Questions about two Germany competitions and projects


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26 May 2006
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the first competition, which led to developed Messerschmitt Bf.110 heavy fighter,
and the contenders were;Focke Wulf FW-57,Henschel Hs.124,Bf.110,Junkers Ju-85
and Dornier Do.29.

The Dornier Do.29 was a project of twin engined heavy fighter and medium bomber,
and I am asking,did any other projects involve in this competition ?.

also the DFS/Lippisch P.04-106 was intended to compete the BF.110.


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I'm not sure about the Junker Ju 85, which I thought was a parallel development
to the Ju 88 bomber ?
You're right about the Ju-85 Jemiba. We already talk about that design in the forum:,5027.0/highlight,ju-85.html
Concept :the Kampfzerstorer. - Twin-engined heavy fighter(1935-1939)
The specification was issued to AGO, Dornier, Focke-Wulf, Heinkel, Henschel, the Gothaer Waggonfabrik and somewhat surprisingly, to the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke.
Except above-mentioned
Arado Flugzeugwerke – Ar E-500 (1936)
-Ar E-561 (1937)
AGO Flugzeugwerke - AO 225 (1937)

Gothaer Waggonfabrik – Gotha P. 3 01 – 02 (twin-boom plane with 2x950 hp DB600, both engines disposed in centre of the fuselage, like Ar E-561)
Gotha P 8 01,
Gotha P 14 02
Gotha P 20 (all with As 410 engine)

My opinion: project Ju-85 did not participate in this competitions.
In more detail in chapter 4, page 73 “Luftwaffe secret project ground attack…” by D.Herwig & H.Rode.
“Die Deutsche Luftrustung 1933-45” Band 2 by Heinz J.Nowarra p.146


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The Dornier Do 29 was a competitor of the Hs 124 and the Ju 85.
(mittleren Bomber und Zerstörer) medium bomber and destroyer

The machine resembled the twin fin Ju 85 but with the same enigine arrangement with annular cooling
of the Do 17. Also the dimesions were close to the Do 17.
No illustration.

source : Die Deutschen Flugzeuge 1933-1945 - Kens /Nowarra-J.F.Lehmans Verlag .München 1972.
Thank you my dears,

and for the Junkers Ju-85 was involved in this competition as my source,

for the second competition which led to Ju-88,the contenders were;
Ju-88,Hs.127,Do.29,Bf.162 and Gotha P.3,and I am asking was there
any other project submitt to this contest ?.
about do-29, remember do-17Z some years later


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Please mind page 14:

Messerschmitt mentions multiple cylinder boxer engines from Kamm (Wunibald Kamm of FKFS) and Benzinger (Wolf-Dieter Bensinger of DVL). I didn`t know any engine developments from this engineers with that configuration (although FKFS developed Wilhelm Krautters`s lovely flat-fours). Bensinger was a gifted engineer at DVL but I only know about his work on rotary valves and the DVL`s H-16/32 engines.
Does anyone knows more?
The Arado Ar 500 Zerstorer project. A four man aircraft to carry out a similar role to the Me 110. It was to have had two turrets with 360 deg rotation and field of fire and the guns in the upper turret could be raised a full 90 deg to fire vertically. It could carry a bomb load behind the turrets. The project originates from 1935 and got to the full scale mock up stage. Interestingly the last 3 drawings are dated 1942 and show 2 distinctly different layouts. ar-500 (2).jpg ar-500+ (2).jpg
Daimler-Benz D.B.603
Hmmm. I asked because of the large air inlets above and below the propeller spinners. The installation looks like rather like that of the Napier-Halford Dagger air-cooled engine.
Johnbr wrote:

Interestingly the last 3 drawings are dated 1942 and show 2 distinctly different layouts.

John, which last 3 drawings were you refering exactly?
Although the drawings come from a 1942 report, the report itself is a retrospective about Arado's work on turrets over the preceding decade. The report begins with drawings from the early 1930s and progresses through to the present day (Feb '42) with the most 'recent' drawings showing the remote-controlled turrets of the Ar 240.

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