Why some people shouldn't be allowed to buy ships

Status
Not open for further replies.

pathology_doc

ACCESS: Top Secret
Joined
Jun 7, 2008
Messages
1,057
Reaction score
418
Ideologically related:

Amazon.com goes for jugular in FCC spat with SpaceX's Musk


"Whether it is launching satellites with unlicensed antennas, launching rockets without approval, building an unapproved launch tower, or re-opening a factory in violation of a shelter-in-place order, the conduct of SpaceX and other Musk-led companies makes their view plain: rules are for other people, and those who insist upon or even simply request compliance are deserving of derision and ad hominem attacks," Amazon wrote. "If the FCC regulated hypocrisy, SpaceX would be keeping the commission very busy."

Yes, SpaceX has played a little fast and loose with the regulators. And guess what: they are regularly launching reusable rockets to orbit. They will soon launch an all-civilian spacecraft into orbit. They might launch a Saturn-class reusable rocket within the next few years.

To compare with... Blue Origin, which plays within the regulatory system, has launched a tiny rocket a few dozen kilometers straight up. Their proposed orbital launcher appears to still be largely vaporware. And Boeing, which is deeply embedded within the regulations has spent dozens of billions and nearly two decades to launch *nothing*.

Yes, regulations are useful. But they quickly become little more than roadblocks to progress and sources of monumental graft. The hard-core Libertarians are naive utopians. Those who support regulations without restraint, however, would see civilization stagnate and then die. The sweet spot of growth and progress is in between, and rather closer to the Libertarian side.
SF author Stephen Baxter went at the consequences of bureaucracy and regulation hard in his novel "Time". He clearly didn't like what NASA had become since 1969, and decided to take that bureaucratic evolution to its logical limit. Not only do they object to our hero building and launching his own ship, they launch military action to kill him and his wife.
 

Conspirator

ACCESS: You don't have clearance to know......
Joined
Jan 14, 2021
Messages
168
Reaction score
49
If you can't comprehend that someone can be both self reliant and willing and perhaps even eager to cooperate...
Problem is, that not all people have such combination. Self-reliant people often aren't good in cooperation.

And people who are woefully bad at self-reliance are *also* often bad at cooperation. Humans are buggy. That's why I shake my head at people who point and laugh at failed libertarian enterprises that cost willing participants their money, yet ignore collectivist enterprises that lead to famine and deaths measured in the millions.
and you act as if you are not human.... you act as if you are another breed... you are no different from everyone else on this rock. life sucks. but who said it was fair, but its what you make of it. ill be the first to admit that people (including me) are stupid sometimes. its stupid people that decide to do this without proper safety training or certifications i understand that but dont think its everyone else but you
 

sferrin

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
14,446
Reaction score
3,294
If you can't comprehend that someone can be both self reliant and willing and perhaps even eager to cooperate...
Problem is, that not all people have such combination. Self-reliant people often aren't good in cooperation.

And people who are woefully bad at self-reliance are *also* often bad at cooperation. Humans are buggy. That's why I shake my head at people who point and laugh at failed libertarian enterprises that cost willing participants their money, yet ignore collectivist enterprises that lead to famine and deaths measured in the millions.
and you act as if you are not human.... you act as if you are another breed... you are no different from everyone else on this rock. life sucks. but who said it was fair, but its what you make of it. ill be the first to admit that people (including me) are stupid sometimes. its stupid people that decide to do this without proper safety training or certifications i understand that but dont think its everyone else but you
There's a difference between the kind of stupidity that earns one a Darwin Award and the kind that leads to millions of deaths. Too many are ignorant of both.
 

Conspirator

ACCESS: You don't have clearance to know......
Joined
Jan 14, 2021
Messages
168
Reaction score
49
If you can't comprehend that someone can be both self reliant and willing and perhaps even eager to cooperate...
Problem is, that not all people have such combination. Self-reliant people often aren't good in cooperation.

And people who are woefully bad at self-reliance are *also* often bad at cooperation. Humans are buggy. That's why I shake my head at people who point and laugh at failed libertarian enterprises that cost willing participants their money, yet ignore collectivist enterprises that lead to famine and deaths measured in the millions.
and you act as if you are not human.... you act as if you are another breed... you are no different from everyone else on this rock. life sucks. but who said it was fair, but its what you make of it. ill be the first to admit that people (including me) are stupid sometimes. its stupid people that decide to do this without proper safety training or certifications i understand that but dont think its everyone else but you
There's a difference between the kind of stupidity that earns one a Darwin Award and the kind that leads to millions of deaths. Too many are ignorant of both.
theres a fine line between courage and stupidity. in some peoples minds that line is either blurred or nonexistent
 

Conspirator

ACCESS: You don't have clearance to know......
Joined
Jan 14, 2021
Messages
168
Reaction score
49
im just speaking facts because from what i have seen. he has a history of doing that and its not everyone else but you when your speaking about the human population as a whole. but seriously there are people that just dont care about the safety of themselves or the crew on board so it would be wise to implement a system of certifications and possibly..... monthly operation checks? like pilots? we have the freedom of purchasing vessels and operating them but where when and how is up to you and the government
 

dannydale

ACCESS: Top Secret
Joined
May 13, 2007
Messages
513
Reaction score
339
Thread being atomized by moderation... 3... 2... 1...
Yup, it's a dumpster fire. Worst part is everyone here is at least both slightly right and slightly wrong, myself included.
 

Orionblamblam

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
8,624
Reaction score
2,833
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
yet ignore collectivist enterprises that lead to famine and deaths measured in the millions.

I'm afraid I have some bad news about Lloyd's.

Not sure I catch your meaning. For much of it's history Lloyd's operated under the British pre-capitalist mercantilist system, which was just socialism for royalty; since then, I'm unaware of Lloy'd carrying out genocides.
 

Justo Miranda

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2007
Messages
5,072
Reaction score
4,184
Website
www.amazon.com
If you can't comprehend that someone can be both self reliant and willing and perhaps even eager to cooperate...
Problem is, that not all people have such combination. Self-reliant people often aren't good in cooperation.

And people who are woefully bad at self-reliance are *also* often bad at cooperation. Humans are buggy. That's why I shake my head at people who point and laugh at failed libertarian enterprises that cost willing participants their money, yet ignore collectivist enterprises that lead to famine and deaths measured in the millions.
Roman engineers used donkeys to identify the best routes that crossed the mountains, the instinct of the animal always chose the easiest path. Humanity does not possess that ability and must prove everything, the technique of trial and error produces all kinds of injustices, crimes and famine, but also produces some Newton from time to time.
 

Justo Miranda

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2007
Messages
5,072
Reaction score
4,184
Website
www.amazon.com
If you can't comprehend that someone can be both self reliant and willing and perhaps even eager to cooperate...
Problem is, that not all people have such combination. Self-reliant people often aren't good in cooperation.

And people who are woefully bad at self-reliance are *also* often bad at cooperation. Humans are buggy. That's why I shake my head at people who point and laugh at failed libertarian enterprises that cost willing participants their money, yet ignore collectivist enterprises that lead to famine and deaths measured in the millions.
and you act as if you are not human.... you act as if you are another breed... you are no different from everyone else on this rock. life sucks. but who said it was fair, but its what you make of it. ill be the first to admit that people (including me) are stupid sometimes. its stupid people that decide to do this without proper safety training or certifications i understand that but dont think its everyone else but you
There's a difference between the kind of stupidity that earns one a Darwin Award and the kind that leads to millions of deaths. Too many are ignorant of both.
In my opinion stupidity is a universal constant, what makes it more or less dangerous is the opportunity to access the means of destruction, so our survival will depend more and more on the efficient design of security systems. The problem is that these systems curtail civil liberties and rights. At some point we will have to choose.
 

Orionblamblam

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
8,624
Reaction score
2,833
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
In my opinion stupidity is a universal constant, what makes it more or less dangerous is the opportunity to access the means of destruction, so our survival will depend more and more on the efficient design of security systems. The problem is that these systems curtail civil liberties and rights. At some point we will have to choose.

Just wait until an entire genetics lab can be compressed to the size and cost of a modern home 3D printer. Any jackhole with a few grand and access to dark websites with the genetic codes for smallpox, anthrax, Andromeda, creeping crud, COVID 24 and supercooties will be able to spit out a few vials of the next great pandemic.

At that point, the various goofball utopian Libertarian space colonies will be the only remaining sources of human life in the universe, as the government space colonies will still be in the environmental impact statement stages.
 

Zoo Tycoon

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
May 27, 2008
Messages
629
Reaction score
990
Just wait until an entire genetics lab can be compressed to the size and cost of a modern home 3D printer. Any jackhole with a few grand and access to dark websites with the genetic codes for smallpox, anthrax, Andromeda, creeping crud, COVID 24 and supercooties will be able to spit out a few vials of the next great pandemic.

The ultra scary truth is that something very close to this has already been done;-

 

Archibald

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2006
Messages
6,610
Reaction score
5,326
Plus the dutch ar$ehole scientists that in 2012 created the most possible deadly flu virus. Even their colleagues were apalled...
 

Archibald

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2006
Messages
6,610
Reaction score
5,326
Ideologically related:

Amazon.com goes for jugular in FCC spat with SpaceX's Musk


"Whether it is launching satellites with unlicensed antennas, launching rockets without approval, building an unapproved launch tower, or re-opening a factory in violation of a shelter-in-place order, the conduct of SpaceX and other Musk-led companies makes their view plain: rules are for other people, and those who insist upon or even simply request compliance are deserving of derision and ad hominem attacks," Amazon wrote. "If the FCC regulated hypocrisy, SpaceX would be keeping the commission very busy."

Yes, SpaceX has played a little fast and loose with the regulators. And guess what: they are regularly launching reusable rockets to orbit. They will soon launch an all-civilian spacecraft into orbit. They might launch a Saturn-class reusable rocket within the next few years.

To compare with... Blue Origin, which plays within the regulatory system, has launched a tiny rocket a few dozen kilometers straight up. Their proposed orbital launcher appears to still be largely vaporware. And Boeing, which is deeply embedded within the regulations has spent dozens of billions and nearly two decades to launch *nothing*.

Yes, regulations are useful. But they quickly become little more than roadblocks to progress and sources of monumental graft. The hard-core Libertarians are naive utopians. Those who support regulations without restraint, however, would see civilization stagnate and then die. The sweet spot of growth and progress is in between, and rather closer to the Libertarian side.
SF author Stephen Baxter went at the consequences of bureaucracy and regulation hard in his novel "Time". He clearly didn't like what NASA had become since 1969, and decided to take that bureaucratic evolution to its logical limit. Not only do they object to our hero building and launching his own ship, they launch military action to kill him and his wife.

Baxter may be a great sci-fi author but he had a huge axe to grin against NASA. He can be a whinner and a real PITA with that recuring theme in his novels.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top