MiG-29 Avionics

LukaszK

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If you manage to use Google translate that is definitely better. My experience with translation of the whole document was moderate. But this is for sure faster.
 

LukaszK

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Great results Overscan!
One remark according to page I put link, (Maybe it is obvious, If yes - sorry for such low level of remark ;-) )
It is possible to download ppt file . In preview of file on that page - formatting of all diagrams in ppt is not correct.
Personally I download all content of those lectures B)
 

stealthflanker

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Interesting. so the N019 has 6.5 kW instead of 4 kW of peak power. and 960 doppler filters. It also interesting to see the detection and tracking criteria being related to probability (detection is 0.5/50% while tracking is 90%)

Great find LukaszK and nice translation Overscan.
 

overscan

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Yes, I'm using the PPT version. I will upload the PPT version if you want to correct it :)

Having done machine translation before on this very subject, I know some of the trickier terms and can tidy up the translation somewhat.
 

Zeka_Peka

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Hi there,

I have some dumb situation to solve.

I come from another forum. We debate the performance of MiG-29 radar. I am generally satisfied with the level of understanding several other members debating this issue display, and yes, we have the manual. Back in my days I had no problem with the manual, yes it demands some knowledge prior to reading, but nothing too demanding.

Currently we are having an exchange with some troll, who claims that MiG-29 radar after launching R-27R performs both scanning (search) of airspace for other targets while guiding R-27R on attacked one. As crazy as it sounds, but picture this - manual never says explicitly that radar lock have to be maintained until missile impact and that while that lock is maintained all other targets disappear (writers believe we already know that). Further manual is rather liberal in using terms such as "lock", tracking, automatic tracking, etc and *very liberal* in using word "regime" (eng. "mod") they describe a wide array of terms from real, selectable mods like "V" or "D" to some sub operations which system performs "behind the scene" i.e. invisible to the pilot and not shown anywhere like "mod" DNP. Add to this a host of people who are unsure what to believe and it is a perfect stage for an ambitious troll to do all kinds of logical and linguistic aerobatics. At one moment he used some data from "overscan's" avionics to support his claims which led me here.

I know the first thing you might say is that we are on poorly moderated forum - no doubts about that. I am sure "our" troll wouldn't last 24h here.

However things are, as they are, so I ask if there's any assistance you are able to provide? If not, a clear statement from Paul (Overscan) that such thing is impossible could also be of some help.

We have mostly used as "ammunition" "HUD" pictures from the manual and also "HUD" shots from some youtube videos. Cretin stated that HUD and HDD (IPV) show different pictures i.e. (while target is locked on HUD, radar searches on HDD :-X ;D :eek:)

Thanks
 

overscan

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It can't be done.

The technical training documents posted on the last page (https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=102.0;attach=598409) clearly distinguish between:

1) Finding, detecting and determining the coordinates of targets, maintenance "on the pass" up to 10 targets with the continuation of air space search.
2) Continuous tracking of one target with accurate measurement of its coordinates without overview of the air space.
3) Discrete-continuous illumination of the attacked target with the formation and transmission of radio correction commands.

When you engage tracking mode, you designate the target (or it is autoselected for you), then the radar stops scanning for targets, and focuses purely on the single target. The "on-the-pass" mode simply doesn't give enough detail quickly enough to accurately calculate launch parameters or formulate course correction commands for the R-27R missile.

Now, it's possible that the Ts100 processor could continue predict the other, non-tracked targets motion based on the last known direction and speed, but again the accuracy of these measurements in "on-the-pass" mode is quite low so it would probably not be terribly accurate. The only way to 100% disprove this would be testimony of a MiG-29 pilot or a video showing the radar in operation. I don't think it's likely - I would expect tracking the target gives it quite enough to do for such a relatively crude computer.
 

overscan

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[list type=decimal]
[*]Search, Detection, rough measurement of coordinates and determining the nationality of air targets during the inspection airspace.
[*]Support "on the pass" (SNP) to 10 targets, their ranking on the predicted time of meeting with the target, the issuance of recommendations for selecting the target for the attack.
[*]Tracking of one attacked target with precise definition of coordinates, aiming for her impression, targeting the heads of missiles and preparing them for launch.
[*]Calculation of the launch zone , the issuance of a command to start, illuminating the target, formation and transmission of radio correction commands.
[*]Exit the attack.
[/list]
 

overscan

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Maximum error in target range measurement in SNP mode: ≤4 km.
Maximum error in measurement of range with tracking in DRB mode ≤0.2 km
Maximum error in measurement of range in BMB (close combat mode) ≤0.05 km.
Maximum error in measurement of speed when tracked in DRB and BMB modes ≤ 10 m / s.
Maximum error in determination of direction when tracked in DRB and BMB modes ≤0.25 °
 

overscan

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- an overview of the airspace for the search and identification of air targets, the rough definition of their coordinates and parameters of motion and the establishment of state affiliation with the help of an airplane radar requestor;

- escort of the target chosen for attacking the target in range, direction (monopulse method) and speed with an accuracy that is sufficient for aiming and targeting conjugated systems;

- illumination of the target and the transfer of commands for radar correction to missiles from the CSG.

Additional modes:

- Accompanying the method "on the passage" of several identified goals.

- transition from airspace survey to target tracking with DRB;

- Accelerated search and target identification, targeting target channels in the BMB (VERTICAL mode).
 

Zeka_Peka

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Thanks :)

SNP - the closest English equivalent is "escort while pass" - it gives rough position (up to 4 km error as you have said), but deals with closure dynamics - ie: If you have A-10 flying towards you at 500km/h at the distance of 22km and 5km after it B-1B flying at 1020km/h, system shall conclude B-1B shall "surpass" A-10 and shall recommend B-1B for locking up.

"Now, it's possible that the Ts100 processor could continue predict the other, non-tracked targets motion based on the last known direction and speed"

That's the feature of the Foxhunter, I would love very much if you can re-upload mode photos on its page.

:)
 
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