Boeing 6th Gen Navy Fighter - F/A-XX

@quellish has stated repeatedly that USAF was very impressed with the Boeing demonstrator(s). They seem to have won on the merits. They also have been self funding a lot of infrastructure to support these projects. They may screw it up as they have many of their military projects recently, but they seem to have the superior designs and a superior ability to produce them.
 
Josh_TN said:
@quellish has stated repeatedly that USAF was very impressed with the Boeing demonstrator(s). They seem to have won on the merits. They also have been self funding a lot of infrastructure to support these projects. They may screw it up as they have many of their military projects recently, but they seem to have the superior designs and a superior ability to produce them.
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I'd prefer they have as little screw ups as possible, I mean, there could be a few here and there which can be solved through trial and error during the EMD process (And I'm pretty sure they would have done that all those years ago even before getting the EMD contract). It would be also more reassuring since Boeing has competent aircraft builders in both Phantom Works and any long-time employees that they have that were from McDonnell-Douglas. I just hope that they, as the memers would say "lock in" and "cook" this time around. But again as I said, we just have to wait and see how it goes, especially in 2028.
 
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Reddington777 said:
The preference for Boeing for the F-47 was reported as early as 2023. Not sure what lobbying or Trump bribing could have done at that point. That preference did not change even throughout the NGAD review. So as much as some of you want to believe its all lies and conspiracies....
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To clarify, that's what I had thought WAY back a few years ago (You can see my chats arguing on behalf of LM in the NGAD thread, assuming it's still there). Now, I believe that Boeing can make it happen, since now I know that they have the background and experience to do so, given their own share of X-Plane projects, as well as carrier aviation projects. Now, if any lobbying or political preferences were present, I don't know (And it seems to not be the case), but either way, it seems to have been a good decision in the long run on so many levels, and as long as the US gets to actually field a Sixth Generation fighter first, and not any of its adversaries, that would be fine with me.
 
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I would call tailless an attribute but not a requirement! But how would we know they have superior cooling?
 
lancer21 said:
J-36 and J-50.
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Like Sferrin said, they are not fielded. By "Fielded", I mean production versions, not prototypes or demonstrators, and the J-36 and J-50s we saw since December 2024 are either the former or the latter, not production versions

In the Demnstrators department, the US has already beaten the Chinese years ago, as early as 2019. It's just that unlike the Chinese who proudly show off their demonstrators the moment they fly, the US prefers to keep things under wraps and just leave enough public announcements to acknowledge its existence without revealing too much.

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FlyGuy369 said:
What defines 6th gen?
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Pretty sure there are many answers to that question, with some hitting the mark, and others missing it, but based on what I know, Sixth-Generation is a term that's mostly used for Marketing, and many other groups would contest that definition too, but usually, what would define Sixth-Generation (At least, according to the requirements of various Sixth-Generation Fighter programs) is:
-Advanced Stealth capabilities
-Open Architecture Systems
-Being the centerpiece of programs that would include Collaborative Combat Aircraft
-Are meant to be quarterbacks with said CCAs doing the more frontline work
-Has advanced avionics and sensors that enables it to be part of a Kill-Web or theater-wide integration of data-linked systems that would enable Data-Informed Decision Making (DIDM)

I could be wrong on that, and I could also be missing out on some other features, I would have included "Advanced Engines that are variable in design", but apparently, the F/A-XX is not gonna have those, so it's probably not something that defines Sixth-Generation Fighter development, at least for the F/A-XX.
 
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Sferrin said:
Here we go again. :rolleyes:
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Well, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I'm all ears. I just remember that someone here said that in this forum a few years ago on the NGAD thread, and it seemed to be accurate for the time, so I took their word for it.
 
Enhanced LO across the EMS, prodigious power/cooling for sci-if EMSO & serious onboard compute, can manage a swarm of uncrewed AVs to achieve effects in novel ways, plus unconventional planforms with innovative control effectors would be my answer in the conversational sense of “what’s a 6th gen fighter?”.

My short answer would be anything that comes after this current era as exemplified by F-35/J-36/KF-21/Kaan/Su-57.

But yes lazy marketing especially by defense firms is just gross.
 
Reddington777 said:
The preference for Boeing for the F-47 was reported as early as 2023.
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I remember reading that here. It also made sense from an industrial policy POV. LockMart being eyeballs deep in F-35block4, NG being occupied with designing and testing B-21. But Boeing is wrapping up Super Bug production, let alone the new buildings.



Josh_TN said:
@quellish has stated repeatedly that USAF was very impressed with the Boeing demonstrator(s). They seem to have won on the merits. They also have been self funding a lot of infrastructure to support these projects. They may screw it up as they have many of their military projects recently, but they seem to have the superior designs and a superior ability to produce them.
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What has really surprised me was Boeing winning the FAXX contract. Balancing the industrial base would have suggested NG having a very large advantage for FAXX.

The Boeing design must be absolutely mindblowing to outweigh the politics.
 
Perhaps there was institutional memory at Boeing/McD of ATF and JSF and what happens when you don’t outshine your competition that they applied in their AII-X demo.

And as for F/A-XX I still think DIB capacity concerns was a critical consideration for the USG - risk/benefit and the real timelines for NG to stand-up volume capacity vs the risk/benefit that came with Boeing having both (among other DIB capacity issues that are pretty bad).
 
La-Fuente Technologies said:
Like Sferrin said, they are not fielded. By "Fielded", I mean production versions, not prototypes or demonstrators, and the J-36 and J-50s we saw since December 2024 are either the former or the latter, not production versions

In the Demnstrators department, the US has already beaten the Chinese years ago, as early as 2019. It's just that unlike the Chinese who proudly show off their demonstrators the moment they fly, the US prefers to keep things under wraps and just leave enough public announcements to acknowledge its existence without revealing too much.

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I think it is extremely hard to argue against the fact that the PRC is ahead in 6th generation development. They have prototypes; the U.S. has demonstrators. It is interesting that both sides are skipping full engine development to field these designs - China decided to use three engines rather than develop a two engine solution; the U.S. opted for F110 (most likely) for both its aircraft with one of them on a path to a future upgrade when available.
 

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