Northrop / McDonnell Douglas F-23A by VentZer0

[VentZer0]

Hello Everyone, firstime posting here.
For the past couple years I have been working on a F-23A Model in Blender. I have been through a bunch of iterations and artistic license version of that particular aircraft including a two seat navalized version. However I have decided to create a more true to what could've been version and essentially re-did the model from scratch. I have had particular issues with all my iterations, when it comes to certain aspects of the model that are not well represented or explained in enough detail in any of the material I came across (I have the Paul Metz book and the Japanese picture book).

Those are the control surfaces.

The particular issues: What were the deflection limits for the leading edge and the trailing edge flaps. And, how do they actually move, where is the rotational axis, how did they get rid of the gaps and seams that form when the surfaces deflect or the collision with the wing surface. (The screenshots will explain what I mean by this)
I know the ailerons do 40° up and down, but for the flaperons I am not so sure.

That is why I'm writing this post. Maybe somebody can help or knows how they'd solve this issue on the real bird.
I have no real knowledge about aerospace engineering and aircraft manurfacturing so I don't know the lingo to look for in solving my questions. I will attach some screenshots of the issues for reference.

 

[flateric]

Gaps were covered with flexible tapes just like on B-2 and many other LO aircrafts. , There were no 'hinged panels'.

 

[VentZer0]

Gaps were covered with flexible tapes just like on B-2 and many other LO aircrafts. , There were no 'hinged panels'.

Ah okay, that's something I have seen on the F-35 and F-22, can you point me to an explaination of how that works or what to google for?

Is the Tape attached on both sides or does one side just glide over the surface of the other and seals any gaps that way?
Because the Issue that arises in my head is what happens to the part that stretches on the opposite side.

 

[Ogami musashi]

That's a great model. I am not too sure about the fuselage nacelles junction though. Is it some artistic interpretation? Or is it your interpretation of the blue prints?

 

[VentZer0]

Thanks!
I took some artistic license in certain places to let the shape flow in a better way, also the blueprints as you can see are just something of a guide really. Those are from Paul Metz Book, which has the best detailed ones, but even scanned in high res and blown up to "real world" size the thickness of the lines makes them not really that useful in the end. Too blurry to be precise with them.

As you can see in the screenshots the overall shaping is very close to the actual blueprints, however in some areas I deviated a bit - like the nose for example, it is more curved and rounded, like the F-35 or F-22 and not this sudden triangular shape towards the front.
I'm happy that I got the lower fuselage pretty much entirely correct with the inlets and the divertless intake cones plus the serration. That took some work!

 

[icyplanetnhc (Steve)]

The F-35 does have a chiseled nose radome though, so I think it’s reasonable if the F-23 would also be shaped like this.

Is the one piece canopy also an artistic interpretation on your part? The DWGs show a two-piece design but it’s possible that it may have had a one-piece canopy had the design been refined further during EMD.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

I've attached the original scans of the F-23 blueprints I have. Might be useful.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

In terms of minor detailing of e.g. flaps etc I'd look to the B-2 and F-22 for inspiration. Jim Goodall posted some nice B-2 closeups in

Pictorial History of the B-2A Spirit Stealth Bomber.​

 

[VentZer0]

The F-35 does have a chiseled nose radome though, so I think it’s reasonable if the F-23 would also be shaped like this.

Is the one piece canopy also an artistic interpretation on your part? The DWGs show a two-piece design but it’s possible that it may have had a one-piece canopy had the design been refined further during EMD.

I meant it from the top down perspective the side profile is also adjusted a bit, its not round like the nose cone of a F-15 or F-14, it still has the chime going all the way to the front.

Yes, the canopy was a deliberate change due to the picture that got me into making this model in the first place. I just think it looks way better and given that the former project leads of the YF-23 programm said the F-22 took some of their ideas, I took some pointers from the F-22.

In terms of minor detailing of e.g. flaps etc I'd look to the B-2 and F-22 for inspiration. Jim Goodall posted some nice B-2 closeups in

Pictorial History of the B-2A Spirit Stealth Bomber.​

Thanks for that and the blueprints. Something to order on monday.


I think, I will do a little bit of refinement on the overall shape. It was actually some time ago when I last checked the shape against the cross sections. The transition from the main fuselage to the nacells can use some touch up. There won't be full 100% accuracy, because there are some inconsistencies and inaccuracies in the blueprints themselfs.
Though, I think that I got it very close and still did it justice - hopefully.

 

[Ogami musashi]

Thanks!
I took some artistic license in certain places to let the shape flow in a better way, also the blueprints as you can see are just something of a guide really. Those are from Paul Metz Book, which has the best detailed ones, but even scanned in high res and blown up to "real world" size the thickness of the lines makes them not really that useful in the end. Too blurry to be precise with them.

As you can see in the screenshots the overall shaping is very close to the actual blueprints, however in some areas I deviated a bit - like the nose for example, it is more curved and rounded, like the F-35 or F-22 and not this sudden triangular shape towards the front.
I'm happy that I got the lower fuselage pretty much entirely correct with the inlets and the divertless intake cones plus the serration. That took some work!

Yes the blue prints are far from perfect and in fact are not symmetrical in several plans. The nacelle/fuselage junction has been the most difficult part as the only real picture we have is that of dp-232 mock-up on Paul Metz book. But first, the mock up is also far from being perfect as the yf-23 one shows, and since the configurations were evolving every day, who knows if it was to be that way. Still, your interpretation, which is seen in many other planes, is the first I see for the f-23. Do you have screens of different angles of that junction?

 

[VentZer0]

Yes the blue prints are far from perfect and in fact are not symmetrical in several plans. The nacelle/fuselage junction has been the most difficult part as the only real picture we have is that of dp-232 mock-up on Paul Metz book. But first, the mock up is also far from being perfect as the yf-23 one shows, and since the configurations were evolving every day, who knows if it was to be that way. Still, your interpretation, which is seen in many other planes, is the first I see for the f-23. Do you have screens of different angles of that junction?

You are right, the blueprint also have a wobble in them, they are not 100% straight. Had to adjust things so that the horizontal reference line was actually horizontal, stuff like that causes inaccuracies down the line.
I checked the book and the junction has more of a ridge to it, my approach was a more blended shape. I was thinking about the words of one of the project members in the unclassified documentary "if it is smooth it's fast / stealthy" something to that effect.

I hope the screenshots help.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Indeed, the blueprints are not perfect, its a large format drawing that's been imperfectly reproduced.

 

[Ogami musashi]

You are right, the blueprint also have a wobble in them, they are not 100% straight. Had to adjust things so that the horizontal reference line was actually horizontal, stuff like that causes inaccuracies down the line.
I checked the book and the junction has more of a ridge to it, my approach was a more blended shape. I was thinking about the words of one of the project members in the unclassified documentary "if it is smooth it's fast / stealthy" something to that effect.

I hope the screenshots help.

Well actually I prefer your intepretation
Any plan on releasing the model at some point?

 

[VentZer0]

Well actually I prefer your intepretation
Any plan on releasing the model at some point?

Thanks
I will at some point I think, when I am satisfied with it. I might also put it into a game as a mod.

 

[BDF]

Hello Everyone, firstime posting here.
For the past couple years I have been working on a F-23A Model in Blender. I have been through a bunch of iterations and artistic license version of that particular aircraft including a two seat navalized version. However I have decided to create a more true to what could've been version and essentially re-did the model from scratch. I have had particular issues with all my iterations, when it comes to certain aspects of the model that are not well represented or explained in enough detail in any of the material I came across (I have the Paul Metz book and the Japanese picture book).

Those are the control surfaces.

The particular issues: What were the deflection limits for the leading edge and the trailing edge flaps. And, how do they actually move, where is the rotational axis, how did they get rid of the gaps and seams that form when the surfaces deflect or the collision with the wing surface. (The screenshots will explain what I mean by this)
I know the ailerons do 40° up and down, but for the flaperons I am not so sure.

That is why I'm writing this post. Maybe somebody can help or knows how they'd solve this issue on the real bird.
I have no real knowledge about aerospace engineering and aircraft manurfacturing so I don't know the lingo to look for in solving my questions. I will attach some screenshots of the issues for reference.

View attachment 707889

Great work! I like your interpretations of how the design might have evolved. I too am working on the F-23A project, in this case as a "mod" for DCS World. For my project, I stuck strictly with the General Arrangement Plans for DP231 with some interpretation where necessary. Things like weapons launchers for example. The external model is just about finished and we are now working on the internal cockpit model. Please keep us updated with your progress.

 

[VentZer0]

Great work! I like your interpretations of how the design might have evolved. I too am working on the F-23A project, in this case as a "mod" for DCS World. For my project, I stuck strictly with the General Arrangement Plans for DP231 with some interpretation where necessary. Things like weapons launchers for example. The external model is just about finished and we are now working on the internal cockpit model. Please keep us updated with your progress.

Thanks and very nice! Can you also show more pictures or give a link to the mod, I have DCS myself! Would love to take a look in the model viewer!
I am very interested how you modelled the exhaust nozzle paddles, because the Blueprints are very vague there.
I attached some screens of how I did it. Basically they are made up of three parts, instead of 2 like for the F-22.

 

[Ogami musashi]

Guys you are awesome !

 

[BDF]

Thanks and very nice! Can you also show more pictures or give a link to the mod, I have DCS myself! Would love to take a look in the model viewer!
I am very interested how you modelled the exhaust nozzle paddles, because the Blueprints are very vague there.
I attached some screens of how I did it. Basically they are made up of three parts, instead of 2 like for the F-22.

We are still developing it and it hasn't been released so I don't have a .EDM to share at the moment. We modeled the AB paddles almost exactly the same. I will have more to share in the future when we are closer to release

 

[VentZer0]

We are still developing it and it hasn't been released so I don't have a .EDM to share at the moment. We modeled the AB paddles almost exactly the same. I will have more to share in the future when we are closer to release

I see, please let us know when you release it or can share more!

 

[icyplanetnhc (Steve)]

I think, I will do a little bit of refinement on the overall shape. It was actually some time ago when I last checked the shape against the cross sections. The transition from the main fuselage to the nacells can use some touch up. There won't be full 100% accuracy, because there are some inconsistencies and inaccuracies in the blueprints themselfs.
Though, I think that I got it very close and still did it justice - hopefully.

With your renditions, I would advise against removing the chiseled shaping of the nose. According to Paul Metz' book, that nose shaping is quite important for vortex generation for the F-23's high angle-of-attack performance.