Lockheed Martin AGM-179 JAGM

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AeroFranz said:
I've ben reading in various places that JAGM weighs 100 lbs, and in other selected places 115 lbs (see below link).
I'm inclined to believe the latter, and assume that 100 lbs is either a round or 'Hellfire-legacy' number. Can anyone confirm?
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2000w_q95.jpg


www.dvidshub.net

JAGM Test '21

U.S. Marines with Marine Operational Test and Evaluation Squadron 1 (VMX-1) load a joint air-to-ground missile (JAGM) onto an AH-1Z Viper during an operational test at Marine Corps Air Station Yuma, Arizona, Dec. 6, 2021. VMX-1 fired and evaluated the JAGM to determine its suitability and...
www.dvidshub.net www.dvidshub.net
 
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AeroFranz said:
I've ben reading in various places that JAGM weighs 100 lbs, and in other selected places 115 lbs (see below link).

Weapon Systems Handbook 2020-2021 - U.S. Army​


I'm inclined to believe the latter, and assume that 100 lbs is either a round or 'Hellfire-legacy' number. Can anyone confirm?
On a more practical level, is there a weight limit that two servicemen can lift, since Hellfire (and i can only assume JAGM) is manually loaded?
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Sidewinder and AIM-120 are manually loaded as well. (Don't trip. :eek: )

131010-F-XB934-043.jpg

aim-120-amraam-001.jpg
 
I believe that JAGM is to go on the same racks as Hellfire. If that is true it would support the notion that the JAGM cannot be vastly different in parameters (weight & size) to the Hellfire.
 
AN/AWW-14(V) said:
AeroFranz said:
I've ben reading in various places that JAGM weighs 100 lbs, and in other selected places 115 lbs (see below link).
I'm inclined to believe the latter, and assume that 100 lbs is either a round or 'Hellfire-legacy' number. Can anyone confirm?
Click to expand...

2000w_q95.jpg


www.dvidshub.net

JAGM Test '21

U.S. Marines with Marine Operational Test and Evaluation Squadron 1 (VMX-1) load a joint air-to-ground missile (JAGM) onto an AH-1Z Viper during an operational test at Marine Corps Air Station Yuma, Arizona, Dec. 6, 2021. VMX-1 fired and evaluated the JAGM to determine its suitability and...
www.dvidshub.net www.dvidshub.net
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@AN/AWW-14(V) Awesome - thank you for finding this!
 
Not yet. Although it may be virtually dead as I do not believe any meaningful orders have been placed.
 
Jimmo952 said:
yasotay said:
Not yet. Although it may be virtually dead as I do not believe any meaningful orders have been placed.
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The program was canceled, restructured, and brought back to life.

I believe the US Military has placed orders and the missile is in low rate production.
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Are they buying the JAGM(F) for their fixed wings or the standard JAGM (a.k.a. AGM-114 replacement) that are used by the AH-1Z? I think they are different, as in I am not sure the "F" model is compatible with the AH-1Z.

@jsport - not familiar with SPEAR3. Link?
 
yasotay said:
Jimmo952 said:
yasotay said:
Not yet. Although it may be virtually dead as I do not believe any meaningful orders have been placed.
Click to expand...

The program was canceled, restructured, and brought back to life.

I believe the US Military has placed orders and the missile is in low rate production.
Click to expand...
Are they buying the JAGM(F) for their fixed wings or the standard JAGM (a.k.a. AGM-114 replacement) that are used by the AH-1Z? I think they are different, as in I am not sure the "F" model is compatible with the AH-1Z.

@jsport - not familiar with SPEAR3. Link?
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Initially, they are looking at helicopters (Army and Marines) and UAVs.

They are looking to do the spiral development thing with this missile.

The first iteration is using the Hellfire's rocket motor.

Extending the range is supposed to be addressed in the next iteration.

Eventually, the missile is still slated to integrated with the F35 Block 4.

Supposedly, the military is happy with the seeker but really wants a longer range than the first increment provides.
 
I can tell you that the (current) range of the JAGM is not satisfactory from a helo perspective.

The parameters above for the "F" model are misleading. A JAGM (initial) coming off a fighter at ~300 knots at ~20K feet will go 15km, likely. Coming off a hovering or ~100 knot helo, at ~50/100 feet, not so much.
 
yasotay said:
I can tell you that the (current) range of the JAGM is not satisfactory from a helo perspective.

The parameters above for the "F" model are misleading. A JAGM (initial) coming off a fighter at ~300 knots at ~20K feet will go 15km, likely. Coming off a hovering or ~100 knot helo, at ~50/100 feet, not so much.
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True. Increment 1 is really Hellfire with a better seeker. As far as I know, this is what the US Army and Marines are currently buying.

Increment 2 is supposed to address range.
 
yasotay said:
Ronny said:
TomS said:
yasotay said:
not familiar with SPEAR3. Link?
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Basically the UK equivalent to Small Diameter Bomb, with a seeker incorporating a lot of Brimstone DNA.

en.m.wikipedia.org

SPEAR 3 - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org
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And also an engine for better speed/range and much less dependence on altitude.
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Any idea if it has been tested on an Apache? Would be interesting to see what the range is if shot slow/low.
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I don't think it's flown guided at all yet.
Typhoon test launches.got.pushed to 2023.
 
www.lockheedmartin.com

JAGM-MR: The Future of JAGM

With Lockheed Martin’s focus on 21st century security and helping our customers stay ahead of ready, it is important that we develop and deliver mission-focused defense capabilities by innovating with agility, urgency and affordability as we continue to build upon and strengthen our core product...
www.lockheedmartin.com www.lockheedmartin.com
 
Looks like the JAGM-Medium Range variant was flight tested in November and achieved 16km range when ground launched -

On November 16, Lockheed Martin Missiles and Fire Control successfully conducted a 16 km flight test for the Joint Air-to-Ground Missile-Medium Range (JAGM-MR) at Naval Air Weapons Station China Lake. This successful flight test demonstrated JAGM-MR’s increased range, tri-mode seeker incorporating a near infrared (NIR) sensor and an electromechanical control actuation system (EMCAS).

“As the customer’s needs evolve, we look to develop a product that puts us on a roadmap to proactively meeting those needs by being the best option when they are looking for a solution,” says Joey Drake, program management director of Air-to-Ground Missile Systems at Lockheed Martin Missiles and Fire Control.

Our U.S. Army customer’s current munitions lack the range needed to defeat near-peer adversary threat systems so they’ve identified reach, lethality, survivability and platform commonality as key priorities as they explore solutions to address this gap. These were the main drivers behind the JAGM-MR Internal Research and Development (IRAD) program.

The JAGM-MR team has spent the last couple years taking this from a trade study to a flight test. The hard work and collaboration of the JAGM-MR team is what has driven the planned product improvement project to a potential turnkey solution for the government and future end users.
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The successful execution of the JAGM-MR flight test demonstrated the 16 km range capability of the missile when ground launched — doubling the range of what the current JAGM system can reach. The extended range is a crucial benefit for the customer when it comes to allowing them to engage in missions they would not have previously been able to because of the current 8 km range limit of JAGM.
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www.lockheedmartin.com

JAGM-MR: The Future of JAGM

With Lockheed Martin’s focus on 21st century security and helping our customers stay ahead of ready, it is important that we develop and deliver mission-focused defense capabilities by innovating with agility, urgency and affordability as we continue to build upon and strengthen our core product...
www.lockheedmartin.com www.lockheedmartin.com
 
Is JAGM-MR is the same size as the original JAGM, or is it stretched? I think it's the same, which suggests they are doing something really weird with the trajectory. It has to go very high and then glide out to see that kind of range enhancement. I'd expect then to see a mode select for direct-fire when speed is more important than range.
 
FighterJock said:
yasotay said:
One wonders what the range might be coming off an F/A-18 @ ~ 300 knots/15,000
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Longer ranged than the F/A-18s current missile the Maverick I would assume yasotay, which would be better for the safety for the launch aircraft I would think.
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I agree, and you ought to have more stowed weapons per rack (3?). If I remember correctly a AGM-114 could go over 20Km coming off an F/A-18 at altitude and combat speed. So 40Km ?
 
yasotay said:
FighterJock said:
yasotay said:
One wonders what the range might be coming off an F/A-18 @ ~ 300 knots/15,000
Click to expand...

Longer ranged than the F/A-18s current missile the Maverick I would assume yasotay, which would be better for the safety for the launch aircraft I would think.
Click to expand...
I agree, and you ought to have more stowed weapons per rack (3?). If I remember correctly a AGM-114 could go over 20Km coming off an F/A-18 at altitude and combat speed. So 40Km ?
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I didn’t know AGM-114 could be lauched from F-18? Are you sure
 
TomS said:
Is JAGM-MR is the same size as the original JAGM, or is it stretched? I think it's the same, which suggests they are doing something really weird with the trajectory. It has to go very high and then glide out to see that kind of range enhancement. I'd expect then to see a mode select for direct-fire when speed is more important than range.
Click to expand...
bring_it_on said:
One would think there is at least some modification/enhancement to the motor to get this type of a range increase, especially given Lockheed's statement that it achieved 16 km when ground launched. If it can get that sort of performance increase, it would also make a pretty handy Counter UAS interceptor for the Army's Enduring Shield (IFPC Inc. 2) launcher.
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It seems like the program management decided to jump the Increment 2 version development and go straight to the Increment 3. Some sources claim that the new JAGM-MR also has a tri-mode seeker, ie CCD added, just like the previous plans for the Inc. 3 development. Under that assumption, it would be safe to expect that the MR is of same/similar demensions with improved motor and guidance algorithm. In terms of C-UAS (well it depends on size, altitude and speed, really), that's more of M-SHORAD Inc. 3's job. That thing will come in at mid-late 2020s.
 
That "sources" is the missile manufacturer. See the link to the Lockheed Martin page in my earlier post.
 
Ronny said:
yasotay said:
FighterJock said:
yasotay said:
One wonders what the range might be coming off an F/A-18 @ ~ 300 knots/15,000
Click to expand...

Longer ranged than the F/A-18s current missile the Maverick I would assume yasotay, which would be better for the safety for the launch aircraft I would think.
Click to expand...
I agree, and you ought to have more stowed weapons per rack (3?). If I remember correctly a AGM-114 could go over 20Km coming off an F/A-18 at altitude and combat speed. So 40Km ?
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I didn’t know AGM-114 could be lauched from F-18? Are you sure
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I should clarify. No, AGM-114 to my knowledge was never fitted to the F/A-18. The USMC had planned to do that but for whatever reason it was not completed, I think. I remember a briefing a number of years ago where USMC briefed the anticipated capability of AGM-114 coming off F/A-18.
 
bring_it_on said:
One would think there is at least some modification/enhancement to the motor to get this type of a range increase, especially given Lockheed's statement that it achieved 16 km when ground launched. If it can get that sort of performance increase, it would also make a pretty handy Counter UAS interceptor for the Army's Enduring Shield (IFPC Inc. 2) launcher.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1610020934756495360
View: https://twitter.com/ApacheCantFly/status/1610020934756495360
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TomS said:
Is JAGM-MR is the same size as the original JAGM, or is it stretched? I think it's the same, which suggests they are doing something really weird with the trajectory. It has to go very high and then glide out to see that kind of range enhancement. I'd expect then to see a mode select for direct-fire when speed is more important than range.
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Jane's report: JAGM-MR a few kilos heavier than the JAGM original.
 
yasotay said:
I should clarify. No, AGM-114 to my knowledge was never fitted to the F/A-18. The USMC had planned to do that but for whatever reason it was not completed, I think. I remember a briefing a number of years ago where USMC briefed the anticipated capability of AGM-114 coming off F/A-18.
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The Marines had some really interesting fights over who would get Hellfire. It goes back as far as Desert Storm, when the OV-10Ds were all set to fly CAS/BAI with Hellfire, but the AH-1 community held the entire (small) existing inventory hostage.
 
The designation of JAGM MR begs the question of will there be an LR or XR version at some point?
 

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