Author Topic: JH-XX ... China's stealthy fighter-bomber unveiled ! (Read 20642 times)

Deino · « **on:** June 08, 2011, 09:25:54 am »

I have to admit !!!

The JHX was expected - maybe not that soon ... but anyway, but now

!!!!!

JFC Fuller · « **Reply #1 on:** June 08, 2011, 09:34:34 am »

I think it needs some more unveiling, currently insufficiently unveiled.

Deino · « **Reply #2 on:** June 08, 2011, 09:39:09 am »

Quote from: sealordlawrence on June 08, 2011, 09:34:34 am

I think it needs some more unveiling, currently insufficiently unveiled.

Agreed ... but at least I don't think this is a PS-Fake !

sublight · « **Reply #3 on:** June 08, 2011, 09:41:52 am »

The Chinese decided the SPF J-20 thread had run its course and an exciting new thread was needed....

Grey Havoc · « **Reply #4 on:** June 08, 2011, 09:45:50 am »

Quote from: sublight on June 08, 2011, 09:41:52 am

The Chinese decided the SPF J-20 thread had run its course and an exciting new thread was needed....

How considerate of them.

sublight · « **Reply #5 on:** June 08, 2011, 11:38:48 am »

Question: If you RCS optimize the shape but construct the aircraft from Aluminum, will it still reasonably reduce the RCS? I see a lot of rivets in that photo....

Deino · « **Reply #6 on:** June 08, 2011, 12:31:51 pm »

Quote from: sublight on June 08, 2011, 11:38:48 am

Question: If you RCS optimize the shape but construct the aircraft from Aluminum, will it still reasonably reduce the RCS? I see a lot of rivets in that photo....

Hmmm ... here are many rivets too to see without the primer or paint !

IMO the biggest question now is: Is this thing real ?? ... especially since the photo was reportedly taken at Chengdu and not at Xian !

And then: Can China's aviation industry afford so many different projects in parallel ?

Deino

Grey Havoc · « **Reply #7 on:** June 08, 2011, 12:44:33 pm »

Quote from: Deino on June 08, 2011, 12:31:51 pm

Can China's aviation industry afford so many different projects in parallel ?

Deino

The politicians may think it can.

donnage99 · « **Reply #8 on:** June 08, 2011, 12:51:00 pm »

The cockpit doesn't look stealth optimized, but most likely due to it being prototype stage. What I'm thinking is that perhaps this is a competing design to the j-20.

Deino · « **Reply #9 on:** June 08, 2011, 01:38:21 pm »

Quote from: donnage99 on June 08, 2011, 12:51:00 pm

The cockpit doesn't look stealth optimized, but most likely due to it being prototype stage. What I'm thinking is that perhaps this is a competing design to the j-20.

I can't think of that ! Why should CAC develop to competing designs for the same requirement !??

Deino

donnage99 · « **Reply #10 on:** June 08, 2011, 01:41:32 pm »

Same way yf-23 and yf-22 were designed to compete for the same requirements?

Trident · « **Reply #11 on:** June 08, 2011, 01:57:26 pm »

Except the YF-22 and YF-23 were not built by the same company.

That said, I don't get the panic about rivets either, it was comical with the T-50 and remains so now. Unless the aircraft has been primered all over without regard to materials (occasionally seen on MiG-29s and the HAL Tejas), it does seem that it is primarily metal though. At least the parts that have been sufficiently unveiled, that is

chuck4 · « **Reply #12 on:** June 08, 2011, 02:26:42 pm »

You can tell it's fighter bomber from that? Is it a hologram? Maybe it's a twin seater J-20?

sferrin · « **Reply #13 on:** June 08, 2011, 03:12:55 pm »

Quote from: chuck4 on June 08, 2011, 02:26:42 pm

You can tell it's fighter bomber from that? Is it a hologram? Maybe it's a twin seater J-20?

This. (If it's not pshop.)

Trident · « **Reply #14 on:** June 08, 2011, 03:36:20 pm »

What little can be seen does match remarkably well a CAD image of an undeniably JH-7A-inspired design which has been floating around for some time. If it is indeed real, IMHO the only reason to believe it is anything else than that would be if the photo has actually been taken at CAC (rather than JH-7 manufacturer Xian) - a twin-seat J-20 would indeed be the most likely explanation in this case.

Foxglove · « **Reply #15 on:** June 08, 2011, 05:14:34 pm »

Now that's a real spy-movie suspense that's developing here, like with the J-20 up to a point. A big thank you to Deino for this spook pic-it really came out of the blue, even though I've heard the rumours of its development. Still, something tells me we are dealing with , again like with the J-20, a deliberate leak by the authorities. Call me stupid if, in the coming days/weeks we're not gonna see a steady trickle of more-and-more revealing shots.
Nonetheless, I'm already drooling for more on this one, plus the stealthified JF-17, J-19, J-16 and what have you. Even if they don't go into production, who cares, as long as they look cool?

frank · « **Reply #16 on:** June 08, 2011, 05:30:09 pm »

The F-117 was made from aluminum.

Quote from: sublight on June 08, 2011, 11:38:48 am

Question: If you RCS optimize the shape but construct the aircraft from Aluminum, will it still reasonably reduce the RCS? I see a lot of rivets in that photo....

frank · « **Reply #17 on:** June 08, 2011, 05:31:36 pm »

It seems to have a CGI look to it to me.

Quote from: Deino on June 08, 2011, 09:25:54 am

I have to admit !!!

The JXX was expected - maybe not that soon ... but anyway, but now !!!!!

windingroad · « **Reply #18 on:** June 08, 2011, 05:42:31 pm »

some more pics

LowObservable · « **Reply #19 on:** June 08, 2011, 06:14:35 pm »

As the earwig said.....

'ere we go again....

SOC · « **Reply #20 on:** June 08, 2011, 07:05:44 pm »

Quote from: Foxglove on June 08, 2011, 05:14:34 pm

the stealthified JF-17

Given that it sits at Chengdu (allegedly), can we be sure it isn't a twin-seat version of this?

Deino · « **Reply #21 on:** June 08, 2011, 11:54:26 pm »

Hmm ... could be ... but IMO not really, since it "seems" to be much larger than the FC-1/JF-17.

As such I tend to say - even at that early stage - this is the long-rumoured JH-7 successor ... but what makes me wonder is that this photo was taken at Chengdu and not in Xian.

Deino

Trident · « **Reply #22 on:** June 09, 2011, 12:02:00 am »

Quote from: SOC on June 08, 2011, 07:05:44 pm

Quote from: Foxglove on June 08, 2011, 05:14:34 pm
the stealthified JF-17

Given that it sits at Chengdu (allegedly), can we be sure it isn't a twin-seat version of this?

Good point, although the tail plane planform in these latest images (again assuming that they're real, obviously) more closely resembles the JH-7.

Deino · « **Reply #23 on:** June 09, 2011, 12:11:29 am »

Honestly, but I think the two photos showing it in the air are FAKES ! I can't prove it but if a first flight was done at CAC the news would be all ovber the net, additionally it looks too much like a "JH-7B" and not like a new design.

Quite interesting is the model above, since the guy on the left is General Zhang Wannian - Vice Chairman Central Military Commission (1998-2003).

Deino

Trident · « **Reply #24 on:** June 09, 2011, 12:24:39 am »

How certain are we that the picture was really taken in Chengdu?

Trident · « **Reply #25 on:** June 09, 2011, 12:38:06 am »

Another thought - if this really is a JH-7 follow-on it would appear to pour cold water on the notion that the J-20 is intended to be a fast fighter bomber rather than an air superiority platform.

windingroad · « **Reply #26 on:** June 09, 2011, 12:54:31 am »

i think XAC just focus on the intake\radar\engine, like the evolution from F18 C\D to E\F, they dont pursue a stealth aircraft,so there wont be weapon bay or V-tail

Trident · « **Reply #27 on:** June 09, 2011, 01:05:39 am »

Agree, assuming it is a close relative of the JH-7 it's going to be more like a "Super Leopard" or JH-7SE, rather than a true VLO design. Some LO shaping (inlets etc.) and serrated panels but no internal bays.

Harrier · « **Reply #28 on:** June 09, 2011, 02:35:59 am »

Quote from: Trident on June 09, 2011, 12:38:06 am

Another thought - if this really is a JH-7 follow-on it would appear to pour cold water on the notion that the J-20 is intended to be a fast fighter bomber rather than an air superiority platform.

Not necessarily. China sometimes develops two aircraft for apparently similar roles - J-10/FC-7, L-15/JL-9.

Also, J-20 may not be something they wish to export, and it does not look like it will land on a carrier (those dangling doors!). So maybe this 'JH-XX' does one of those things.

Time will tell, but I'll be amazed to see a Spey powered stealth bomber!

JFC Fuller · « **Reply #29 on:** June 09, 2011, 02:42:23 am »

Quote from: harrier on June 09, 2011, 02:35:59 am

J-10/FC-7

Eh?

PaulMM (Overscan) · « **Reply #30 on:** June 09, 2011, 02:48:35 am »

J-10/FC-1(JF-17)

JFC Fuller · « **Reply #31 on:** June 09, 2011, 02:59:45 am »

Quote from: overscan on June 09, 2011, 02:48:35 am

J-10/FC-17

Not that similar, and there seems to be very little evidence that the PLAAF/PLANAF have any intention of procuring the JF-17.

Harrier · « **Reply #32 on:** June 09, 2011, 06:27:11 am »

Well, typo (thanks Overscan - I was on a train!) aside, they are both single seat fighters. The point I was trying to make was that if this is a new attack plane it does not mean the J-20 isn't. What it is for (maybe export) may mean there can be two types for a similar role.

SOC · « **Reply #33 on:** June 09, 2011, 10:32:54 am »

Quote from: sealordlawrence on June 09, 2011, 02:59:45 am

Not that similar

Similar in concept, not necessarily design or execution. Single-engine multi-role J-7 type replacements, one for export and one for home use, although the J-10 is likely to be exported itself.

And if Chengdu is apparently at the forefront of China's LO aircraft development, maybe seeing this thing there (if it is in fact a JH-7 derivative) isn't out of the question. Think along the lines of Northrop's F-17 and McD-D's F-18 maybe. Could also be that Chengdu has the only facilities able to produce components to LO tolerances right now as well. With the size of the J-20 and the apparent size of its weapon bays, however, one has to wonder if this "JH-7LO" is yet another export-targeted platform, as the J-20 represents a far more survivable design with the probable range and internal volume to perform in the strike role.

Besides, with the J-20, producing a "JH-7LO" for home use is basically pointless. Hang a bunch of ordnance from it and you say goodbye to a lot of your LO benefits.

PaulMM (Overscan) · « **Reply #34 on:** June 09, 2011, 11:01:45 am »

Seems to have been a fake, guys.

Deino · « **Reply #35 on:** June 09, 2011, 12:35:41 pm »

What a shame on me !!!

Yes, reportedly an unknown CG-artist simply wanted to show his/her capabilities.

Sorry, and I have to admit ... shame on me.

Deino

fightingirish · « **Reply #36 on:** June 10, 2011, 01:30:32 am »

Deino,
I hope not, that you were allready writing an article for an aviation magazine?

Deino · « **Reply #37 on:** June 10, 2011, 03:25:11 am »

Quote from: fightingirish on June 10, 2011, 01:30:32 am

Deino,
I hope not, that you were allready writing an article for an aviation magazine?

Nope !

Deino · « **Reply #38 on:** June 15, 2011, 03:51:53 am »

http://the-diplomat.com/flashpoints-blog/2011/06/14/54faking-chinese-stealth-fighters/

Foxglove · « **Reply #39 on:** December 27, 2013, 05:11:35 pm »

What a letdown. Here's JH-7B, apparently no stealth features. Found this on Huitong's site.

sferrin · « **Reply #40 on:** December 27, 2013, 05:56:41 pm »

Larger intakes for more powerful engines maybe?

latenlazy · « **Reply #41 on:** December 28, 2013, 01:07:12 am »

Quote from: sferrin on December 27, 2013, 05:56:41 pm

Larger intakes for more powerful engines maybe?

Oh hey, didn't even notice! Good eyes.

I think the chatter seems to indicate that XAC opted for a less audacious upgrade than all the leaked mock-ups and digital models were indicating. Makes sense, considering how much they now have on their plate (and how unnecessary a stealthy JH-7 may end up being).

Deino · « **Reply #42 on:** December 28, 2013, 05:08:43 am »

Actually I'm more and more convinced that the JH-7B-project is indeed only an avionics-related upadate - and as such I'm almost sure that is is intented as a MLU - with nearly no external changes.
If You look there are already two prototypes - the yellow/green 821 and the one with only a new front section numbered 822 - and I assume one is a new built aircraft, whereas the other one could be a refurbished older JH-7A
Even that strange-looking bump on the tail is only due to an optical Illusion since the tail's leading edge has the same colour as the sky in the background.

Deino

Deino · « **Reply #43 on:** October 27, 2014, 12:58:09 am »

again the JH-7B ... but it seems as if there at least externaly no changes at all !?

quellish · « **Reply #44 on:** May 10, 2018, 07:01:27 pm »

Quote from: sublight on June 08, 2011, 11:38:48 am

Question: If you RCS optimize the shape but construct the aircraft from Aluminum, will it still reasonably reduce the RCS? I see a lot of rivets in that photo....

Have you ever heard of the F-117?