TsAGI (Zavod 39) "TsKB-" designations

Maveric

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Hi ???
 

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Maveric

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Sorry!!!!!!!!!!
 

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Maveric

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ZKB.25 = Berijew MBR.2

double designations: ZKB.6 = Iljuschin light passenger aircraft project 1932
ZKB.29 = Izakson fighter project 1939
 

hesham

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Hi Maveric,

what was your source?,and are there any more details or drawings
for the double designation projects (ZKB-6 & ZKB-29) ?.
 

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For the Iljuschin ZKB.6 please read under www.avicopress.ru. This is the great site by ucon!
 

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Also a double designation ZKB./TsKB.10: 1) for the Tscheranowski BITSch.14
2) for the Kotscherigin MU.2 (U.2M), a version of the Polikarpow U.2
 

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AM

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hi all

TsKB-41 = s/ngle-seat version of DI-6 (project only)
TsKB-44 = I-16 with Wright R-1820-F54 and 4 *7.62 mm MG
 

igor-mich

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I found a small problem in the book of Maslov "Lost Victories Soviet aviation":
1) TsKB-5 - this Polikarpov LSch designer? or will be properly BOK-2 (RK) structures Krichevsky.
2) TsKB-9 - DI-3 is a Polikarpov Grigorovich? or will be properly BOK-3 (IC) design Tsebrikova.
Which statement is correct, the book is Maslov designation BOK-2 (TsKB-5) and BOK-3 (TsKB-9)

And who estli photo or 3 types of BOK-2 will be very grateful.
 

redstar72

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Hi all!
Dear Maveric, there is some confusion in your table. Firstly, the title is wrong - it would be simply TsKB list, not TsAGI TsKB. None of the mentioned aircraft wasn't created by TsAGI TsKB - some of them were before, and most of them were after ;) . The TsAGI TsKB existed only short time (since August 27, 1931 to May 1932 - see http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,10640.0.html), and during that time all projects were labeled "ANT"... Then, you mixed two TsKB eras: the first one (from December 1929 when TsKB was organized at Zavod No.39 till the "marriage" with TsAGI on August 27, 1931) when TsKB was ruled by Nikolai Paufler, and the second era after TsKB rebirth on January 13, 1933 when its head was Sergei Ilyushin. This is the reason for some "double" designations. (Actually they aren't double because the designations of the first TsKB weren't "TsKB-X", but "Aircraft No.X of TsKB schedule" - "Самолёт № Х по плану ЦКБ").

Here is my attempt of TsKB list. The aircraft marked out with Bold Italic font were built in series:

The first era (XII.1929 - VIII.1931) – only some numbers are known:

No.5 – Kocherigin LSh (ЛШ) attack biplane (not finished)
No.6 – Kocherigin TSh-1 armoured attack biplane (Probably TSh-1 is wrong designation. Some documents mean it as “TSh-2 first version”; according to those, TSh-1 was Tupolev ANT-17 project known also as the TSh-B).
No.7 – Grigorovich I-Z fighter
No.8 – Grigorovich TB-5 heavy bomber
No.9 – DI-3 two-seat fighter
No.10 – R-5a (MR-5) float version of Polikarpov R-5. (Not U-2M / MU-2!)
No.11 – Chetverikov MDR-3 flying boat
No.21 – Kocherigin TSh-2 (or “TSh-2 second version)
No.23 – Kocherigin ShON carrier-based attack biplane
No.25 – Beriev MBR-2 flying boat

The second era (since 1933):

TsKB-1– Kocherigin LR recon aircraft
TsKB-2 real double designation: firstly Kocherigin DI-5 two-seat fighter (project only), later reassigned to Chizhevsky SS stratospheric aircraft (BOK-1).
TsKB-3 – Polikarpov I-15 fighter
TsKB-4– Kocherigin/Gurevich TSh-3 attack aircraft
TsKB-5 – Krichevsky RK / BOK-2 experimental aircraft with slotted wing
TsKB-6 – Ilyushin, 6-seat passenger/utility aircraft (project only)
TsKB-7 - ?
TsKB-8 - ?
TsKB-9 – Tsebrikov BOK-3 utility/liaison aircraft
TsKB-10 – Cheranovsky BICh-14 “Parabola” tailless experimental/passenger aircraft
TsKB-11– Kocherigin/Yatsenko DI-6 two-seat fighter
TsKB-12 – Polikarpov I-16 fighter
TsKB-13 – Chizhevsky BOK-5 / LK M-11 experimental tailless aircraft
TsKB-14 – Polikarpov DI-7 two-seat fighter (I-17 derivative, project only)
TsKB-15 – Polikarpov I-17 fighter (first prototype)
TsKB-16 – Samsonov MBR-5 flying boat (later TsKB MS-2)
TsKB-17 – Chizhevsky BOK-6 / LK 2M-34 tailless twin-engine bomber (project only)
TsKB-18 – Polikarpov I-16Sh (I-16 attack version, M-22 engine, fixed landing gear)
TsKB-19 – Polikarpov I-17 fighter (second prototype)
TsKB-19bis – Polikarpov I-17 fighter (third prototype, with motor-cannon)
TsKB-20 - ?
TsKB-21 – Polikarpov SI fighter/speed record aircraft (twin-boom pusher, coupled engine, project only). According to some sources, it was used as a base for Beriev B-10 project.
TsKB-22 - ?
TsKB-23 – experimental aircraft with slotted wing (project only)
TsKB-24 - ?
TsKB-25 – Polikarpov I-19. There were two totally different projects under this designation. The first one was I-16 derivative for Gnome-Rhone Mistral Major (M-85) engine (kind of I-180 precursor; some sources also proclaim it a base for infamous Silvansky I-220). It was projected in mid-1935 but soon cancelled, and the designation was re-used for I-17 version with Mikulin M-34 engine.
TsKB-26 – Ilyushin experimental bomber (BB-2, SB-39) – DB-3 first prototype.
TsKB-27 – Kocherigin SR, R-9 recon aircraft.
TsKB-28 – Polikarpov I-20 – fighter project of I-17 family, with HS 12Ybrs engine (no more info).
TsKB-29 – modified I-16 with Wright Cyclone F-54 engine and redesigned landing gear (project only).
TsKB-30 – Ilyushin DB-3 long-range bomber
TsKB-31 - ?
TsKB-32 – Ilyushin I-21 fighter (first prototype: M-34FRN engine, 4xShKAS, evaporative cooling system)
TsKB-33 – Polikarpov I-18 (I-17 version with evaporative cooling system). Uncompleted.
TsKB-34 to 37 - ?
TsKB-38 – Kocherigin DI-6Sh (DI-6 attack version)
TsKB-39, 40 - ?
TsKB-41 – Kocherigin DI-6 single-seat version (project only)
TsKB-42 - ?
TsKB-43 – Polikarpov I-18bis: TsKB-33 with smaller wing, for speed record attempt. Project only.
TsKB-44 – I-16 modification with Wright Cyclone F-54 engine and 4x ShKAS. Project only (1935). Probably later reassigned to Polikarpov MPI-1 / VIT-1.
TsKB-45 to 47 - ?
TsKB-48 – Polikarpov VIT-2 attack / bomber / anti-tank aircraft
TsKB-49 to 50 – ?
TsKB-51 – Ilyushin DB-3TP torpedo bomber seaplane (on floats).
TsKB-52 – Ilyushin I-21 second prototype (AM-35 engine, 2x ShVAK cannons, normal cooling system). Was in construction in 1938-39. Most probably uncompleted.
TsKB-53 – Ilyushin DB-3T torpedo bomber
TsKB-54 – Ilyushin DB-3SS escort aircraft (aka “DB-3 cruiser”)
TsKB-55 – Ilyushin BSh-2 first prototype (Il-2 precursor): AM-35A engine, two-seat
TsKB-56 – Ilyushin DB-4 long-range bomber
TsKB-57 – Ilyushin BSh-2 second prototype (AM-38 engine, single-seat)
TsKB-58, 59 – ?
TsKB-60 – Ilyushin Il-6 2AM-38, twin-engine attack aircraft. Project only. The last design under “TsKB” index.
 

Stargazer2006

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Since most people on this forum use the TsAGI spelling and not the German "ZAGI", I have taken the liberty of renaming the topic for easier reference.
 

redstar72

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Hi Stephane!
Maybe it would be better to remove "TsAGI" from the title at all. As I said, TsAGI has no real connection with the matter of this topic: moreover, TsKB of Zavod 39 can be considered the main rival of KOSOS TsAGI (ANT).
 

hesham

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redstar72 said:
TsKB-23 – experimental aircraft with slotted wing (project only)

My dear Redstar,

what was this aircraft and from which company ?,I only find an Info about it here;

https://books.google.com.eg/books?id=A6rdCwAAQBAJ&pg=PT64&lpg=PT64&dq=%D0%A6%D0%BA%D0%B1-23+%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%82&source=bl&ots=EdzC_Axtf6&sig=_64SjDiU2_EZo88XQvVpCzAfMQc&hl=ar&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj6o_6nxd_MAhVE2xoKHU-gCDcQ6AEIUDAH#v=onepage&q=%D0%A6%D0%BA%D0%B1-23%20%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%82&f=false
 

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Really TsKB started in february 1930 and worked on the following planes

- Polikarpov I-5
– Grigorovich LSh-M-17 (ЛШ) attack biplane (was transfered into TSh-2)
– Grigorovich TSh-2M-17 armoured attack biplane (TSh-1 was Tupolev project).
- Grigorovich DI-3M-17 two seat fighter
- Grigorovich ShON-M-17
– Grigorovich I-Z fighter No.7
– Grigorovich TB-5 heavy bomber

Fragment of report from June 1931
 

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hesham

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dabbler said:
Really TsKB started in february 1930 and worked on the following planes

- Polikarpov I-5
– Grigorovich LSh-M-17 (ЛШ) attack biplane (was transfered into TSh-2)
– Grigorovich TSh-2M-17 armoured attack biplane (TSh-1 was Tupolev project).
- Grigorovich DI-3M-17 two seat fighter
- Grigorovich ShON-M-17
– Grigorovich I-Z fighter No.7
– Grigorovich TB-5 heavy bomber

Fragment of report from June 1931

Nice.
 

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hesham said:
redstar72 said:
TsKB-23 – experimental aircraft with slotted wing (project only)

My dear Redstar,

what was this aircraft and from which company ?,I only find an Info about it here;

https://books.google.com.eg/books?id=A6rdCwAAQBAJ&pg=PT64&lpg=PT64&dq=%D0%A6%D0%BA%D0%B1-23+%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%82&source=bl&ots=EdzC_Axtf6&sig=_64SjDiU2_EZo88XQvVpCzAfMQc&hl=ar&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj6o_6nxd_MAhVE2xoKHU-gCDcQ6AEIUDAH#v=onepage&q=%D0%A6%D0%BA%D0%B1-23%20%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%82&f=false

The designation TsKB-23 in inserted text doesn't refer to any aircraft but to the TsKB 23 ( Central Design Bureau No. 23 ) being under control of the NKVD,
where Petlakov's designers group worked on high ceiling heavy fighter VI-100.
 

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Petlakov's designers group worked on high ceiling heavy fighter VI-100 in OTB(Speсial Technical Bureau) NKVD.
 

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Well, if You're right, there must be a mistake in the original text given by hesham in his post. The TsKB 23 bureau is mentioned there :)
 

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In this text there is a printing error. Instead of TsKB-23 need to read TsKB-29. TsKB-29 was the aviation division of OTB NKVD.
 

Boogey

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Fine, the problem has been solved, anyway the TsKB No. 23 ( nor TsKB No. 29 ) is NOT an aircraft, contrary to the TsKB-23 and TsKB-29 machines.
 

hesham

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Boogey said:
Fine, the problem has been solved, anyway the TsKB No. 23 ( nor TsKB No. 29 ) is NOT an aircraft, contrary to the TsKB-23 and TsKB-29 machines.

Thank you for clarify that.
 
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hesham

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TsKB-14 – Polikarpov DI-7 two-seat fighter (I-17 derivative, project only)

From Aviation magazine 1956,of course it was a Project only,

the DI-7,

The 1936 DI-7 is the last two-seat fighter, built in U.R.S.S. Like the DI-6, it is a
sesquiplane single engine with train retractable. No details, no illustration have
not been published on this device whose maximum speed is given for 400 km.h.
(249 mph.)
 

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Apophenia

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I assume they meant the last single-engined Soviet 2-seat fighter. Other sources say, as redstar72 did, that the TsKB-14 (DI-7) project relates directly to the single-seat TsKB-15 (I-17) monoplane fighter rather sharing a layout with the sequiplane Kochyerigin DI-6.

Since the TsKB-14 dates to the second half of 1933 like the TsKB-15, that suggests that the two Polikarpov fighter types were being developed in parallel. Presumably, the TsKB-14 began as a simple, 2-seat variant powered by an M-17 (or M-34?) V-12. But there are references to a later-stage development with tandem engines driving coaxial contra-rotating propellers. The latter sounding very much like the built Bolkhovitinov Sparka.
 

hesham

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From Air Magazine 02,

as I understand,the Grigorovich TB-5 was also allocated in the
new series as TsKB-8 ?.
 

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hesham

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TsKB-14 – Polikarpov DI-7 two-seat fighter (I-17 derivative, project only)

From Aviation magazine 1956,of course it was a Project only,

the DI-7,

The 1936 DI-7 is the last two-seat fighter, built in U.R.S.S. Like the DI-6, it is a
sesquiplane single engine with train retractable. No details, no illustration have
not been published on this device whose maximum speed is given for 400 km.h.
(249 mph.)
My dear Borovik,

do you know more about this Project ?,you talked about it
before;

"DI-7" fighter (two sitter, two engines M-100, variant I-17) by N.Polikarpov 1933-35

 

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