Hypothetical Raptor Variants ??

[Blue Weasel]

So I create this thread to speculate what will a derivative F-22 Raptor variant would look like.

Currently speculating for 2 variant, the F-22C Super Raptor and the E/A-22 electronic warfare variant.

lets start with the notional F-22C Super Raptor

Current spec F-22A Raptor is as following:

Empty weight 43,340 lb (19,700 kg)
Gross weight: 64,840 lb (29,410 kg)
Max takeoff weight: 83,500 lb (38,000 kg)
Fuel capacity: 18,000 lb (8,200 kg) internally, or 26,000 lb (12,000 kg) with two 2× 600 US gal tanks
Powerplant: 2 × Pratt & Whitney F119-PW-100 augmented turbofans, 26,000 lbf (116 kN) thrust each dry, 35,000 lbf (156 kN) with afterburner

Flight Performance
Maximum speed:Mach 2.25 (1,500 mph, 2,414 km/h) at altitude

• Mach 1.21, 800 knots (921 mph; 1,482 km/h) at sea level
• Mach 1.82 (1,220 mph, 1,963 km/h) supercruise at altitude

Range: 1,600 nmi (1,800 mi, 3,000 km) or more with 2 external fuel tanks
Combat range:460 nmi (530 mi, 850 km) clean with 100 nmi (115 mi, 185 km) in supercruise

• 590 nmi (679 mi, 1,093 km) clean subsonic

Ferry range: 1,740 nmi (2,000 mi, 3,220 km)
Service ceiling: 65,000 ft (20,000 m)
g limits: +9.0/−3.0
Wing loading: 77.2 lb/sq ft (377 kg/m2)
Thrust/weight: 1.08

what if the USAF decided to prolong the lifetime of the F-22A Raptor while waiting for it's successor, the NGAD to reach full scale production?? Upgrades are focused within 3 parameters. Flight performance, electronics and range (consider the US is likely to fight in the vast Pacific against new competitor China)

for starters I think they should refit the F119 with 190kN F135 consider the F135 are an evolution of the F119. with a total thrust of 380kN
it would increase the TWR of the F-22A from 1.14 (max fuel) to approx 1.39.

while the electronics and weapons system would be upgraded with

• -AN/APG-77v(x) with GaN technology.
• -Old bulky computers which are heavy are replaced by a more powerful version of ADCP II, lets just call it ADCP III
• -Link 16 upgrade
• -DAS
• -AIM 260 Peregrine capable
• -laser weapons system ??
• -HUD removed replaced by next gen HMD
• -new flush single screen cockpit
• -ability to coordinate missile carrying drones, somewhat similar to DARPA's project LongShot, hence it's internal weapons bay are maximized for either exclusively all long range AAM or exclusively short range AAM hence cancelling the need for disposable enclosed weapons pod or even addition in fuel carrying capacity. While major addition in range could be achieved by means of VLO tailored CFT, each carrying 900-1000 US gal.

Next is the notional E/A-22 electronic attack Raptor

Launched from USAF bases in Japan for a potential showdown in Taiwan and the East China sea. it's mission requirements is ability to fly fast and high (higher than most air defense missile could intercept), ability to carry next gen jammer (low, mid and high band) internally. Able to penetrate inside the A2/AD inside the mainland as well as the first island chain undetectable, while able to defend itself just in case.

For the E/A-22 variant the lower weapons bay are removed and instead replaced with a modular jamming equipment while the two side weapons bay are retained for close in AAM.

else it will be the same with the super raptor and uses F135 modified variants for the F-22 with no less than 190kN thrust each, but the TWR would likely be reduced to the level of the F-22A considering the heavy jamming equipment it carry.

 

[Colonial-Marine]

I'm sure you could use some of the improvements made with the F135 to get more thrust out of an improved variant of the F119 but you couldn't fit the F135 in those same bays as it is a bit larger IIRC. You wouldn't want to either as the F135 isn't optimized for supercruise like the F119 is.

I do wonder if it would be possible to carry a bit more fuel in the F-22. There were some documents which suggested a capacity of about 20,600 lb internally but all of the newer information says about 18,000 lb. With the F-15C they managed to find room for an extra 2,000 lb or so compared to the F-15A so perhaps there was/is some unused space in the Raptor too?

If there were more smart people in government and F-22 production hadn't been terminated so early could the F-22 design be stretched slightly to increase fuel capacity?

I'd like to have seen the return of an advanced IRST and the "cheek" AESA arrays originally envisioned for the ATF.

 

[CV12Hornet]

I do wonder if it would be possible to carry a bit more fuel in the F-22. There were some documents which suggested a capacity of about 20,600 lb internally but all of the newer information says about 18,000 lb. With the F-15C they managed to find room for an extra 2,000 lb or so compared to the F-15A so perhaps there was/is some unused space in the Raptor too?

F-22A fuel tank locations:

F-15A fuel tank locations:

http://alternatewars.com/SAC/TF-15A_Eagle_SAC_-_November_1974.pdf (pg.2)

F-15C fuel tank locations:

http://alternatewars.com/SAC/F-15C_Eagle_SAC_-_February_1992.pdf (pg.2)

Comparing the Raptor to the Eagle I have my doubts they could replicate what they did with the Eagle. As you can see following the links, the main difference between the two was a modest increase in tankage in the wings (ignore the fuselage tanks, I had to use the F-15B instead of the F-15A). As can be seen above, there is no more room in the wings of the Raptor.

As far as a fuselage stretch, that's rather expensive. The FB-22 expanded the wing and the fuel storage therein instead.

 

[Colonial-Marine]

Comparing the Raptor to the Eagle I have my doubts they could replicate what they did with the Eagle. As you can see following the links, the main difference between the two was a modest increase in tankage in the wings (ignore the fuselage tanks, I had to use the F-15B instead of the F-15A). As can be seen above, there is no more room in the wings of the Raptor.

As far as a fuselage stretch, that's rather expensive. The FB-22 expanded the wing and the fuel storage therein instead.

Interestingly enough when I do the math from the numbers on that page and subtract the fuel in the external tanks I get 20,649 lb of internal fuel. Of course not all of this would be usable but that's a pretty significant difference between 18,000 lb.

Then again it looks like the they got the conversion of gallons to litres wrong so I don't know what's going on.

I suppose it makes sense that with the longer development time the F-22 had they would have figured out how to fit as much fuel as possible in the airframe. Modifying the fuselage would have been rather expensive to be sure but given all of the work that would have been needed to be done to resume production that would have been the right time if ever to make such a change for a new-build "F-22C". Was there ever a definite layout for the FB-22? I know a few different layouts were considered.

 

[BDF]

TO 105E is a odd document. The internal fuel capacities listed for the F-16, F-4 and others seem to precisely match publicly available figures. F-15C is accurate for....the F-15A; i.e. as I recall it lists less fuel internally than the F-15C is reputed to carry. One would imagine that it should list more capacity than usable fuel as most fuel systems have some room for expansion, venting, feed system and trapped fuel. One of my current hypothesis is that is the difference between the 20,650lbs and 18,000lbs. The other possibility is that the F-22 must retain fuel on board for cooling system purposes. So while the tanks carry 20,650lbs, 18,000lbs is the effective usable load.

Interestingly, AFA documents have listed the internal fuel as 18,448lbs and back when the official Raptor demo started with Max Moga, it was reported that he would request 18,500lbs added for the demo from civilian line fuelers. (FWIW). 448lbs is obviously basically insignificant but thought I'd pass that along.

 

[apparition13]

As far as a fuselage stretch, that's rather expensive. The FB-22 expanded the wing and the fuel storage therein instead.

F/A-22 Spiral 5: attack avionics
FB-22-1: stretched and widened fuselage. !x5000# and 2x2000# main bay. It was essentially a new fuselage with the same wing and tails.

Widening the fuselage was considered to be too difficult, so they decided to just stretch the fuselage in order to enlarge the main bay in order be able to carry 4x2000# in the main bay, while also making the side bays SDB compatible. This led to the three delta designs, -2, -3, and -4, which shared the stretched fuselage. From -2 to -4 each had larger and less swept wings, resulting in more fuel and range at the cost of speed. The -2 had the shortest range (though still far more than the F-22) but could still supercruise, while the -4 was entirely subsonic but had even more range, with the -3 somewhere in between.

There is a simple illustration of of all five designs somewhere in the FB-22 thread.

 

[Fighterreaper97]

Have the concepts been designed yet?