HMS Aurora Chinese Conversion

[World B4]

Wiki sayeth that the cruiser, at this point called the Huang He, was taken to be converted into a salvage ship. Since over 1/12 of the budget was spent before the project was cancelled, I hope there is some info out there on the specs and design?

HMS Aurora (12) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

"The empty hulk spent the rest of her life as an accommodation and warehouse ship, being subsequently renamed Huang He (Yellow River) in 1959, when it was transferred to Shanghai on 27 October of that year to be converted to a salvage ship at a planned budget of 3 million ¥. After spending 276,000 ¥, the conversion project was cancelled, and the ship was once again transferred, this time to Tianjin"

 

[cattalonX]

I don't know the version about the salvage ship
But there are plans to rebuilt to a light cruiser

The Chinese side has three different schemes
Plan one , rebuild as a light cruiser，The original 6-inch main gun was maintained to enhance anti-aircraft firepower
Plan two, also rebuilt as a light cruiser，But the main gun was changed to four twin 130 turrets
Plan Three, rebuild as a training ship
the PLAN wants most is Plan one，Plan one and two both need of 6~8 Soviet 100mm AA guns and some 37mm AA guns
The ship has a speed of at least 29 knots and a range of 4,000 nautical miles（cruising speed unknown）

But the Soviets said it would be difficult to repair the 6-inch gun，So the Soviets proposed rebuilding four twin-130m guns and eight twin-57mm anti-aircraft guns，speed at least 30 knots
It costs 200 million rubles, four to five years，Chinese thinks it's too expensive（The total cost of all the Sino-Soviet naval treaties in 1953 was only 600 million rubles）
So the plan was abandoned

 

[Hardrada55]

I don't remember where I got this, but its a very nice rendering of proposed rebuilt Aurora by the Soviets with 4 twin 130mm turrets and 8 twin 57mm anti-aircraft guns.

 

[cattalonX]

 

[cattalonX]

I don't remember where I got this, but its a very nice rendering of proposed rebuilt Aurora by the Soviets with 4 twin 130mm turrets and 8 twin 57mm anti-aircraft guns.

https://www.toutiao.com/article/6656523237083578893/

This is the work of an artist，What does it actually look like? Nobody knows

 

[Tzoli]

I wonder if the Leander type turrets could accept the 152mm Pattern 1938 guns of the Chapayev and Sverdlov classes?
On second thought, no, the Soviet gun somehow being only 7 calibre longer became 2,5 times as heavy!!! (What are the guns made of ? Lead-Steel?) The turrets would need a complete re-design. Not sure of the Twin 152mm turrets intended for the Kronshtadt and Stalingrad classes would fit at all on the barbettes!

6"/50 BL Mark XXIII - 7tons

United Kingdom / Britain 6"/50 (15.2 cm) BL Mark XXIII - NavWeaps

www.navweaps.com

152mm/57 Pattern 1938 - 17,5tons

Russia / USSR 152 mm/57 (6") Pattern 1938 - NavWeaps

www.navweaps.com

 

[00-PureEvil-00]

On second thought, no, the Soviet gun somehow being only 7 calibre longer became 2,5 times as heavy!!! (What are the guns made of ? Lead-Steel?) The turrets would need a complete re-design. Not sure of the Twin 152mm turrets intended for the Kronshtadt and Stalingrad classes would fit at all on the barbettes!

Soviet gun had much higher ballistic performance, hence thicker (and heavier) breech and barrel. And the steel itself was probably heavier than what British used too.
Also, I'm pretty sure Chungking's turrets needed major repairs anyway, so modifying them to accept heavier guns likely wouldn't have been much of a problem.

P.S. Stalingrad was never supposed to carry 152-mm secondaries. And even if some preliminary designs featured them, they would have been dual-purpose and definitely too large and heavy for Chungking.

 

[Tzoli]

Ahh yes I meant Kronshtadt and Sovetsky Soyuz classes

 

[Dilandu]

P.S. Stalingrad was never supposed to carry 152-mm secondaries. And even if some preliminary designs featured them, they would have been dual-purpose and definitely too large and heavy for Chungking.

The only Soviet project of 152-mm dual-purpose mounts I'm aware of were BL-115 (dual) and BL-118 (triple). They were intended for MLK-series light cruisers. There are mentions that BL-118 mounts were suggested for one of Project 82 preliminary designs, but apparently nothing came out of it; the post-war Soviet navy doctrine did not favor heavy secondaries, assuming that battleships & heavy cruisers would not operate without escorts anyway.

The BL-115 weighted about 150 tons, the BL-118 - more than 200 tons. Both are far too heavy to replace British Mark XXI turrets, at least on one-to-one basic.

(there were also plans for 180-mm DP guns for dedicated Project 84 air defense cruiser)

 

[Dilandu]

I wonder if the Leander type turrets could accept the 152mm Pattern 1938 guns of the Chapayev and Sverdlov classes?
On second thought, no, the Soviet gun somehow being only 7 calibre longer became 2,5 times as heavy!!! (What are the guns made of ? Lead-Steel?) The turrets would need a complete re-design. Not sure of the Twin 152mm turrets intended for the Kronshtadt and Stalingrad classes would fit at all on the barbettes!

The B-38 barrel with breech, according to Russian sources, weighted about 12 tons.

 

[cattalonX]

China get some 152 coastal guns from the Soviet Union, but there were no photos of the guns, only shells

 

[Dilandu]

China get some 152 coastal guns from the Soviet Union, but there were no photos of the guns, only shells

The 152-57 shell is for MU-2 stationary coastal defense gun. IRRC, some of those guns were installed in Port Arthur after 1945, and were gifted to China after Port Arthur was transferred under Chinese control in 1955.

The 180-mm shell is for MU-1 stationary coastal defense gun, same origin:



And the 100-mm/56 shell is for KSM-65 post-war towed coastal defense gun, some of them were sold to China in 1956:

 

[DWG]

There's a six page article on Aurora/Chongqing by a Chinese author in Naval Sitrep 66 (Admiralty Trilogy Group, available at the Wargame Vault). A lot of details disagree with the wiki article, such as Chongqing being scuttled rather than sunk.

"On April 4, 1957, the PLA Navy Command wrote a report to the Chief of the General Staff Department that since all the equipment except the hull had to be replaced, the foreign exchange reserves needed were very large - about 100 million yuan, and recommended scrapping Chongqing. In May, the PLA General Staff Department decided not to repair the cruiser. On October 22, 1958, the PLA Navy Command and the Ministry of Transport of the PRC signed an agreement to give the hull, renamed Huanghe, to the Ministry free of charge. On October 30, the ship was towed to Shanghai. In early 1960, it was planned to install engines and the necessary equipment to make it a rescue and salvage ship. It spent 276,000 yuan on this reconstruction that year, but later the reconstruction project came to a standstill. After the start of the Bohai Bay offshore oil and gas project (Project 641) in 1964, the hull was used as a dormitory and storage vessel, and then scrapped at an unknown time.

In addition to the hull, two main engines were sold to the Electricity Department of Zhejiang Province for 320,000 yuan, and four boilers were sold to the Tianjing Federation of Supply and Marketing Cooperative, the Commerce Department of Hubei Province, and the Industry Bureau of Jiyuan County for 72,000 yuan for civilian use. The three main guns were dismantled in 1959."

When considering her condition and the possibility of rebuilding her, it's important to remember she'd spent 15 months on her side in the water, and then sat mouldering dockside between 1951 and 1960 with little done beside stripping her equipment for reverse-engineering.

 

[awhalen61]

I don't know the version about the salvage ship
But there are plans to rebuilt to a light cruiser
View attachment 697845
The Chinese side has three different schemes
Plan one , rebuild as a light cruiser，The original 6-inch main gun was maintained to enhance anti-aircraft firepower
Plan two, also rebuilt as a light cruiser，But the main gun was changed to four twin 130 turrets
Plan Three, rebuild as a training ship
the PLAN wants most is Plan one，Plan one and two both need of 6~8 Soviet 100mm AA guns and some 37mm AA guns
The ship has a speed of at least 29 knots and a range of 4,000 nautical miles（cruising speed unknown）
View attachment 697847
But the Soviets said it would be difficult to repair the 6-inch gun，So the Soviets proposed rebuilding four twin-130m guns and eight twin-57mm anti-aircraft guns，speed at least 30 knots
It costs 200 million rubles, four to five years，Chinese thinks it's too expensive（The total cost of all the Sino-Soviet naval treaties in 1953 was only 600 million rubles）
So the plan was abandoned

Do you know what book/memoir this is from?

 

[cattalonX]

Do you know what book/memoir this is from?

 

[cattalonX]