Bell "Venus Project"

Antonio

Antonio

Moderator
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
22 January 2006
Messages
4,216
Reaction score
2,018
Just finishing "The Jet Race and the Second World War" by Sterling Michael Pavelec. I enjoyed the story very much and I've learnt a lot.

http://www.amazon.com/Jet-Race-Second-World-War/dp/1591146666/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277485918&sr=1-1


On page 137 I found a great surprise: Bell "Venus Project"

I've attached the description published in the book to ask members for more info about Army Air Forces specifications R-1800-E, rival designs if existed and Bell Venus drawings

Thanks in advance

Antonio
 

Attachments

  • Bell Project Venus.jpg
    Bell Project Venus.jpg
    470.6 KB · Views: 824
Wow. This comes as a complete surprise to me. Seems like we have here a potent new contender for Bell's unknown "Model 31" slot... unless of course the "Venus" was strictly a "D-something". Thanks for sharing!
 
Stargazer2006 said:
Wow. This comes as a complete surprise to me. Seems like we have here a potent new contender for Bell's unknown "Model 31" slot... unless of course the "Venus" was strictly a "D-something". Thanks for sharing!
Click to expand...
Could it be that Bell Model 31 was in contention with the Curtiss XA-43 which became the Curtiss XF-87?

Steve Pace
 
Might it be possible to see what the two footnotes (56 and 57) look like?
 
Might it be possible to see what the two footnotes (56 and 57) look like?
Click to expand...

Ups, I didn't noticed that notes in my reading. And that's important:


Chapter 6. Notes. (Pg 209 and 210)

55. Bell Aircraft Museum, "Venus Project" documents, unmarked box, dated March 10, 1945.

56. "Venus Project" p.3.

57. Literally!. I found this proposal in an unmarked box at the Bell Aircraft Museum, Mentone, Indiana;...The proposal was dated March 10, 1945 and an accompanying note stated that "Bell [Georgia Division] was advised unofficially by Wright Field that we had won the competition. Award was refused by Larry Bell at a meeting in Marietta!". The Army...ultimately cancelled tha contract on Setember 13, 1945. Only a wind tunnel test model was constructed.


Mr Sterling Michael Pavelec teaches airpower history at the School of Advanced Air and Space Studies, Maxwell AFB, Alabama. If anybody knows him we possibly could learn more about this unknown project.


PD: Please let me recommed again the book "The Jet Race and the Second World War" because I found it exciting and fascinating.
 
Awesome!!! Thank you so much for this!
 
Orionblamblam...I made a request for additional information, but haven't heard anything back yet. I'll post something as soon as I know.

From the basic configuration it reminds me of the XB-48 (minus the swept wings and one piece nacelle).
 

Attachments

  • MartinXB48.jpg
    MartinXB48.jpg
    13.8 KB · Views: 566
More like the Curtiss XF-87 to me... Except for the sweptback flying surfaces of course.
 
Many thanks Dynoman!

and also thanks to Mr Whetston at Bell Museum for sharing this treasure.

A truly awesome design representative of the early designs at Bell. Is that me or it looks to be an swept-wing design?. The engine arrangement suggest to me axial turbojets, probably Allison J35. Any idea about powerplant?

I'll wait for that additional info
 
Thanks again to Tim Whetstone, he has provided us with some additional photos and documents below:
 

Attachments

  • Venus Project Thrust.jpg
    Venus Project Thrust.jpg
    623 KB · Views: 224
  • Venus Project notes.jpg
    Venus Project notes.jpg
    103.1 KB · Views: 249
  • Venus Project Funds.jpg
    Venus Project Funds.jpg
    544.6 KB · Views: 292
  • Venus Project A6417.jpg
    Venus Project A6417.jpg
    222.4 KB · Views: 271
  • Venus Project 35573.jpg
    Venus Project 35573.jpg
    157.5 KB · Views: 226
  • Venus Project 25536.jpg
    Venus Project 25536.jpg
    162.3 KB · Views: 247
  • Venus Project 25534.jpg
    Venus Project 25534.jpg
    215 KB · Views: 581
  • Venus Project 25533.jpg
    Venus Project 25533.jpg
    266.4 KB · Views: 578
Amazing stuff. You've gotta love the Venus! The fact that so much material can remain about such a secret and early program gives me hope that there may be more similar gems still hiding somewhere out there...

One thing bugs me here though: the funds breakdown for Contract W33-038 ac-6636 includes the following: "Plus necessary allotment to complete Project MX-674...". Now the latter was the VB-13 Tarzon, a 12,000 lb. controllable bomb (also designated as YASM-A-1 / YASM-A-1A).

How could funds for such a different program be allocated within the frame of this contract? I would appreciate any clue.
 
I played with the artist concept a bit...

SP
 

Attachments

  • Bell Venus Project.jpg
    Bell Venus Project.jpg
    695.6 KB · Views: 262
Could it be that the Bell Project Venus program was the competition won by the Martin XB-51 "Panther"?

SP
 
I think it's quite well documented that monies for different secret projects were hidden in the budgets of other, less secret projects.
 
edwest said:
I think it's quite well documented that monies for different secret projects were hidden in the budgets of other, less secret projects.
Click to expand...

Is it?
 
Picture of the plane showed up on FB, so I searched this forum for more details.

16x forward .50cals (or 8x .60cals) for the ground attack version!

Stargazer2006 said:
Amazing stuff. You've gotta love the Venus! The fact that so much material can remain about such a secret and early program gives me hope that there may be more similar gems still hiding somewhere out there...

One thing bugs me here though: the funds breakdown for Contract W33-038 ac-6636 includes the following: "Plus necessary allotment to complete Project MX-674...". Now the latter was the VB-13 Tarzon, a 12,000 lb. controllable bomb (also designated as YASM-A-1 / YASM-A-1A).

How could funds for such a different program be allocated within the frame of this contract? I would appreciate any clue.
Click to expand...
Bomber variant of the Venus intended to drop the Tarzon. So there's some aircraft interfaces to be designed.

Plus it helps keep the MX-674 from going over budget.

The effort is called "Creative Accounting", where you see what programs are benefited by a given project and by roughly how much, then assign budget monies accordingly.
 
Antonio said:
….. PD: Please let me recommed again the book "The Jet Race and the Second World War" because I found it exciting and fascinating.
Click to expand...
The book must be out of print because Amazon is asking $189.
Indigo is asking $89.
Thrift Books are asking $78.
 
I am surprised that the aerodynamic descriptif of the configuration in the secret doc does not mention the swept wing*. That in March 1945 (Overcast hadn't happened yet).

*but then the reproduction quality is fairly low.
 
There was an entry in American Secret Projects: Bombers, Attack and Anti-Submarine Aircraft 1945 to 1974, which does mention this on page 70-71

Bell Georgia Division's Venus high-speed, low-altitude, swept-wing attack aircraft was also prepared against the 10 March 1945 Design Directive. This stated both attack and bomber versions, a desired speed of 600 mph (965 km/h) at sea level (500 mph/805 km/h was the minimum acceptable), service ceiling of 30,000 ft (9,144 m) (acceptable minimum 25,000 ft/7,620 m), a defensive turret with two 0.50 in (12.7 mm) machine guns and combinations of bomb loads up to 6,000lb (2,722kg). There was to be an interchangeability between fuel and bombs and provision was also to be made for one 12,000 lb (5,443 kg) Tallboy bomb. The offensive guns were to comprise no fewer than sixteen forward-firing 0.50 in (12.7 mm) machine guns, although other types could be used and in its proposal Bell offered an alternative with eight forward-firing 0.60 in (15.2 mm) guns. The design gross weight figure was to include twelve 500 lb (227 kg) bombs carried internally and the dive speed limit was to be 110% of the maximum Mach number attained in level flight.

...Bell Received a contract to proced with further development of its design in three different forms, two attack types with the different nose gun arrangements and a pure bomber. The 'attacker's' crew would comprise the pilot, co-pilot and tail gunner, while the bomber version would add a bombardier-navigator in the nose. Venus's four TG-180 (J35) jet engines were to be housed in two streamlined nacelles underneath the wing, the attack versions both carried 4,600 gal US (17,413 lit) of fuel for a range of 2,800 miles (4,505 km), and the bomber 3,980 gal (15,066 lit) for a range of 2,400 miles (3,862 km). Gross weight for the 0.50 in (12.7 mm) nose gun version was 66,661 lb (30,237 kg), for the 0.60 in (15.2 mm) gun version 66,386 lb (30,113 kg), and for the bomber 63,029 lb (28,590 kg). It is understood that the Venus's maximum speed was in the 500 mph (805 km/h) range (560 mph/901 km/h with more powerful engines), the ceiling when carrying a full load was 26,520 ft (8,001 m) and there wrere potential problems with controllability when flying at high speed and low level.

...A handwritten note in the surviving documents (in ballpoint pen, so not written at the time) states that Bell was 'advised unofficially that it had won the competition', but in May 1945 AAF suppport for the project was stopped and the Venus was 'closed out ' on 13 September 1945 (which it is assumed means the data of final abandonment).

This does seem to conform to what @Dynoman has posted in the PDF, though the PDF is more detailed in terms of the variations in gun and bomb-load. It is suprising with concern given to dive performance (both airspeed and mach number) that the aircraft was only stressed to +3.67/-1.5 g.

Steve Pace said:
Could it be that Bell Model 31 was in contention with the Curtiss XA-43 which became the Curtiss XF-87?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure, but it's possible that the designation was handed over to a project that was cancelled. That did happen with the XA-43/XF-87, and I think the initial XF9F-1 was a night-fighter (if I recall, it looked like an F7F with a double-pod in each wing replacing the R-2800).
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom