Hispano Aviación HS-50

[roberto_yeager]

You had talked about him before...

Now I put a photo




1Saludo

 

[Archibald]

There had been a good article on the aircraft in Le Fana de l'aviation in 2005. Have to check the number and month...

 

[Apophenia]

The site mentioned by Moonbat also has images of Hispano Aviación's HS-50 mock-up at San Jacinto.
http://rareaircraf1.greyfalcon.us/Spain.htm

Can anyone tell me if the HS-50 was ever built? Was this identical to the Dewoitine D.600 (ie: was the D.600 designed for Spain)? Or was the HS-50 simply a D.600 derivative?

 

[Pepe Rezende]

The site mentioned by Moonbat also has images of Hispano Aviación's HS-50 mock-up at San Jacinto.
http://rareaircraf1.greyfalcon.us/Spain.htm

Can anyone tell me if the HS-50 was ever built? Was this identical to the Dewoitine D.600 (ie: was the D.600 designed for Spain)? Or was the HS-50 simply a D.600 derivative?

According Jean Cunny's Les Avions Dewoitine the HS50 was the Dewoitine D.600 Spanish version. It never were built. Spanish Air Force chosen the BF109G. Cunny said there was two versions, a long nose, that with the needle front, and a short nose, with a Spitfire 9 similar front.

Cheers

Pepe

 

[Justo Miranda]

Additional stuff ...

 

[Apophenia]

Many thanks Pepe and Justo. The short-nosed version is interesting (suggesting an engine other than the HS12Z, perhaps?).

Anyway, I guess "del abortado caza" says it all. Nice mockup though ;D

Justo, I'd guess that the 'colourized' 3-view was based on your, better-quality version.

 

[Maveric]

Do you have also a drawing and technical data for the Dewoitine D.600?

 

[Justo Miranda]

Wingspan: 10.9 m
Lenght :8.85 m
Height 3.55 m
Engine: Hispano Suiza HS 12 Z
Armament : One Hispano Suiza HS 404 engine 20 mm canon an four 7.5 mm band feed machine guns in the wings

 

[Retrofit]

Do you have also a drawing and technical data for the Dewoitine D.600?

In fact, the two references HS-50 and D-600 corespond to the same project, the HS-50 was the Hispano-Suiza reference and D-600 was the Dewoitine reference.

Hereafter another 3V drawing from the book "Le Dewoitine 520" by Raymond Danel and Jean Cuny, Docavia, Ed. Lariviere;

 

[Pepe Rezende]

Many thanks Pepe and Justo. The short-nosed version is interesting (suggesting an engine other than the HS12Z, perhaps?).

Anyway, I guess "del abortado caza" says it all. Nice mockup though ;D

Justo, I'd guess that the 'colourized' 3-view was based on your, better-quality version.

All versions would use the HS12Z. The only diference is the engine mounting, lower in the long nose version.

Pepe

 

[Apophenia]

Thanks for the clarification Pepe.

 

[Jan den Das]

Hai
Is there some one who can give an answer concerning the fighter project from Argentine?
There they have a Dewoitine project FMA I.Ae.26 D-600 and what I understand is that the D-600 stands for Dewoitine D-600, because the Pulqui I was the D-700.
Who has information, everything concerning the I-Ae.26?
Jan

 

[Apophenia]

From: http://www.argothypermedia.com/fma/19431955/19431955_08e.html

(I've rearranged and cleaned up the 3-view a bit.)

PROYECTO I.AE. 26 D - 600
Conventional fighter (designed by Ing. Emile Dewoitine) with powerplant options of Rolls Royce Merlin III of 1030 hp (delivery of which was denied by Britain after a series of solicitations by the FMA) or Daimler Benz DB 601A inverted V12 of 1,100 HP (to be provided by Spain). The Project is cancelled in favour of the B-700 (I.Ae.27) Pulqui I.

Characteristics: span 10.20 m; length 8.90 m; wing area 15.92 m²; weight empty 2,090 kg; gross weight 2,740 kg; terminal velocity 560 km/h; theoretical ceiling 10,000 m; range 1,400 km; armament: one 20mm HS-404, four 7,50 mm MAC 1934 M39 machine guns.

 

[redstar72]

Thanks, Justo & Apophenia! Very interesting projects, I didn't know them before. While the HS-50 is a typical Dewoitine, the I.Ae.26 looks not very Dewoitine-like. The repositioned cockpit and the bubble canopy completely changed its appearance. As for me, there is something Focke-Wulf-like in it.

I didn't understand one thing: both of these, very different airplanes were designated by Dewoitine as "D-600"?

 

[Jan den Das]

Hai
Its just what redstar mentioned it did not look much like a Dewoitine design.
The drawing is also incomplete. There is no cowling, only under the nose the cowling for the oil.
Is/are there any better drawings and/or more details?

 

[Apophenia]

Jan: I'm not aware of better-quality drawings of the I.AE.26.

By "cowling" you meant a housing for a coolant radiator? Considering the poor quality of this drawing, I don't think we can assume that the under-nose fixture is for an oil-cooler only.

redstar: Yes, the two D-600 projects seem completely unrelated. As for the I.AE.26 not being very Dewoitine-like, I would agree that there is no great resemblance to other Dewoitine fighter designs. I see similarities with some of Dewoitine's non-fighter projects though.

 

[burunduk]

Very interesting stuff, muchas gracias.

It seems, D-600 was prepared during the occupation? In what year?

And when the project I.Ae.26 was made? After WW2?

 

[Apophenia]

The I.Ae.26 was a wartime project but never built.

 

[lucamax]

Hi,
Do you know if there are others drawings, graphic reconstructions or artist's impression of the IAE.26?

 

[arc3371]

The IAe 26 seem like a very interesting project

 

[lucamax]

Hi,
I made a color profile of a hypothetical prototype of the airplane (IAE.26). I apologize for the quality not very good of the Profile: I'm working to improve myself! ;D

 

[Apophenia]

Like lucamax, I had a stab at 'reconstructing' the I.Ae.26 fighter. A few problems popped up with that original 3-view drawing.

The major difficulty is that the engine and propeller spinner do not scale with that of the Bf-109E. Since the exhaust outlets and supercharger intake should be relatively constant, I've used those to scale the DB601A with the airframe. As can be seen, this results in a noticably shorter forward fuselage.

I fear that we must conclude that the original I.Ae.26 3-view drawing was crudely rendered.

 

[lark]

Excellent work Stephen..
Thanks a lot.

 

[lucamax]

congratulations Apophenia it is great! Thank you very much for the superb reconstruction of the plane. In comparison my profile is the scribble of a child!

 

[Pepe Rezende]

Like lucamax, I had a stab at 'reconstructing' the I.Ae.26 fighter. A few problems popped up with that original 3-view drawing.

The major difficulty is that the engine and propeller spinner do not scale with that of the Bf-109E. Since the exhaust outlets and supercharger intake should be relatively constant, I've used those to scale the DB601A with the airframe. As can be seen, this results in a noticably shorter forward fuselage.

I fear that we must conclude that the original I.Ae.26 3-view drawing was crudely rendered.

You must use the DB605 engine, probably its Italian version.

 

[Apophenia]

Cheers folks

You must use the DB605 engine, probably its Italian version.

Interesting notion Pepe. Assuming availability of the Fiat RA 1050 R.C.58 Tifone, the project gains 250 hp. And, as you suggest, the DB605's extra 43 cm of length would push the nose forward again.

The ongoing difficulty is that I.Ae.26 references specifically mention a Spanish-provided DB601A.

 

[Vahe Demirjian]

This thread should be merged with the following thread:

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/hispano-aviación-hs-50.5975/

 

[raigap]

Hispano Aviacion HS-50

 

[Badner]

In 1942, the Spanish Ejército del Aires (air force) required a fighter to replace its ageing Fiat CR. 32, Polikarpov !-15 and I-16s. Consequently, the Spanish Aviation firm Hispano Suiza requested Dewoitine to undertake the design of a single-seat fighter designated as HS 50. The aircraft, would be powered by the Hispano Suiza 12Z rated at 1,300 h.p. at an altitude of 6,000 meters, would carry an armament of a single H.S. 404 20 mm cannon with 60 rounds and four machine guns in the wings. with 875 rounds apiece, and capable of a max. speed of 670 km/h (426 mph) which according to Dewoitine would make it comparable to the Spitfire, the ME-109, and even the North American P-51 Mustang. Late in 1942, Hispano Suiza completed a 1:1 wooden mock-up of the H.S. 50 at its La Tablada plant, in Seville. The Hispano 12 Z would be assembled in Spain from French-built components. But in June 1943, Hispano Suiza was absorbed by a new firm known as Hispano Aviación, which received an order from the Spanish Air Ministry for 200 Spanish-built ME-109Gs, and instead.

The design was also offered to Capitan Ismael Nuñez, the Argentine Air Attaché in April of 199, but, although the offer was considered, the fact that it had lost out to the Me-109G, and the unreliability of the powerplant installed aboard the Spanish-built Me-109G (HA 1109 KIll, flown first in March 1945 militated against it, and the Argentine Attaché declined the Frenchman's offer

 

[Apophenia]

Perhaps merge with Hispano Aviación HS-50 thread under Secret Early Aircraft Projects ?

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/hispano-aviación-hs-50.1001/

 

[Badner]

A more detailed photo from my book on Argentine piston engine fighters.

 

[Badner]

A clearer pic of the HS 50