57S version?

sorry im not all that informed on the su57 and all its tech so any information would be appreciated

 

[EmoBirb]

do we know when? Ive also been hearing a lot about the su57M1? do they solve the IR stealth issue that they've been having with the su57S version?

sorry im not all that informed on the su57 and all its tech so any information would be appreciated

Probably early next year, schedules are...fluid.

IR stealth issues? If you mean if the M model will receive new nozzles, then yes, with the new engines come new nozzles. AL-51 has been seen in early testing with a round serrated nozzle and most recently with the flat nozzle.

Izd. 30 on T-50-2 with the early serrated nozzle:



And the new flat nozzle on presumably the latest iteration of the Izd. 30/AL-51 engine:


As a bonus, the export oriented Izd. 177S with serrated nozzle as presented at Zhuhai last year:

 

[Geo]

Probably early next year, schedules are...fluid.

IR stealth issues? If you mean if the M model will receive new nozzles, then yes, with the new engines come new nozzles. AL-51 has been seen in early testing with a round serrated nozzle and most recently with the flat nozzle.

Izd. 30 on T-50-2 with the early serrated nozzle:
View attachment 787051
View attachment 787052

And the new flat nozzle on presumably the latest iteration of the Izd. 30/AL-51 engine:
View attachment 787054

As a bonus, the export oriented Izd. 177S with serrated nozzle as presented at Zhuhai last year:
View attachment 787055

And that is the question of whether the 177S (and its derivatives) is exclusively export-oriented.
Under the name Udlinitel', work was carried out with the aim of obtaining a backup engine for the T-50 program, if work on the Izd. 30 was significantly delayed.
The 177S was exhibited in Zhuhai and Bangalore as an upgrade option for existing aircraft, but the stealth nozzle suggests that this engine is also intended for the T-50 (and possibly the T-75). The focus on future aircraft was also stated in the official description.
I have a feeling that the 177S is a product of the Udlinitel' project.

 

[alpinelol]

Probably early next year, schedules are...fluid.

IR stealth issues? If you mean if the M model will receive new nozzles, then yes, with the new engines come new nozzles. AL-51 has been seen in early testing with a round serrated nozzle and most recently with the flat nozzle.

Izd. 30 on T-50-2 with the early serrated nozzle:
View attachment 787051
View attachment 787052

And the new flat nozzle on presumably the latest iteration of the Izd. 30/AL-51 engine:
View attachment 787054

As a bonus, the export oriented Izd. 177S with serrated nozzle as presented at Zhuhai last year:
View attachment 787055

hmmm i see.
how much of an upgrade is the su57M1 compared to the su57S apart from the engine? will it have complete integration with the s70? i think there has been significant evidence of them being used alongside the su57 but it looks like its still in early testing or very very limited combat.

obviously im assuming theyre upgrading the electronics by a lot but i have not been able to get a clear stable picture with all the conflicting reports out there right now.

 

[EmoBirb]

@Geo my guess is that the 177S will be the choice offered for the export versions of the Su-57 and Su-75. While the Su-57M and Su-75S, Su-75B and Su-75D of the VKS will utilize the AL-51F1. My assumption is based on the fact that the engine shown at Zhuhai integrates some aspects of the Izd. 30 but with the base design being that of the previous engine. So it's offering performance improvements without handing the latest Russian engine technology to foreign users.

 

[EmoBirb]

how much of an upgrade is the su57M1 compared to the su57S apart from the engine? will it have complete integration with the s70? i think there has been significant evidence of them being used alongside the su57 but it looks like its still in early testing or very very limited combat.

obviously im assuming theyre upgrading the electronics by a lot but i have not been able to get a clear stable picture with all the conflicting reports out there right now.

The full scale of the Megapolis isn't entirely public. But the engines are a big factor, because these will result in across the board improvements to the flight characteristics of the aircraft, maintainability and operating cost, supercruise and ultimately powering of the onboard systems with a powerful generator. Avionics upgrades are also discussed, especially given that the active service of the Su-57 could have shown some areas that need improvements, refinement or outright change. Weapons integration will most likely progress further than on the current baseline jets. The Radar and sensor suite may see improvements as well as further enhancements to the countermeasures utilized by the aircraft.

More comprehensive integration of the S-70 UCAV may already be featured by the Su-57M or it may just have the necessary systems in place to attain that capability later. Because it may entirely be possible that this capability will only be fully exploited by the "multifunctional airborne control center" which is one thing the patent for the twin seat Su-57 described. That layout, similarly to the J-20S which already puts that concept into practice, would see a dedicated drone operator in the back to coordinate manned and unmanned assets in theater.



Important to the manned/unmanned team up and role of the two seat version, here from the patent:

The possibility of using a two-seater multifunctional aircraft as an airborne command post, with the ability to ensure interaction between aviation and military formations in solving combat missions, analyzing information coming from its own systems and external information sources with subsequent issuance of recommendations to the crew and commands to the group aircraft, as well as a control post for unmanned aerial vehicles, is achieved through a wide range of communication means, including satellite communications, equipment for group information transmission, equipment for transmitting information over long distances and a high-speed communication channel for receiving and transmitting audio, photo, video, text, voice and telecode information and a specialized command and information field of the rear cockpit (which, in comparison with the front cockpit, has the following differences: an expanded panoramic aviation indicator and an additional indicator to increase the operator's working field, controls are installed to transfer control priority from one cockpit to another, and controls that do not require control by a second crew member are excluded), which allows for the prompt receipt of information from various external sources (both aviation and land and sea), and its analysis on board aircraft and issue recommendations or commands to perform a combat mission to the group's aircraft, taking into account their fuel reserves and combat equipment.

 

[Geo]

@Geo my guess is that the 177S will be the choice offered for the export versions of the Su-57 and Su-75. While the Su-57M and Su-75S, Su-75B and Su-75D of the VKS will utilize the AL-51F1. My assumption is based on the fact that the engine shown at Zhuhai integrates some aspects of the Izd. 30 but with the base design being that of the previous engine. So it's offering performance improvements without handing the latest Russian engine technology to foreign users.

Yes, I’ve reached the same conclusion, but I’m convinced that the VKS could also use the Izd. 177 within the Megapolis program if the development of the Izd. 30 were to be excessively delayed.
Otherwise, the 177(S) will most likely have variants similar to the 117.

 

[Null]

Су-57М1 — новая фаза развития истребителя пятого поколения с гиперзвуковыми ракетами

Тактико-технические характеристики и вооружение нового российского истребителя 5-го поколения в модификации Су-57М1. Дальность обнаружения, двигатель и скорость

amalantra.ru

I am sure some people are familiar with this youtube channel making updates on the Ukraine War with the english subtitles on.

Claims of a new radar that sees a fighter aircraft 520kms away, probably BS because amalantra.su is the only source that made a guess and no reference and the youtube video user just probably rolled with it.

 

[noister]

apparently Su-57 should have a total of 3 IRST, The function of 101 KS O DIRCM turrets is also like 101 KS V IRST, meaning it has a sensor within it to scan the sky



Here you can see the DIRCM spinning and scanning the sky

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/305084948619067397/1399171373355499691/felondircm.gif?ex=68e5a1e2&is=68e45062&hm=7d7295d2b95596565e98e3d2fd217a8026548d1e0c54b8709055c1222ffd376d&=&width=958&height=335

judging by the change in the tilt of the "mirror" a dircm turret does a whole scan in around 3~ seconds

 

[flateric]

Claims of a new radar that sees a fighter aircraft 520kms away, probably BS because amalantra.su is the only source that made a guess and no reference and the youtube video user just probably rolled with it.

Definitely worth posting here then!

 

[Acatomic]

About the dual seater:


Source:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1975152286482739235

View: https://x.com/georgen28581/status/1975152286482739235


Personally, don’t see the need for a dual seat.

 

[Squirrel]

apparently Su-57 should have a total of 3 IRST, The function of 101 KS O DIRCM turrets is also like 101 KS V IRST, meaning it has a sensor within it to scan the sky

View attachment 787186

Here you can see the DIRCM spinning and scanning the sky

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/305084948619067397/1399171373355499691/felondircm.gif?ex=68e5a1e2&is=68e45062&hm=7d7295d2b95596565e98e3d2fd217a8026548d1e0c54b8709055c1222ffd376d&=&width=958&height=335

judging by the change in the tilt of the "mirror" a dircm turret does a whole scan in around 3~ seconds

Exactly .

101KS known as ''Atoll'' or OEIS (optical and electronic integrated system) with next modules:

101KS-V has three working channels: IR,laser and IIR
101KS-O has two wroking channels: IR and laser
101KS-U has one working channel: UV
101KS-P has one working channel: IIR
101KS-N has three working channels: IIR,laser and TV


101КС-О (оборонительный внешний модуль) - система противодействия ракетам с инфракрасными головками самонаведения - лазером подавления. Возможности системы аналогичны 101КС-В + ослепление атакующих ракет.

''The 101KS-O (defensive external module) is a system for countering infrared-homing missiles with a suppression laser. The system's capabilities are similar to those of the 101KS-V, but it also blinds attacking missiles.''

Оптико-электронный комплекс 101КС "Атолл" - ВПК.name

vpk.name

 

[EmoBirb]

Personally, don’t see the need for a dual seat.

Only if the Su-75D enter production to fill the niche

 

[Acatomic]

Not to get too off-topic, but why?

 

[EmoBirb]

Not to get too off-topic, but why?

Because there needs to be an advanced aircraft in service that will offer the ability to coordinate unmanned assets effectively in the theater itself. And a dedicated operator is the most optimal solution, which is why the J-20S came into being and presumably why CAC designed the J-36 as a two seater as well. While US designs simply cannot be adapted to such a configuration. If the F/A-XX and F-47 follow the trend is to be seen.

So if it's not being done by the Su-57D/Su-60 or whatever they'd call it, it's a role that can be taken over by the proposed Su-75D.

 

[Deino]

That's quite interesting... although I can't say how reliable it is.

via

https://twitter.com/x/status/1970434967529263174

View: https://twitter.com/GeorgeN28581/status/1970434967529263174

 

[Acatomic]

@EmoBirb

With Okhotnik right around the corner you get an answer about a two seater version of Su-57:
“If demand for it appears, it might be pushed into existence.”
So i guess VKS doesn’t see a need for it in the foreseeable future, otherwise they would be already working hard on it.

LTS is a private initiative by Sukhoi (UAC) aka VKS didn’t ask for it. And even then Sukhoi plans for the first two airframes to be a single seater and unmaned one. No two seater.

 

[snne]

How reliable is Jane’s nowadays with Indian matters?

https://www.janes.com/osint-insight...ir-force-chief-unveils-new-modernisation-plan

The chief of the Indian Air Force (IAF) has confirmed that the service is considering the Sukhoi Su-57E and the Dassault Rafale for acquisition, while speaking further about the IAF's performance during India's brief conflict with Pakistan earlier in 2025.

 

[Null]

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=pfbid02xv6H8fjznL4c3viGR3UrWPnEmpVqPQeeoYjbpoNGSHfPLZ17mjsscu36vnW9AuQsl&id=100091855942886

View: https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=pfbid02xv6H8fjznL4c3viGR3UrWPnEmpVqPQeeoYjbpoNGSHfPLZ17mjsscu36vnW9AuQsl&id=100091855942886

Below is the 3D simulation and picture of the 2021 rennovation of KNAAZ factories and hangars in 2021.

What does it show ? It show the clear intention of KNAAZ to manufacture both Su-35 and Su-57 in the same location.

What does that mean ? Well. KNAAZ just finished the 3rd investment project for the 3rd production line of Su-57 last June, intended for Su-57UB aka formerly FGFA. But at the moment, for now, it will be used for the current (temporarily named) Su-57P, increase annual productivity from 20 to 30 pieces. The first batch of 76 Su-57 can be finished in 2026.

In other words, Su-57 is in the same situation of Su-35S in 2014 when it is first deployed in fighting units, while Su-35S in 2025 is already "near full strength" in the air force, replacing both Su-27SM2 and MiG-29. And when the outstanding contract finishes, Sukhoi will cut down 2 Su-35 manufacture lines for domestic use and only maintain one Su-35 line for export, such as to Iran or Vietnam. Meanwhile, after 2026, Su-57 production will run full speed on 4-5 manufacture lines.

We can see that for the next 5 years Su-35S will run out of buyers, similar to the situation of Su-30 in 2016. And Su-57UB or Su-57SM will be the limelight like Su-35S at this year 2025.

Su-57
Su-57M
Su-57M1
Su-57E
Su-57P
Su-57UB
Su-57SM
I am so confused.