Advanced TSR.2?


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4 June 2006
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Out of interest, did anyone in the UK have the guts to suggest an advanced TSR2?

Somewhere else in this forum has been mentioned a VG TSR.2 from circa 1964 (in the BAC thread?)
English Electric proposed a swing wing variant of their P.17A
using the technology from the Swallow as proposed by Barnes Wallis.

More in : The Aeroplane Monthly - July 1997. "Concept versus Reality" by Frank Barnett-Jones.
I've always been intrigued by the rumours of early eighties plans to bring the TSR2 up to date. A school friend of mine visited Cosford around that time, and recounts a tale of "men from the ministry types" crawling all over XR220, Roland Beaumont also mentions it in an article on testing the TSR2 in Aeroplane which I have somewhere.

Does anyone have any other details...?

I have read claims that Maggie Thatcher when she came to power was interested in trying to resurrect the TSR2. However, as the jigs and drawings had been destroyed, saner minds suggested that it wouldn't an economic idea and as the Tornado was about to enter service, it wasn't all that sensible an idea.
This story is rather well-documented, I remember that the excellent website "Thunder and Lightnings" mention it... ;)
I first saw this tale in a book called "Speed and Power" about 10 years ago.

I thought the book was a compilation of the excellent weekly magazine of the same name from the early 1970s. One of the magazine's special offers was to buy your own piece of a TSR.2. Unfortunately I was about twelve and skint at the time. I wonder how many pieces of TSR.2 are languishing unidentified in the attics of Britain, purchased on the proceeds of newspaper runs? I feel a Rowley Birkin moment coming on...

Can anyone confirm this offer in "Speed and Power" magazine?

I remember talking to a guy who still had his piece a couple of years ago at an air show... I offered to take it off his hands, but for some strange reason he wasn't keen...

Back to the story, I've read the piece on T&L and a dame fine history it is too, I was just wondering if anyone had any concrete info... all you seem to hear is anecdotes...

I believe Air Pictorial had an article on updating TSR2 and I have a vague recollection of the BBC's Panorama programme featuring it once in the early 80's (it may have been comparing it to the Tornado).

Doesn't the book on the TSR-2 by Frank Barnett-Jones discuss consideration given in the 1980s to revive and update the TSR-2, using the Concorde's engines as the baseline engine?
It would be something of a machine... due to Concorde weight rising from 130 tons in 1963, to 185 tons 15 years later, power weight and size of the Olympus-593 followed the move... not sure that concorde engine could enter again into a TSR-2 (but a TSR-2 with concorde exhaust would look cooool!!
Is there a picture or diagram of that proposed VG- or advanced TSR.2 available ???

TSRJoe posted a few pictures of the TSR at our sister forum "" today.
Forum link:,13.0.html
TSR.2 development study with a VG wing.
Direct link:,29746.0.html

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