Polikarpov I-180 impact on Soviet fighter production

Lascaris

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So let's assume that I-180 is a bit luckier in its early stages Chkalov does not crashes his prototype and I-180 replaces I-16 in the production lines after 1941. How does this affect Soviet fighter development and production choices after the war has begun? The Yak series of fighters seems to me that it should be unaffected given its use of liquid cooled engines. But the follow up I-185, La-5 and MiG I-211 all used the Ash-82. Discounting the MiG it would seem that I-185 and La-5 are directly antagonistic, while both are already in production. So do we see Lavochkin failing to enter production in favor of I-185? Or is production actually split between the two with the Gorki factory which was initially producing I-16s and the I-180 switching over to I-185 and La-5 still produced at Tbilisi in place of the LaGG-3?

Thoughts?
 

lancer21

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Very interesting scenario, i actually pondered the I-180 production myself. If they are really focused on getting it in production i would think it should be in full scale production in 1940, with a few thousands of them available by Barbarossa. I'm a bit confused as to the performance of this machine but it seems to be almost equal to a Bf-109E? So things are more difficult for the germans and their allies with several thousands I-180s produced in 1940-1942. IMO the best thing they could do is not only replacing I-16 production with I-180 as soon as possible but also the obsolete I-153! Even better, ditch any Polikarpov fighter biplanes in favour of the I-17 a soon as that is ready, but we diverge into a different ATL now.

As to the I-185, as i understand it's performance is a bit better than the contemporary La-5, so again, the germans will suffer more? Also some later-war I-185 derivatives had excellent performance figures which seem to be quite a bit higher that contemporaray Lavochkins. I don't know what happens with the Lavochkins in this scenario too, would they continue to be inline engined, are there enough M-105 engines around for both Las and Yaks, or maybe they get removed from production like MiG-3? I don't know how this will affects Lavochkin's fortunes later-war and post-war, MiG despite having their MiG-3 taken out of production, persevered with various prototypes during the war, eventually achieving a monopoly in fighter design in USSR and some world class designs for the next half century.
 

tomo pauk

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So let's assume that I-180 is a bit luckier in its early stages Chkalov does not crashes his prototype and I-180 replaces I-16 in the production lines after 1941. How does this affect Soviet fighter development and production choices after the war has begun? The Yak series of fighters seems to me that it should be unaffected given its use of liquid cooled engines. But the follow up I-185, La-5 and MiG I-211 all used the Ash-82. Discounting the MiG it would seem that I-185 and La-5 are directly antagonistic, while both are already in production. So do we see Lavochkin failing to enter production in favor of I-185? Or is production actually split between the two with the Gorki factory which was initially producing I-16s and the I-180 switching over to I-185 and La-5 still produced at Tbilisi in place of the LaGG-3?

Thoughts?

Is only the I-180 in production, or also the I-185?
 

Lascaris

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As to the I-185, as i understand it's performance is a bit better than the contemporary La-5, so again, the germans will suffer more? Also some later-war I-185 derivatives had excellent performance figures which seem to be quite a bit higher that contemporaray Lavochkins. I don't know what happens with the Lavochkins in this scenario too, would they continue to be inline engined, are there enough M-105 engines around for both Las and Yaks, or maybe they get removed from production like MiG-3? I don't know how this will affects Lavochkin's fortunes later-war and post-war, MiG despite having their MiG-3 taken out of production, persevered with various prototypes during the war, eventually achieving a monopoly in fighter design in USSR and some world class designs for the next half century.
Mikoyan aside from his undeniable capabilities also happened to have his brother in the central committee. Lavochkin... did not. On the other hand he noticed early the impact of missiles and uav so he likely still carves a niche there...
 
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