Boeing 737 MAX family NEWS ONLY

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steelpillow said:
DWG said:
strengthening Boeing's engineering culture
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Of course that means weakening the grip of the central beancounter culture -- by the head beancounter. One trusts he is up to the challenge.
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I feel like it's almost giving too much credit to the broken parts of their management to call it "beancounter culture." Some of their moves don't even make sense for someone supposedly obsessed with the bottom line.
 
Grey Havoc said:
https://www.flightglobal.com/air-tr...aith-in-aircraft-certification/136965.article
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"US-built aircraft would be prohibited from being sold to foreign airlines unless the state concerned is compliant with ICAO standards, as determined by international safety assessment programmes. "

That's radical.

"Granting of exemptions for use of non-motion training devices to replace full-motion simulators for validation and qualification would be prohibited, the bill adds. "

It's not entirely clear whether this is talking about engineering development, or pilot development. I'm not sure the argument is entirely valid for either case.
 
The only bit relevant to this thread is the review of MAX certification. Can we keep the rest out?
 
https://www.flightglobal.com/safety...ons-of-737-max-prior-to-flight/136914.article
inadequate “electrical bonding” of panels atop the 737 Max’s CFM International Leap-1B turbofans could allow a lightning strike to disable both the Max’s engines.

And separately

https://www.flightglobal.com/engines/cfm-to-build-10-737-max-engines-weekly-for-2020/136959.article
So 10 engines weekly, = 520 over the year, = 260 ship sets. Which, allowing for spares, roughly tallies with Spirit's contract for 216 fuselages.

https://www.barrons.com/articles/boeing-build-737-max-jets-2020-51580483928
If we assume Boeing will try to get back to 42 aircraft per month by the end of the year, and it'll have a couple of months at half that rate while it restarts the line and figures out if all the changes work, then we're looking at a production restart circa June. If they plan a lower rate, then it will be earlier. (While storing the engines wouldn't be too bad, storing large numbers of fuselages will create pressure on Boeing to resume earlier rather than later)
 
Interesting that “excessive rework” is the cause of the lightning protection issue. That implies the panels were not right when first made and had to be hacked about before fitting. Given that electromagnetic compatibility (EMC) in general and LEMP (Lightning electromagnetic pulse) in particular is such a big deal for composite components, failure to reappraise the protection integrity after rework stands out as yet another example of safety culture under excess pressure. (FWIW EMC/EMP was once my day job. Typically the resin matrix gets vapourised by even a modest test lightning strike and the unprotected composite fibres break, splaying out like a bogbrush).

I begin to wonder whether the FAA inspections of each and every aircraft will be able to keep up with Boeing's planned delivery rates.
 
steelpillow said:
Interesting that “excessive rework” is the cause of the lightning protection issue. That implies the panels were not right when first made and had to be hacked about before fitting. Given that electromagnetic compatibility (EMC) in general and LEMP (Lightning electromagnetic pulse) in particular is such a big deal for composite components, failure to reappraise the protection integrity after rework stands out as yet another example of safety culture under excess pressure. (FWIW EMC/EMP was once my day job. Typically the resin matrix gets vapourised by even a modest test lightning strike and the unprotected composite fibres break, splaying out like a bogbrush).

I begin to wonder whether the FAA inspections of each and every aircraft will be able to keep up with Boeing's planned delivery rates.
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I think that it's going to be the other way around. Boeing's planned delivery rates are going to keep pace with the FAA inspections. No inspection, no delivery.
And foreign regulatory bodies are going to keep an eye out on the whole process, so it's going to be hard for Boeing to do an endrun around the inspections by pressuring the FAA.
 
MihoshiK said:
I think that it's going to be the other way around. Boeing's planned delivery rates are going to keep pace with the FAA inspections. No inspection, no delivery.
And foreign regulatory bodies are going to keep an eye out on the whole process, so it's going to be hard for Boeing to do an endrun around the inspections by pressuring the FAA.
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Well, "planned" and "actual" are not the same thing. The Max is not known for it track record of going to Boeing's plans recently.
 
"
US-built aircraft would be prohibited from being sold to foreign airlines unless the state concerned is compliant with ICAO standards, as determined by international safety assessment programmes. "

That's radical.
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Contrary to what was said above, this is absolutely relevant to this thread. The safety procedures around sensors handling and pilots reactions is a proof to that.

Hence, this radical regulation is a step forward in aviation safety. And once again Boeing and the US are at the forefront of the pack (after their unique move per example to call for and then ban air transportation of Batteries following MH370).

Great move!
 
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TomcatViP said:
Hence, this radical regulation is a step forward in aviation safety. And once again Boeing and the US are at the forefront of the pack
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That's 'the US', or more accurately 'three Senate Democrats' not 'Boeing and the US'. There's absolutely nothing in the article to imply Boeing was involved beyond the MAX disasters focusing attention on certification
 
Transparency doesn't come as a natural on every side of the market.
 

Attachments

  • TI Preliminary Investigative Findings Boeing 737 MAX March 2020.pdf
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https://www.flightglobal.com/airfra...ved-sensors-on-almost-800-737s/137134.article"FAA says sensors that feed head-up guidance systems made by Rockwell Collins, now Collins Aerospace, were not approved to work with those guidance systems.
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Asked if it might need to modify affected 737s, Boeing says it believes “there are no issues with the physical units” and that the fine relates only to documentation."

Unless it's certified the combination in the interim, Boeing will need to take it through the certification process, so it's more than simply 'documentation'.
 
It remains to be seen how the present virus crisis could help Boeing: slowing down appetite from airline to get hands on their MAX order, in effect lowering Boeing needs for cash. Also, as many time raised here and there, the volatility of Airbus position due to their core market (short to medium & Europe) could make Boeing position more attractive to investors at market recovery.
 
TomcatViP said:
It remains to be seen how the present virus crisis could help Boeing: slowing down appetite from airline to get hands on their MAX order, in effect lowering Boeing needs for cash.
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What you've missed is that the airlines themselves will be desperate for cash, stinging Boeing for compensation for delayed delivery just got even more immediately attractive. While I suspect airlines threatening to cancel orders will be demanding repayment in full of any deposits and interim payments, AND compensation.
 
Airlines will get tax relief in countries governed by clever people. Tax relief means that they will have to invest, and on the long term, to get full advantages of it.
 
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TomcatViP said:
Airlines will get tax relief in countries governed by clever people. Tax relief means that they will have to invest, and on the long term, to get full advantages of it.
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Not if the Airlines in question have gone to the wall. Or suffered enough economic damage to slow their recovery.
Damage to the Airline industry ultimately hurts Boeing not matter how hard one looks for a silver lining.
 
@kaiserd : Obviously. We would be there out of scale with my little theory.
But stimulus does work. Most lends to the US auto-industry were covered quite rapidly if I do remind well.
 
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Boeing on Tuesday said it was seeking at least $60 billion to assist the aerospace industry as it struggles with declining demand due to the coronavirus. President Donald Trump said the same day that he would support Boeing, which also is a top U.S. defense contractor.
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"We appreciate the support of the president and the administration for the 2.5 million jobs and 17,000 suppliers that Boeing relies on to remain the number one US exporter, and we look forward to working with the administration and Congress as they consider legislation and the appropriate policies," the company said in a statement.
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https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2020/03/18...will-run-out-of-money-if-it-is-not-saved.html
 
If you are Boeing, it seems every cloud has a silver lining:
https://simpleflying.com/coronavirus-boeing-737-max-shortage/

Because of the massive travel cutbacks due to Coronavirus, "Most likely, the settlements that the airlines were seeking from Boeing due to loss of revenue as a result of the grounding of the aircraft will now be significantly less as they can no longer argue that the inability to use the planes are leading to substantial financial damage."
 
My father works in the SLC, Utah plant, apparently employees have been getting wildly mixed signals from management. Last week on wednsday it was "No overtime, No exceptions." but by the weekend it was allhands on deck and all the overtime you could handle.
 
Let's wait & see that we don't have another crisis like a war with Iran.


OT:
Strategically, going full force now will benefit from the widespread lock down and low gas prices (they are depleting their reserve to make for the loss in profit & we de-facto counter their terror strategy by eliminating most cluster of people).
 
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