SpaceX

What happened this time?
Overpressured event in lox tank
COVP rupture again
Bad welding

I bet COVP again…
 
I am not *too* surprised at this. It isn’t Atlas balloon tank–but it isn’t R-7 either.

SLS survived 260% of expected flight loads for *hours* before it split:

Why test?
www.tensilemillcnc.com

The Role of Tensile Testing for Spacecraft Structural Integrity

Discover how tensile testing guarantees spacecraft structural integrity, preventing failures in extreme conditions and guaranteeing mission safety.
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Perhaps Musk was trying to increase Starship’s payload by shaving a tad too much off the booster?

I think it was the radio program "America Asks Bruce" where I heard a story about an business owner who tried to use a decreasing number of welds on a project. That can be hazardous even for consumer grade junk---perhaps the origin of
https://www.reddit.com/r/Skookum/comments/7s4syz/a_grinder_and_paint_makes_a_welder_what_he_aint

Holding something by a top rim means no legs and less weight.

Say what you will about SLS–it isn’t limber.
NASA's Space Launch System (SLS) rocket withstood Hurricane Nicole in November 2022, as it was designed to endure strong winds up to 85 mph (74.4 knots) at the 60-foot level, with additional structural margin. Although winds at the pad reached 100 mph (160 kph) gusts, the rocket's design limits were not exceeded and its launch was only delayed by a few days. (from Gemini)

Fully laden, it is supported by two huge solids.

The shuttle ET was even more impressive, having to support the dead weight of a fully laden orbiter off to the side.

I dare Elon and his Bocans to even try to build something like that.

But this is an easy fix--
comfort-truss.com

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Them things hurt...

Mrs. Potter: What is all that stuff?

Fred Garvin: Oh, uh.. that’s my rather elaborate network of trusses. I will need your help with a couple of these. I got the old hernia truss here.. and I got a spleen truss, it opens up with a couple of snaps here in the back...

SNL Transcripts: Margot Kidder: 03/17/79: Fred Garvin, Male Prostitute - SNL Transcripts Tonight

Saturday Night Live Transcripts Season 4: Episode 15
snltranscripts.jt.org

I think mine is stout enough for five SRBs.

SuperHeavy just needs a few for its hernias.

I challenge Elon to release the psi rating Starship burst at so it can be compared with SLS.

1.4 times is less than 2.6 times flight loads as I recall basic math.
 
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publiusr said:
The shuttle ET was even more impressive, having to support the dead weight of a fully laden orbiter off to the side.
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Not really. An engineer can see that it isn't
publiusr said:
I dare Elon and his Bocans to even try to build something like that.
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Child's play.
Starship and Superbooster are harder to design and build since they have to be recovered and reused. The SLS core and Shuttle ET were disposable.
 
Sniff' Oh, the humanity--I don't see anyone about....the size of that chestburster...it ate them all. In other news, Elon is exited about space cargo, with SS/SH a perfect follow on to MD-11.

It looks like the pointy heads have learned to stop worrying about Earth cooties and love Starship:

www.nationalacademies.org

Search for Life Should Be Top Science Priority for First Human Landing on Mars, Says New Report

When astronauts set foot on Mars, it will be one of humanity’s greatest milestones, marking the start of a new era of discovery on another planet. A new National Academies report identifies the highest priority science objectives for the first human missions to Mars and says searching for...
www.nationalacademies.org www.nationalacademies.org

www.nextbigfuture.com

Brian Predicted Elon's Mars Plan One Year Before Reveal | NextBigFuture.com

Elon recently confirmed long-term plans for Mars at an xAI all-hands meeting.
www.nextbigfuture.com www.nextbigfuture.com

I wonder if anyone ever thought to have a rocket canal and flame trench be the same—rails to either side for stability?
 
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NMaude said:
It would appear that the LOX tank was over-pressurised.
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No, the main tank wasn't pressurized. After looking at both the video and daylight pictures of the aftermath, I'd bet money that it was a COPV blowing up inside a chine.
 
Tuna said:
No, the main tank wasn't pressurized. After looking at both the video and daylight pictures of the aftermath, I'd bet money that it was a COPV blowing up inside a chine.
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Wouldn't that have caved IN the main tank instead of ripping it open?
 
Sferrin said:
Wouldn't that have caved IN the main tank instead of ripping it open?
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Tuna said:
No, the main tank wasn't pressurized. After looking at both the video and daylight pictures of the aftermath, I'd bet money that it was a COPV blowing up inside a chine.
Click to expand...
It had to have some pressure. the COPV was still the much like the other times.
 
NCQ said:
This is an argument for space-based solar power rather than space datacenters.
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Beaming power down is problematic while GPUs are tiny and light, so shoot them up.

No idea what it'd take to get a receiving array built given enclosed power generation systems already gets all the NIMBYs already.
 

I would imagine that the issue of lunar dust has been factored into the hardware that SpaceX is designing. These two particular lines stood out to me:

"Updating work done in the 1960s, Metzger's calculations using data from the Apollo 16 landing, for example, suggest that the relatively small lunar lander kicked up as much as 24 tonnes of dust. That's four to 10 times what NASA's previous model estimated."

"This has enormous implications, especially as future lunar landers, like Starship, will be far larger and heavier, with correspondingly greater rocket exhaust effects than Apollo generation craft."
 
Metzger's calculations using data from the Apollo 16 landing, for example, suggest that the relatively small lunar lander kicked up as much as 24 tonnes of dust. That's four to 10 times what NASA's previous model estimated."
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Holly... cow. That one-third more than the LM weight by itself - a bit less than 16 tons. :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

By this point I wonder whether a gaseous-hydrogen thruster (cold & monopropellant) might be preferable.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_gas_thruster

Wikipedia tells me specific impulse would be 272 seconds, which by lunar gravity standards ain't too bad (of course on Earth we would say : it sucks).

So - DTAL landers with GH2 cold gas thrusters ?

Would gaseous hydrogen impacting the regolith throw a lot of dust around ? Seems to be much less of a furious blowtorch than a classic rocket engine.
 
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It´s not the temperature (although you have pyroclastic flows), it´s the velocity of the exhaust flow. The only other case is to increase the exhaust surface, something not practical with single engine/single pack (yes, distributed engine/nozzles).

Attentive readers here know already what is the most efficient solution (and read about this particular problem ages ago).
 
alberchico said:
"Updating work done in the 1960s, Metzger's calculations using data from the Apollo 16 landing, for example, suggest that the relatively small lunar lander kicked up as much as 24 tonnes of dust. That's four to 10 times what NASA's previous model estimated."
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Moon dust is horribly abrasive stuff that gets EVERYWHERE and turned out to be a major problem for the astronauts when they got to the multi-day Moon-landings especially Apollo 17.
 
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Sferrin said:
Wouldn't that have caved IN the main tank instead of ripping it open?
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It probably caved in a relatively small hole in the main tank right next to itself. There are shrapnel holes in the downcomer. Then it vented pressure into the main tank, which subsequently ripped open along the already existing hole.
 
G6Z-xFvWoAAzEiD
Detail on booster 18
 
Forest Green said:
Why space datacentres make sense:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1991891060344398306
View: https://x.com/ApoStructura/status/1991891060344398306?s=20
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The issue however is not power as much as it is heat dissipation: "Most spacecraft radiators reject between 100 and 350 W of internally generated electronics waste heat per square meter. Radiators' weight typically varies from almost nothing, if an existing structural panel is used as a radiator, to around 12 kg/m2 for a heavy deployable radiator and its support structure" from what the literature says. It would be great to see how they solve that problem. The quote is from a Wikipedia article quoting the Spacecraft Thermal Control Handbook.
 
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looking on damage interior
i see methane feed line and wondering were is LOX tank for landing ?
i'm not sure was that a separate tank in main LOX tank ?
could a overpressure event destroy that Tank, what led this disaster ?
 
TomcatViP said:
Accelerating battery charged on the moon via solar array to earth orbit and capture via Starship?
A magnetic rail (as mass accelerator) would makes sense, the way the US administration/GA initiated a research project for adapting Magnetic Catapult from GA to Lunar environment.
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i just realised
Elon Musk support Hyperloop a magnetic rail in vacuum tube.
On the moon you don't need the tube, Hyperloop would perfect as mass accelerator !

like Boring company could drill tunnels on Moon or Mars

Supported by Tesla Robots

Everything Musk support or work on, can be use for space colonisation !!!
 
Sferrin said:
So five Starship pads total. For now. I wonder if they'll put any at Vandenburg.
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While the number of pads they're building is not, itself, a guarantee that Starship will be successful, it's at least an indication that SpaceX thinks Starship has plenty of room to grow and is likely to bear fruit. If they do even half of what Musk plans, there's plenty of internal demand for launches, doing everything from Starlink, to orbital factories, lunar mining, manufacturing, and quantum computing, to Martian cities, and beyond.
 

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