What do people think about current books?

Mark Nankivil said:
30 years ago, I remember going to the USAF Museum at Wright-Pat and being stunned by the size and scope of the bookstore within the gift shop. All before EPay, Amazon, etc. and titles I would never see at Borders (long gone) or Barnes & Noble. Go there today, it is a gift shop with an occasional book here and there.
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I cannot comment about the museum store's bookshelves at the monumental USAF Museum on Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in Ohio, because my first and so-far last visit there was in 1992, soon after Desert Storm. (I remember I walked up to and put my hand on the skin of the F-117 stealth plane displayed there, which would have gotten me shot just a few years earlier. And with the security rigamarole worldwide post-9/11, anything like that is unlikely today.)

I can comment that on my occasional visits to bookstores in London, to the RAF Museum's shop, and (especially) to the extensive book selection at the also-monumental Imperial War Museum Duxford, I have been struck by the number of British books of interest that never appear in bookstores here in the USA or on the Barnes & Noble or Amazon USA websites and thus remain entirely unknown. Not the color-illustrated books on glossy paper that are what this Secret Projects website mostly features in its 'Books & Marketplace' thread: as far as I can tell, those all are advertised, and available for sale, worldwide. I mean the black-type-on-plain-paper kind of book. The top bestselling Brit authors like Antony Beevor and Max Hastings obtain American co-publishers (sometimes with a revised book title), but as I found, there are plenty of others writing engrossingly on military/naval history, European history, cryptology & espionage, and other subjects whose books are only advertised and sold in the UK. On each return trip from London, I have brought home as many as I could carry, and I am looking at those books on my shelves as I write this: too many to list here. I wonder whether this matter is only one way, or instead if there are indeed books of general interest in bookshops here in the USA that likewise remain entirely unknown to UK readers.

P.S. And I forgot to include the bookshelves at the shop of the famed Bovington Tank Museum, at which I spent a fascinating day in 2022, taking the train out from Waterloo Station...
 
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I was surprised to find on my last visit to London (many years ago) that even the modest book store at Victoria Station (I believe it was a W.H. Smith) had a decent selection of books on aviation!
 
Like a winning racehorse, you might get an apple. Or a wonky carrot. Probably the carrot.

I hope SPF members are also aware of the Facebook Group The Aviation Enthusiast's Book Club (see here https://www.facebook.com/groups/359410134220076/ ). Worth a look if you are reading this thread.

While the high cost of books has been decried long and weary on there (and on here), there appears to be no appetite amongst publishers to address this. One way of reducing these costs is to reduce page count, possible to a certain extent by better design. Put the ~30% of a book that is citation pages online and, while you won't reduce the cost of a book by 30%, it might reduce the cost in some way, especially in low print-run works. (Oh! Don't mention Works on TAEBC. No, they don't hate Queen)

The citation racket has been used in the academic world to get funding, fair enough if that's what it takes but I see no need for it in the 'amateur' world. I use the word 'amateur' to mean we do it for love, not money, rather than poorly produced*. References, yes, but pages and pages of citations to namecheck your mates? No.

Interestingly, one publisher, in a post on the The Aviation Enthusiast's Book Club, has declared the UK aviation book business 'finished' and has said they won't be producing paper content any more (I paraphrase on both points here, please feel free to clarify if you're reading this). I find this alarming as they produce good books on interesting, and niche, subjects.

I have (long and weary again) been Cassandra-like in my forecasts of The Big Boy's Book of Aircraft in Colour being the only aircraft books available. That might just be where we are heading if quality material is only available under an Elsevier-type model as used for academic journals.

Chris

*I'll keep schtum on this matter.
 
CJGibson said:
Interestingly, one publisher, in a post on the The Aviation Enthusiast's Book Club, has declared the UK aviation book business 'finished' and has said they won't be producing paper content any more (I paraphrase on both points here, please feel free to clarify if you're reading this). I find this alarming as they
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Which publisher was that ? Assume they will be producing more e-books instead ?
 
I think more than a few times paper books have been written off, to use a pun. Cycles of use will continue as per and no doubt continue to change. Plus ca change.
 
madhon said:
Which publisher was that ? Assume they will be producing more e-books instead ?
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Harpia Publishing.

I guess being in the glossy paperback market makes it hard to get much return, especially when Bookzines are coming up much the same size and a little cheaper these days with poorer quality paper.
 
CJGibson said:
Like a winning racehorse, you might get an apple. Or a wonky carrot. Probably the carrot.

I hope SPF members are also aware of the Facebook Group The Aviation Enthusiast's Book Club (see here https://www.facebook.com/groups/359410134220076/ ). Worth a look if you are reading this thread.

While the high cost of books has been decried long and weary on there (and on here), there appears to be no appetite amongst publishers to address this. One way of reducing these costs is to reduce page count, possible to a certain extent by better design. Put the ~30% of a book that is citation pages online and, while you won't reduce the cost of a book by 30%, it might reduce the cost in some way, especially in low print-run works. (Oh! Don't mention Works on TAEBC. No, they don't hate Queen)

The citation racket has been used in the academic world to get funding, fair enough if that's what it takes but I see no need for it in the 'amateur' world. I use the word 'amateur' to mean we do it for love, not money, rather than poorly produced*. References, yes, but pages and pages of citations to namecheck your mates? No.

Interestingly, one publisher, in a post on the The Aviation Enthusiast's Book Club, has declared the UK aviation book business 'finished' and has said they won't be producing paper content any more (I paraphrase on both points here, please feel free to clarify if you're reading this). I find this alarming as they produce good books on interesting, and niche, subjects.

I have (long and weary again) been Cassandra-like in my forecasts of The Big Boy's Book of Aircraft in Colour being the only aircraft books available. That might just be where we are heading if quality material is only available under an Elsevier-type model as used for academic journals.

Chris

*I'll keep schtum on this matter.
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Paper prices. They either go up slowly or they go up quickly. I get quotes from different printers for our books. They have no control over it either. The same with postage and package delivery services like UPS. Every year, like clockwork, shipping prices go up. The publisher must adjust book prices accordingly. We look at what our competitors are charging and undercut them.

The UK and Europe are another matter. What with VAT and customs charges. Without going too far afield, but inflation in the U.S. and rising taxes in the UK, means sales have gone down. The choice for the average person is paying that bill or buying a book. When household expenses go up, sales go down.

I was taught how to do book layout by hand. There are only so many possible ways to reduce page count. There are only so many ways to lay out a page. The size of the type can only go down to a point. The average reader needs the type at a certain size.

As far as citations, they are necessary. Especially for history books. Your audience expects accuracy. That accuracy is assured by providing references anyone can check. As far as art, you can't drop in a map at just any size. It has to be at a readable size. The same with photos. Some will always complain that both are never large enough but look at your own library.

For decades, the U.S. Postal Service offered a shipping method called Surface Mail. That meant we could send pounds of books to Australia, for example, for little money. It took four to six weeks to arrive but people were glad to wait. When that ended in 2007, we lost 99% of our foreign customers overnight. The Post Office cited rising costs, as if costs had not been rising for all the years prior. Shortly after, ebook readers appeared everywhere. I read how they were a popular Christmas gift in the UK but most stayed in their boxes. Most people still prefer printed books. In reality, a barrier had been created between the United States and Europe, along with the rest of the world. It was an ebook or nothing. No one could justify paying the same amount for shipping as the cost of the books ordered. Without sounding too gloom and doom, but this result was pre-planned. The book trade knew this was coming. That said, printed book sales, which I monitor, are still high in the U.S. Not as high as during the so-called pandemic but still high.

For us, the idea of printing books in color only applies to doing the work in a country I shall not name.

Finally, too many people are doing military intelligence a great service, which they pay for. A combination of addiction and perceived need means most people are carrying (stupid) smart phones. They look at them constantly. This is, in my view, a waste of human potential. These devices are no substitute for face to face interactions.
 
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CJGibson said:
Like a winning racehorse, you might get an apple. Or a wonky carrot. Probably the carrot.

I hope SPF members are also aware of the Facebook Group The Aviation Enthusiast's Book Club (see here https://www.facebook.com/groups/359410134220076/ ). Worth a look if you are reading this thread.

While the high cost of books has been decried long and weary on there (and on here), there appears to be no appetite amongst publishers to address this. One way of reducing these costs is to reduce page count, possible to a certain extent by better design. Put the ~30% of a book that is citation pages online and, while you won't reduce the cost of a book by 30%, it might reduce the cost in some way, especially in low print-run works. (Oh! Don't mention Works on TAEBC. No, they don't hate Queen)

The citation racket has been used in the academic world to get funding, fair enough if that's what it takes but I see no need for it in the 'amateur' world. I use the word 'amateur' to mean we do it for love, not money, rather than poorly produced*. References, yes, but pages and pages of citations to namecheck your mates? No.

Interestingly, one publisher, in a post on the The Aviation Enthusiast's Book Club, has declared the UK aviation book business 'finished' and has said they won't be producing paper content any more (I paraphrase on both points here, please feel free to clarify if you're reading this). I find this alarming as they produce good books on interesting, and niche, subjects.

I have (long and weary again) been Cassandra-like in my forecasts of The Big Boy's Book of Aircraft in Colour being the only aircraft books available. That might just be where we are heading if quality material is only available under an Elsevier-type model as used for academic journals.

Chris

*I'll keep schtum on this matter.
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Books should remain to be stand alone self contained sources of information that do not require any access to any electronic media at all to reap their full value to the reader. For good reason nobody ever asks "Which three books and a solar powered laptop with broadband satellite internet connectivity would you bring to a deserted island?"
 
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I appreciate your point, and in an ideal world I would prefer a book including its notes. If the notes being provided electronically is the difference between a book being published or not, I will happily print the notes myself.
 
martinbayer said:
Books should remain to be stand alone self contained sources of information that do not require any access to any electronic media at all to reap their full value to the reader. For good reason nobody ever asks "Which three books and a solar powered laptop with broadband satellite internet connectivity would you bring to a deserted island?"
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Having around 2000 books, soft cover publications, etc.(does not include about 10,00 periodicals in the barn, photos, documents, etc.),I am continually amazed at the number of good quality aviation books still becoming available. Don't really care what the bindings are like, but I do appreciate good paper and high quality printing. Considering that when I really started buying books, a new Porsche could be had for $3000 (give or take) and now is about 30 times that cost. There are a lot of pretty good books in the $60 dollar range. I could not get much of a book for $2 in the old days, plus the titles and range of content were much more limited. I did spend over $100 for a recent Porsche book, but most of the aviation books are well under that and many of them have really good content. As to e-format, when I go to the mountains of Costa Rica in the winter, I take my laptop with an external hard drive with about 10K books and 9k periodicals on it. I never run out of good stuff to read. Could not do that in the old days! Inflation is real, but book supply is amazingly robust.

ArtieBoB
 
Artie Bob said:
Having around 2000 books, soft cover publications, etc.(does not include about 10,00 periodicals in the barn, photos, documents, etc.),I am continually amazed at the number of good quality aviation books still becoming available. Don't really care what the bindings are like, but I do appreciate good paper and high quality printing. Considering that when I really started buying books, a new Porsche could be had for $3000 (give or take) and now is about 30 times that cost. There are a lot of pretty good books in the $60 dollar range. I could not get much of a book for $2 in the old days, plus the titles and range of content were much more limited. I did spend over $100 for a recent Porsche book, but most of the aviation books are well under that and many of them have really good content. As to e-format, when I go to the mountains of Costa Rica in the winter, I take my laptop with an external hard drive with about 10K books and 9k periodicals on it. I never run out of good stuff to read. Could not do that in the old days! Inflation is real, but book supply is amazingly robust.

ArtieBoB
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No argument here - I am not arguing against e-books as a valid choice. What I *AM* arguing against is putting part of the information that completes a physical book, such as a list of sources, references, or websites, online *only* instead of also including it in print.
 
martinbayer said:
No argument here - I am not arguing against e-books as a valid choice. What I *AM* arguing against is putting part of the information that completes a physical book, such as a list of sources, references, or websites, online *only* instead of also including it in print.
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I agree 100%. All of the information should come in one printed book - not the book plus what's out in the ether.
 
It means I will buy fewer books but reduced font, tighter spaces and lacking reference material is out for me. Good quality print I can sit and read at my liesure rather than squinting at if I am sitting in my reading chair before bed.

I have heard all the arguments about eboooks and if it floats the boat of others, go for it. I have my own opinion and frankly being a certified old git, I will stick to what I like so, some of the companies that choose/opt for cheaper poorer quaility print on demand results, I shall not darken your door.

I understand but, when I buy something it has to be right.
 
edwest4 said:
I agree 100%. All of the information should come in one printed book - not the book plus what's out in the ether.
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We did that, put additional info out in the ether, with Overscan's P.1121 and that seemed to be well received.


My drawings, at larger size, are available for the asking which has also been mentioned for the Westland Helicopters book.

Chris
 
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1. I have never seen a book in which one could cut the page count by 30 % by eliminating notes. If the note apparatus is properly done (exploiting all "allowed" cuts like not repeating full source name every time), the notes take up a few per cent at most.

2. Assumption of "amateur readers" do not care about notes is an appalling attitude. That very attitude is directly linked to the attitude that military history books must be full of strong adjectives and witty dialogue in the name of "easy reading".

3. A small and tight font is not necessarily hard to read. On the contrary. And here lies massive possibilities to reduce page count even by over 50 %*. The above-mentioned Harpia is one worst publishers ever in this regard.

*For example, in Osprey serial books there have been examples of well over 100 % difference between word count per page. An exemplary execution is in "NVA and Viet Cong" by Ken Conboy (Elite series).
 
Anyone got hard copies of Will Ireland's Kamikaze Hunters or Pathfinders? I have them on Kindle, but wondered if the hard copies have ~29% and ~21% etc notes at the end.

Chris
 

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