Return of the Catalina?

TomS

TomS

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So, apparently the Catalina Aircraft Trust have announced a desire (I won't call it a plan) to build new production Catalinas for the civil and military markets under the name Catalina II or Next Generation Amphibious Aircraft. The new aircraft would be turboprop aircraft but would operate under the original post-war Catalina 28-5ACF commercial airworthiness certificate.

catalinaaircrafttrust.com

CATALINA AIRCRAFT

Catalina Aircraft - Providing worldwide continued airworthiness support for the PBY-5A and 28-5ACF Catalina / Canso amphibious seaplanes.
catalinaaircrafttrust.com catalinaaircrafttrust.com

The available images are not terribly clear, but it looks like they are eliminating the wing bracing struts along the way. The whole premise seems iffy to me, but that bit scares me. Those struts are there for a reason, and taking them off implies a lot more reengineering than should be covered under a 1940s airworthiness document. But perhaps someone with more experience in this realm can correct me.

1690308429236.png 1690308329775.png 1690308380375.png
 
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Hi Tom,

TomS said:
So, apparently the Catalina Aircraft Trust have announced a desire (I won't call it a plan) to build new production Catalinas for the civil and military markets under the name Catalina II or Next Generation Amphibious Aircraft. The new aircraft would be turboprop aircraft but would operate under the original post-war Catalina 28-5ACF commercial airworthiness certificate.
Click to expand...

Just looking at the quality of the presentation images, I'm not sure that project can be taken seriously.

With regard to the market for twin-turboprop amphibians, I'm afraid the sad saga of the Seastar tells us, there isn't any:

dornierseawings.com

Seastar | Dornier Seawings

dornierseawings.com dornierseawings.com

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
 
HoHun said:
With regard to the market for twin-turboprop amphibians, I'm afraid the sad saga of the Seastar tells us, there isn't any:
Click to expand...

Much different, lighter aircraft. They aren't looking at remotely the same market segment.

515 as mentioned above, however, is awfully comparable, in production, and well-liked. I'm not sure I see the market viability of a "new" design.

I'm all for more Cats flying anyway they can, so good luck to them, but I shan't hold my breath.
 
Hi Del,

_Del_ said:
Much different, lighter aircraft. They aren't looking at remotely the same market segment.
Click to expand...

Admittedly, the Seastar doesn't match the payload capacity of the Catalina, but not for all of the suggested applications the full payload of the Catalina is actually required. In those cases you're probably better off with a smaller, lighter aircraft - for example, when you're operating a sensor platform.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
 
TomS said:
but it looks like they are eliminating the wing bracing struts along the way. The whole premise seems iffy to me, but that bit scares me. Those struts are there for a reason, and taking them off implies a lot more reengineering than should be covered under a 1940s airworthiness document. But perhaps someone with more experience in this realm can correct me.
Click to expand...
Even from the point of view of being a lover of seaplanes I too wonder about that.
 
The lack of bracing is one hell of a red flag. Not that my first instinct on seeing this news was optimistic, and not that an unbraced parasol wing is out of the question, but yeah it doesn't make a great impression.

Even if they build it and it's capable, they won't be building what SOCOM wants. SOCOM wants a ramp and that's why the wacky C-130 float concept persists. They'd have a better chance selling the Sea Duck to them than a Catalina.
 
Moose said:
The lack of bracing is one hell of a red flag. Not that my first instinct on seeing this news was optimistic, and not that an unbraced parasol wing is out of the question, but yeah it doesn't make a great impression.

Even if they build it and it's capable, they won't be building what SOCOM wants. SOCOM wants a ramp and that's why the wacky C-130 float concept persists. They'd have a better chance selling the Sea Duck to them than a Catalina.
Click to expand...
Oh, hell yes. Is the Sea Duck in production now?

(said jokingly, but also kinda hopeful)
 
TomS said:
So, apparently the Catalina Aircraft Trust have announced a desire (I won't call it a plan) to build new production Catalinas for the civil and military markets under the name Catalina II or Next Generation Amphibious Aircraft. The new aircraft would be turboprop aircraft but would operate under the original post-war Catalina 28-5ACF commercial airworthiness certificate.

catalinaaircrafttrust.com

CATALINA AIRCRAFT

Catalina Aircraft - Providing worldwide continued airworthiness support for the PBY-5A and 28-5ACF Catalina / Canso amphibious seaplanes.
catalinaaircrafttrust.com catalinaaircrafttrust.com

The available images are not terribly clear, but it looks like they are eliminating the wing bracing struts along the way. The whole premise seems iffy to me, but that bit scares me. Those struts are there for a reason, and taking them off implies a lot more reengineering than should be covered under a 1940s airworthiness document. But perhaps someone with more experience in this realm can correct me.
Click to expand...
The engine swap would be relatively simple, assuming that they're using an established PT6 swap like with the Turbo Beaver/Turbo Otters. That's technically a Supplemental Type Certificate, but is relatively simple to do. I mean, technically I could do that modification to an existing Catalina, as I'm an A&P and can do the weight and balance math, I'd just need some deep pockets to buy two PT6s (or even Twinpacs!) plus props, engine mounts, cowlings, etc. I think most of that is already in most of the STC kits, which is why they're a half-mil each side.

But removing the wing braces? Yeah, that's not happening without a completely redesigned wing, and probably a redesigned center tower, too. That's a lot of work on a 1930s Type Certificate. So much so that Cessna called their unbraced version a whole different model number (177 Cardinal versus a 172)
 
Catalina are bigger. You are not going to host 30 troops in an even enlarged Albatross.

But I do not believe that a startup could match the manufacturing efficiency of North American. This plane owned its performances to an efficient light weight construction.
See how the CFRP An-2 led to nothing.
 
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Why not just build more CL-415s ? another one has just bite the dust in Greece... with global warming, we will need many, many more CL-415 ASAP.
 
"Why not just build more CL-415s ?"

Yes, given the cruel attrition, there will be a growing market for tough fire-fighting aircraft.

And per OP's Cat_II comment, if you're going to be throwing aircraft about, be-it 'just' turbulence from aggravated thermals or the stresses of fire-fighting, removing those wing-braces risks 'Dire Lord Murphy' converting aircraft to 'folding wing'...
 
Archibald said:
Why not just build more CL-415s ? another one has just bite the dust in Greece... with global warming, we will need many, many more CL-415 ASAP.
Click to expand...
Nik said:
"Why not just build more CL-415s ?"

Yes, given the cruel attrition, there will be a growing market for tough fire-fighting aircraft.

And per OP's Cat_II comment, if you're going to be throwing aircraft about, be-it 'just' turbulence from aggravated thermals or the stresses of fire-fighting, removing those wing-braces risks 'Dire Lord Murphy' converting aircraft to 'folding wing'...
Click to expand...
Like I've wrote above, they're already doing it. And it's called DHC-515.
 
Archibald said:
Why not just build more CL-415s ? another one has just bite the dust in Greece... with global warming, we will need many, many more CL-415 ASAP.
Click to expand...

That EAP scooper just lost was a piston-engined Canadair CL-215 ... which brings up another option to Mayo.Kyo's Viking DHC-515 - the CL-415EAF rebuild programme.

-- https://www.vikingair.com/cl-415eaf
 

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