UK-France Future Combat Air System (FCAS)

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Your words:
Apologies, I was led astray by the poster's misinformation
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And that's was not personal? The poster's...

As it seems also your are very selective in your apologies.
That and your denial is even more insulting to say the least.
 
@flateric :

Shouldn't both threads be merged?

It's clear that Dassault didn't discontinue their efforts with the end of the UK partnership. We have the same airframe, the same engine and... The same name.
On the other hand, UK's Tempest went from an airframe centric system (what Dassault's FCAS is) to a system of systems design effort (airframe was put on the last stage of the phased design).


This is why I had prioritized this thread for the FCAS news.
 
Euro Male risks a 100M€ cut in funding from the European Union as Airbus choose a US designed engine, built by Aviano, for powerplant. EU officiasl are complaining that ITAR potential restrictions would impact negatively sales prospects... Of the 7 billions euros program (note: Turkish TB-2 costing 5M$, that makes the entire funding cut roughly equal to the same quantity of TB-2 as EU's full 20 EuroMale order!*).


www.opex360.com

La Commission européenne pourrait retirer sa subvention au projet de drone MALE européen - Zone Militaire

Après des mois - voire des années - de négociations entre les industriels et les quatre États clients au sujet des spécifications et, surtout, des coûts,
www.opex360.com www.opex360.com

*welcome to AbsEUrdistan!
 
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Geo said:
Is it unrealistic to expect that France could stick to its traditions and, as a Plan B, independently develop a technologically pragmatic and cost-competitive stealth fighter—initially using technologies from the F5, but equipped with a larger radar and an even more powerful variant of the M88 T-REX—within the same weight class as the KF-21?
Paired with the Neuron 2.0, such a solution would be a rational one.
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The issue would be that a 5th Gen could have come already 10 years ago. It's pretty late for that, especially for a country that doesn't field any other low observable aircraft. So developing a 5th generation fighter in the 2030s may not be the smartest decision for a country like France, which all things considered still holds regional power ambitions.

For context, the capability France would establish in the 2030s already exists in the UK and Italy for a while, with Japan joining in and the US and China obviously being ahead in that regard (counting China here as ahead, due to Fujian being arguably the most capable carrier outside of the USN, the J-35s have yet to make their debut on it).

The idea in Europe was to sell Eurofighter and Rafale as capable alternatives to advanced F-15s and Flankers. Skipping the fifth generation due to budgetary reasons and the overall low militarization in Europe post cold war until pretty much now. Then the decision was made to band together (in two different programs respectively) and pool money and resources to then develop a sixth generation jet. And such an aircraft would grant France the only carrier capable 6th Gen outside of the US and China. A state of the art, cutting edge, networked stealth fighter with the associated subsystems and drone support of the next generation.

By comparison, something that the F-35C is doing since 2019, and the J-35 is about to do now, just isn't the leap in capability or achievement that one would expect from France in the 2030s. It's essentially admitting defeat, being now in the same class of countries like Turkey or South Korea, rather than a serious alternative to American or Chinese systems.
 
EmoBirb said:
The issue would be that a 5th Gen could have come already 10 years ago. It's pretty late for that, especially for a country that doesn't field any other low observable aircraft. So developing a 5th generation fighter in the 2030s may not be the smartest decision for a country like France, which all things considered still holds regional power ambitions.

For context, the capability France would establish in the 2030s already exists in the UK and Italy for a while, with Japan joining in and the US and China obviously being ahead in that regard (counting China here as ahead, due to Fujian being arguably the most capable carrier outside of the USN, the J-35s have yet to make their debut on it).

The idea in Europe was to sell Eurofighter and Rafale as capable alternatives to advanced F-15s and Flankers. Skipping the fifth generation due to budgetary reasons and the overall low militarization in Europe post cold war until pretty much now. Then the decision was made to band together (in two different programs respectively) and pool money and resources to then develop a sixth generation jet. And such an aircraft would grant France the only carrier capable 6th Gen outside of the US and China. A state of the art, cutting edge, networked stealth fighter with the associated subsystems and drone support of the next generation.

By comparison, something that the F-35C is doing since 2019, and the J-35 is about to do now, just isn't the leap in capability or achievement that one would expect from France in the 2030s. It's essentially admitting defeat, being now in the same class of countries like Turkey or South Korea, rather than a serious alternative to American or Chinese systems.
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Yes, EmoBirb, all of that is clear and accurate.
But what will the reality be for the Armée de l'Air and the Marine Nationale in the 2030s—and even the 2040s? That reality will be the Rafale F5.
An aircraft that, while unmistakably French and beautiful, hasn’t fundamentally changed in its design since 1991, and has hard limitations that are already incompatible with the demands of today’s battlefield.
And a bit of irony: won't it be considered a defeat that the French colonies in North Africa will already have experience with 5th generation fighters?
 
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