aviationweek.com
SoAnd now for something a little more relevant
KAI Plans Internal Weapons Bay For KF-21EX | Aviation Week Network
KAI has revealed that a future variant of the KF-21 fighter will feature an internal weapons bay capable of housing a 2,000-lb. guided bomb.
I thought that Block II was getting an AAM bay?
AFAIK Block I is air-superiority focused and Block II is more towards multirole. Both should lack internal bays.
While arguably true, the F-35 has a whole load of strings attached to it due to US foreign policy. Which makes it not viable for many countries, even countries not indirectly aligned with China or Russia.
KF-21 is not independent. It is subject to ITAR and US export restrictions for several critical systems including engines (GE F414), and electric power generation and environmental control systems (Collins Aerospace).
Correct - in the case of the F414 they're working on an indigenous engine.
The issue being that makeing ingenious jet engines is very hard, china has only recently managed it, japan is far farther along with more resources and its still very unlikely it will be read for there 6th gen fighter, just because south korea has a program dosnt mean the kf-21 is ever going to get those engines, if korea muddles through then those engines are more likely for there next gen aircraft.
Projected performance ceilings also play a role, China managed to produce lower power engines much earlier than their top of the line WS-15. The Koreans also have access to various US engines, I bet they are having a good look at them whenever possible and try to learn important lessons.
aviationweek.com
But they do - absolutely same niche, mostly similar capabilities. Rafale advantage is maturity, KF-21 - 25 years of progress.
I think it’s more accurate to say that Hanwha has done some conceptual design work on a « F414 like » engine. But it’s unclear if they have met the technological pre-requisites to actually build such an engine, as in fact they have been reaching out to more established engine makers like Safran in order to secure outside help.
I'd be shocked if they were not working on a home-grown engine (and the rest of the systems that are US-supplied).
That's the so-called KDE, also called dry Kaveri. And their mil-thrust rating is still not quite at the ballpark they want ot to be, althought it is indeed the closest it has ever been. More importantly, they still haven't been able to sort the reheat thrust issues, which hass been one of the main issues they've had with the Kaveri programme.
Not quite. Block 1 production contract is much cheaper than F-35 lot 15-17 flyaway.
I don't know how many times this has been iterated on this thread, but block II differs purely by software and operational flight clearance with different ordnances when compared to block 1. Almost no hardware change. It will be ready within just 2 years, by 2028.
Re-read the comment you are replying to. He is saying second half of 2030s. That is when the advanced variant of KF-21 is supposed to enter production and replace KF-16, alongside Korean SRAAM and BVRAAM. Research for domestic replacement of those possibly export-restricted systems and components are in the pipeline. The situation is much different compared to current baseline KF-21.
That's because you only consider Hanwha. Doosan is arguably much more experienced when it comes to designing proprietary gas turbines in Korea and they've entered aviation gas turbine business around 7 years ago. They are developing 10,000 lbf medium bypass turbofan right now for use in UAVs. As for the ongoing discussions with foreign manufacturers, they are looking for joint development and sales partners with international market in mind. They are not looking for a TAC. You seem to forget that it is undecided if this project will be joint development programme or not in the first place. They're just evaluating options and more importantly, the project lead is not decided either between Hanwha and Doosan.
So we both agree that no work has started on a Korean engine for KF-21. Because there were several posters here saying that “they are working on” an indigenous F414 alternative.
www.twz.com
Assuming that the limit on the bay capacity is depth, the difference between a 1000lb and 2000lb weapon is about 4".
Agreed. Scaling off the images the front of the F414 engine is level with end of the weapon bays. Passing the air intake over the deep weapons bays will be difficult without the aircraft becoming fatter. That's a complete redesign.
I was thinking raising the top of the bay ~2" and dropping the belly 2" if necessary.
Yes, that's a valid answer if a single 2000lb weapon is acceptable.
Granted. I wasn't sure which dimension was the limiting factor. I know that the F-22's bay is too shallow for 2000lb weapons but IIRC is long enough.
South Korea Has An Air-Launched Ballistic Missile Program
View: https://x.com/mason_8718/status/1955236168477577276
South Korea Has An Air-Launched Ballistic Missile Program
South Korea is also working on an air-launched standoff weapon designed for attacking enemy power grids. South Korea is also working on an air-launched standoff weapon to disable power grids, with the KF-21 fighter the likely launch platform for both weapons.
It is already a DAPA sanctioned programme. Hanwha is working on preliminary designs in the hopes of winning the bid to become design lead. Moreover, I don't know why you seem to be so hell bent on a comment which noted that it "could" become something, not "will". No one disagrees with you that things are not a given.
It's a model based on the internal CAD data of KAI so I'm pretty sure that they know better than any of us here.
Hence the reason they are trying to develop a turbofan engine that has same dimensions to the F414 with higher thrust. It's to offset additional drag created by airframe changes. There's no such engine in the market apart from upgrade proposals that never materialised.
Sorry but that's just bullshit.
The F414 has one of the highest thrust to weight ratios in the world. The only engines that beat it have a fraction of the time between overhauls. India has spent a decade trying to make an engine in the F414 size range and they can't even reach the thrust levels of the F414.
Korea will be no better than the Chinese and the Russians when it comes to making their own engines. Neither can reach 100kn of thrust with their latest RD-33 and WS-13 that are the same size of the F414. India has spent decades and can't even reliably hit 80% of the thrust of the F414.
My friendos please don't even compare India, who is buying K9s, to the frigging maker. As of now KC-X is in momentum and it would not suprise me that from the tidal waves comes a new host of aspiring SK turbojet engineers.
Korea should be reaching out to partner with Mexico. Mexico has a rapidly growing Aerospace industry and a cheaper Mk1 would likely be a good seller in the Americas, especially if they can go with a non-US engine.
Larin and South America aren't exactly big spenders for military hardware, the KF-21 is very much overkill for most nations. A far better option for Mexico and the region would be FA-50s.
WS-19 is meant to be in the 120kN class similar to the EJ-270/F-414 EPE proposals and still fit into the same footprint as WS-13/RD-33 series. It's definitely doable since WS-19 had its maiden flight in 2023.
It will reach that thrust and then blow up 30 seconds later. It is well known that engines can trade significant durability for a small thrust increase.
WS-19 is meant to be highly reliable while outputting wet thrust in that class. F414 is a product of the 90s, you have far underestimated turbofan development in the 30 odd years since then.
I don't think it's that challenging. The F414 burns 0.84lb/hr/lbf, so you're only talking ~5% fuel burn improvement. There's been quite an improvement in turbine engines since the F414 was designed. For example, the CFM56-2 (737 classic) burns 0.386-0.396lb/hr/lbf while the -7B (737NG burns 0.356-0.386lb/hr/lbf at takeoff. That's a ~10% improvement at the low range.
